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Thread: 45 day limit on CPL application

  1. #1
    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    I am pretty ticked off right now. I called the PA's office today and my CPL application will not be reviewed again until the October (13) gun board meeting. My application has been reviewed and no decision made at the last two meetings (August and September).

    Obviously, this means that Manistee County is blatantly ignoring the 45 day rule. When I made mention of this to the clerk on the phone she said, "I am sure Mr. Ford is well aware of what the law says."

    Also, I was not allowed to attend the September meeting as the clerk stated that it was not open to the public. After reviewing the law for myself, I have verified that the meetings are supposed to be open to the public.

    I am fed up. Who do I need to contact regarding this illegal activity?
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
    -Public Service Professional - I've done it all: LEO, FF, and EMT
    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

  2. #2
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Springfield Smitty wrote:
    I am pretty ticked off right now. I called the PA's office today and my CPL application will not be reviewed again until the October (13) gun board meeting. My application has been reviewed and no decision made at the last two meetings (August and September).

    Obviously, this means that Manistee County is blatantly ignoring the 45 day rule. When I made mention of this to the clerk on the phone she said, "I am sure Mr. Ford is well aware of what the law says."

    Also, I was not allowed to attend the September meeting as the clerk stated that it was not open to the public. After reviewing the law for myself, I have verified that the meetings are supposed to be open to the public.

    I am fed up. Who do I need to contact regarding this illegal activity?
    Wow, you are being jerked around. All gun board meetings are open to the public. they are in violation of the open meetings act. Contact the AG's office and file a complaint. They have to issue a temp CPL after 45 days from the time they get the ok from the FBI.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    I bet you didn't actually talk to the clerk proper. More likely one of the secretaries handling the paperwork. They have to publish when and where the meetings are. I would just show up.

    Ingham county made some remarks about not getting to mine for 3-4 months. I pointed out teh 45 days and let them know I expected to have it in hand no later than that. It was issued 14 days later.

    Find out who the MSP rep is for that board and try to make contact with them before going in.



    Good luck

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    Regular Member malignity's Avatar
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    I waited 96 days to get mine. I demanded it sooner, and got a complete run-around for almost two weeks before I gave up. Unless you're going to sue, they won't do anything, coming from my experience.
    All opinions posted on opencarry.org are my own, and do not necessarily reflect the views of opencarry.org or Michigan Open Carry Inc.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    lechwe wrote:
    I bet you didn't actually talk to the clerk proper. More likely one of the secretaries handling the paperwork. They have to publish when and where the meetings are. I would just show up.

    Ingham county made some remarks about not getting to mine for 3-4 months. I pointed out teh 45 days and let them know I expected to have it in hand no later than that. It was issued 14 days later.

    Find out who the MSP rep is for that board and try to make contact with them before going in.



    Good luck
    I did, in fact, speak with the clerk. I have dealt with the office before in talking to the PA about my CPL classes (I am an NRA instructor). I know when and where the meetings are. They have them on the second Tuesday of every month behind locked doors at the PA's office. I did show up and was denied the opportunity to enter.

    The MSP rep (from what I hear) is the main one holding it up. Our county is very corrupt from what I understand from others who have lived here much longer than myself. I even talked to an attorney about it and he said that it would be difficult to get the circuit court judge to do anything about itin this county.
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
    -Public Service Professional - I've done it all: LEO, FF, and EMT
    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

  6. #6
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Springfield Smitty wrote:
    lechwe wrote:
    I bet you didn't actually talk to the clerk proper. More likely one of the secretaries handling the paperwork. They have to publish when and where the meetings are. I would just show up.

    Ingham county made some remarks about not getting to mine for 3-4 months. I pointed out teh 45 days and let them know I expected to have it in hand no later than that. It was issued 14 days later.

    Find out who the MSP rep is for that board and try to make contact with them before going in.



    Good luck
    I did, in fact, speak with the clerk. I have dealt with the office before in talking to the PA about my CPL classes (I am an NRA instructor). I know when and where the meetings are. They have them on the second Tuesday of every month behind locked doors at the PA's office. I did show up and was denied the opportunity to enter.

    The MSP rep (from what I hear) is the main one holding it up. Our county is very corrupt from what I understand from others who have lived here much longer than myself. I even talked to an attorney about it and he said that it would be difficult to get the circuit court judge to do anything about itin this county.

    Contact the AG's office and go to the press, they CAN NOT legally deny anyone from these meetings. Corrupt or not get the law and the press after them. One person can make a difference.

    As a last resort look into a law suit. If you have the gumption you might insist on entering the meeting and be arrested if need be. This corruption can not stand.

