The "Official" Defense Fund

It's back!

Hey everyone,

Way back when we had started to put together some pledges for a legal fund. Well, there is now an ongoing collection for just what was envisioned with this. Please know that the benefactor of these funds has pledged to reimburse any legal expenses dispersed to him plus more if the caseis victorious. Any proceeds given back will be used in the unfortunate event that another Michigan citizen has their rights violated in such an extreme manner. This is a tremoundous opportunity, paid for in human suffering, made right by your contributions and the legal system. As such, I now call on all who pledged, if you are able please make your donations today!

http://www.michiganopencarry.org/pages/jeff-haman-legal-fund

Another donation thread here: http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?79158-Hamaneggs-case-fund-begins.

what happn

what happen to this defense fund.

rvd4now said:

what happen to this defense fund.

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I believe a legal fund for that very purpose will soon be a reality.The Fetters and hamaneggs funds kicked things off,and provided much needed experience that will be used in the near future. If anyone needs help,we can do it all over again, minus prior pitfalls!CARRY ON!

I will pledge $100

With Jeff's battle being over and settled, I'd just like to remind everyone that currently MOC is fighting a very serious court case in Lansing as we speak. We've already lost round one and are now in appeals court which directly sets precedent throughout the state. If we lose this second round, open carry is GONE in Michigan and will be illegal (brandishing). Having legal funds is great for individuals, but let's not lose sight of the big picture here. There are still a vast majority of court costs we've yet to pay, especially if we end up taking this to the Supreme Court. Though not all of you are MOC members, I encourage you all to donate what you can to keep the right to open carry in Michigan. Donations can be made here or at our website Michigan Open Carry to the right of the screen, or can be made directly here: Click link to Donate. If you choose to donate, please put "Legal Fund" in the purpose box so we know where to distribute the funds.

malignity said:

With Jeff's battle being over and settled, I'd just like to remind everyone that currently MOC is fighting a very serious court case in Lansing as we speak. We've already lost round one and are now in appeals court which directly sets precedent throughout the state. If we lose this second round, open carry is GONE in Michigan and will be illegal (brandishing). Having legal funds is great for individuals, but let's not lose sight of the big picture here. There are still a vast majority of court costs we've yet to pay, especially if we end up taking this to the Supreme Court. Though not all of you are MOC members, I encourage you all to donate what you can to keep the right to open carry in Michigan. Donations can be made here or at our website Michigan Open Carry to the right of the screen, or can be made directly here: Click link to Donate. If you choose to donate, please put "Legal Fund" in the purpose box so we know where to distribute the funds.

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When did Jeff's case get settled?

about 6 months ago I went to my bank and started a automatic weekly withdraw to the CADL vs MOC defense fund.

The amount is enough I don't notice it and will not make my account overdrawn if i forget about it, and over time it will add up to a sizable sum to help the cause

I urge everybody who wants to help do the same thing.

If 100 members every week gave the price of a pack of cigarettes, in short order we would have a fully funded defense fund in place to help fight against those who want to keep chipping away our 2A rights



Think about it, if you really care about your 2A rights, you need to do more than type at the keyboard

put your money where your mouth is!!!! and get on board to support the defense fund today!!!!

malignity said:

With Jeff's battle being over and settled, I'd just like to remind everyone that currently MOC is fighting a very serious court case in Lansing as we speak. We've already lost round one and are now in appeals court which directly sets precedent throughout the state. If we lose this second round, open carry is GONE in Michigan and will be illegal (brandishing). Having legal funds is great for individuals, but let's not lose sight of the big picture here. There are still a vast majority of court costs we've yet to pay, especially if we end up taking this to the Supreme Court. Though not all of you are MOC members, I encourage you all to donate what you can to keep the right to open carry in Michigan. Donations can be made here or at our website Michigan Open Carry to the right of the screen, or can be made directly here: Click link to Donate. If you choose to donate, please put "Legal Fund" in the purpose box so we know where to distribute the funds.

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What was the outcome of Jeff's case? How much did he win?

Venator said:

When did Jeff's case get settled?

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good question!!!

I could have sworn I had heard he settled out of court. I could be mistaken. Regardless, our case is still ongoing, and my post was just a reminder of that. Don't lose sight of the big picture.

malignity said:

I could have sworn I had heard he settled out of court. I could be mistaken. Regardless, our case is still ongoing, and my post was just a reminder of that. Don't lose sight of the big picture.

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If that is so.........considering members of MOC paid for his defense, we should have been informed if that was the case

and if he did settle out of court

(a) that sure was fast
(b) since his defense was paid for by MOC members I sure hope he did not sign a confidentially agreement!
that would really anger some!!!:banghead:

malignity said:

I could have sworn I had heard he settled out of court. I could be mistaken. Regardless, our case is still ongoing, and my post was just a reminder of that. Don't lose sight of the big picture.

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that is patently false. the most recent activity on the case was a "notice of case management and scheduling conference" this was filed on 10/7
see attached

I misspoke and got my cases mixed up. I'm not a big follower of legal battles; and I'm actually thinking of another case. I'd edit my original post, but its spiraled now and those in this thread are clearly intent on simply proving me wrong, which you've all done an amazing job of. The point is completely being missed about how we need to look at the big picture.

Take that how you will guys. There's clearly more at stake than fine details here. Though helping individuals in cases is always a good thing so they can collect on the damages done to them, we may ALL lose the right to OC all together if we don't band together and get on the same boat. That's the point I'm trying to make, and it really can't be spelled out any more directly than that.

Onnie said:

about 6 months ago I went to my bank and started a automatic weekly withdraw to the CADL vs MOC defense fund.

The amount is enough I don't notice it and will not make my account overdrawn if i forget about it, and over time it will add up to a sizable sum to help the cause

I urge everybody who wants to help do the same thing.

If 100 members every week gave the price of a pack of cigarettes, in short order we would have a fully funded defense fund in place to help fight against those who want to keep chipping away our 2A rights



Think about it, if you really care about your 2A rights, you need to do more than type at the keyboard

put your money where your mouth is!!!! and get on board to support the defense fund today!!!!

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Onnie, we appreciate it, sincerely. Even at a deal, a court case at this level is hardly free. I think I can speak for everyone when I say that from the money aspect of things, we hope this appeal settles it. If it doesn't, we'll clearly do what we need to do in order to win at the Supreme Court level, however I'm sure everyone would much rather be throwing that extra little bit aside for a new AR-15 or Colt 1911 or something.

Wait, breath, now count to ten.....

malignity said:

I misspoke and got my cases mixed up. I'm not a big follower of legal battles; and I'm actually thinking of another case. I'd edit my original post, but its spiraled now and those in this thread are clearly intent on simply proving me wrong, which you've all done an amazing job of. The point is completely being missed about how we need to look at the big picture.

Take that how you will guys. There's clearly more at stake than fine details here. Though helping individuals in cases is always a good thing so they can collect on the damages done to them, we may ALL lose the right to OC all together if we don't band together and get on the same boat. That's the point I'm trying to make, and it really can't be spelled out any more directly than that.

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Jon - no one that I can see is trying to prove you wrong. I think as a leader of MOC (yes you are, as you have one of the four votes on the board) they expect you to know what you are talking about. I don't think this or any of the previous posts were ill willed at all. Everyone makes mistakes, no biggie sir

Keep in mind, all of the Jeff Haman stuff happened long before I was on the board and ALL of the decisions were made before I was a board member. I know very little about it other than what I've been told. I'm more focused on the big case. For some reason, I got this case mixed up with another case on the west side of the state. I left the computer and realized I screwed up, and planned to edit the post by the time I got to my mother in law's. By the time I got there, people tore it apart and went ape chit. I typically don't follow anyone's court cases unless they get to appellate level, as we've all learned that at district level, judges can make up the rules as they go. I now know why the board (jokingly) advised me not to post so much on forums like this. Screw up, even a bit, and you're going to look bad unless you can catch your mistake immediately.

No worries

malignity said:

Keep in mind, all of the Jeff Haman stuff happened long before I was on the board and ALL of the decisions were made before I was a board member. I know very little about it other than what I've been told. I'm more focused on the big case. For some reason, I got this case mixed up with another case on the west side of the state. I left the computer and realized I screwed up, and planned to edit the post by the time I got to my mother in law's. By the time I got there, people tore it apart and went ape chit. I typically don't follow anyone's court cases unless they get to appellate level, as we've all learned that at district level, judges can make up the rules as they go. I now know why the board (jokingly) advised me not to post so much on forums like this. Screw up, even a bit, and you're going to look bad unless you can catch your mistake immediately.

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I don't see where anyone went ape chit or Tore you apart.

As a board member one would assume you know what is going on behind the scenes. And yes posting when one is a board member is full of political pitfalls. Ain't it a bitch.

malignity said:

Onnie, we appreciate it, sincerely. Even at a deal, a court case at this level is hardly free. I think I can speak for everyone when I say that from the money aspect of things, we hope this appeal settles it. If it doesn't, we'll clearly do what we need to do in order to win at the Supreme Court level, however I'm sure everyone would much rather be throwing that extra little bit aside for a new AR-15 or Colt 1911 or something.

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5 bucks a week wont break anyone's bank. Give up a pack a week of cancer sticks, a couple Mt Dews or in my case a case of donuts and send it in to MOC.

Im not interested in a AR 15 nor a Colt 1911, to expensive.....ask G9OS, I like Turkey!!!!

My point is we can't fight future battles if we all don't pitch in a few bucks each month for the fight!

This appeal MAY settle CADL Vs MOC it wont settle the next organization with deep pockets who wants to limit or even take away our 2A rights.

had we not had some money to fight CADL at the first 2 levels of this court battle, Ocing MAY have been ruled by the Lansing Judge brandishing as CADL wanted her to.............

Lets not forget we were only 1 vote away, 5 to 4, from loosing a lot of 2a rights in one of the last SCOTUS decisions on the DC handgun band

I don't think a lot of people really realize how close we were.........I did not until I read the decision

Justice Stephen Breyer wrote "In my view, there simply is no untouchable constitutional right guaranteed by the Second Amendment to keep loaded handguns in the house in crime-ridden urban areas."

If we dont fight when the fight comes to us, we will loose, and we need a legal fund, fully funded to fight a good fight.