    Taxwhat has dealt with these same issues in Monroe County, he has the experience to help you out. PM him for his phone number.

    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  7. #7
    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    After speaking with the AG's office, I have received no help. The gentleman I spoke with said, "I am not sure what the law is. You should contact your city council member."

    Another question that I have is about the CEZ's. Are firearms allowed in the same building where a court is located?

    The gun board meets in the PA's office, which is behind a locked door in the same building as the court rooms. So, it would beimpossible for me to "barge" into the meeting without doing damage to gov't property.

    I will now be contacting the media in T.C. to see if they will do any reporting on the issue.
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
    -Public Service Professional - I've done it all: LEO, FF, and EMT
    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

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    That really sucks. I owuld say unless you have the means to push a law suite you'll have to sit it out. I hate that it takes so much of our money to get the law followed. Just doesn't make sense.

    Good luck. Keep us posted on how it goes.

  9. #9
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    Springfield Smitty wrote:
    After speaking with the AG's office, I have received no help. The gentleman I spoke with said, "I am not sure what the law is. You should contact your city council member."

    Another question that I have is about the CEZ's. Are firearms allowed in the same building where a court is located?

    The gun board meets in the PA's office, which is behind a locked door in the same building as the court rooms. So, it would beimpossible for me to "barge" into the meeting without doing damage to gov't property.

    I will now be contacting the media in T.C. to see if they will do any reporting on the issue.
    Call me tonight if you want. I PMed you my number.

    Most likely you would have to go to the meeting unarmed if they ban firearms from the courthouse. But they can't stop you from going to the meeting. The only time they can go behind close doors is if they are talking to an applicant in person about something confidential. Once they are done talking wit that person the public meeting starts again. I believe by law they can't even whisper to each other during a meeting while on the Board.

    Send the AG this. http://www.legislature.mi.gov/docume...tgsFreedom.pdf
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  10. #10
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Venator wrote:
    Springfield Smitty wrote:
    After speaking with the AG's office, I have received no help. The gentleman I spoke with said, "I am not sure what the law is. You should contact your city council member."

    Another question that I have is about the CEZ's. Are firearms allowed in the same building where a court is located?

    The gun board meets in the PA's office, which is behind a locked door in the same building as the court rooms. So, it would beimpossible for me to "barge" into the meeting without doing damage to gov't property.

    I will now be contacting the media in T.C. to see if they will do any reporting on the issue.
    Call me tonight if you want. I PMed you my number.

    Most likely you would have to go to the meeting unarmed if they ban firearms from the courthouse. But they can't stop you from going to the meeting. The only time they can go behind close doors is if they are talking to an applicant in person about something confidential. Once they are done talking wit that person the public meeting starts again. I believe by law they can't even whisper to each other during a meeting while on the Board.

    Send the AG this. http://www.legislature.mi.gov/docume...tgsFreedom.pdf
    Venator is correct... meetings are public unless talking to a specific person regarding confidential information. Call him.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  11. #11
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    My gun board meeting was behind closed (not sure if they were locked) doors, but I also had to talk to them about my OC incident in Jackson.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    One of the news anchors from TV 7&4 in T.C. seems to be interested. We have exchanged a couple of E-mails within the last few hours. Let's hope he takes it on...
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
    -Public Service Professional - I've done it all: LEO, FF, and EMT
    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

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    Springfield Smitty wrote:
    One of the news anchors from TV 7&4 in T.C. seems to be interested. We have exchanged a couple of E-mails within the last few hours. Let's hope he takes it on...
    Awesome. Nice work.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    Just got a call from the county clerk's office. My CPL application was approved at a "special gun board" meeting and will be available sometime next week. She said I would get a letterwhen it was ready. I guess our local news anchor stirred the waters enough, because the PA's office told me that there would be no "special meeting."
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
    -Public Service Professional - I've done it all: LEO, FF, and EMT
    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

  15. #15
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Springfield Smitty wrote:
    Just got a call from the county clerk's office. My CPL application was approved at a "special gun board" meeting and will be available sometime next week. She said I would get a letterwhen it was ready. I guess our local news anchor stirred the waters enough, because the PA's office told me that there would be no "special meeting."
    But if they are still locking out the meetings to the public the County has gained nothing. Are the meetings still closed to the public?

    I did talk to a state Representative about this while I was at the Capitol. I wonder if he contacted anyone.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    I am not sure about this. I will by no means give up on the Open Meeting issue!! I will continue to follow up on it, but will need to find someone else to attempt to attend the meeting as I have started school and am now unavailable on Tuesdays.
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
    -Public Service Professional - I've done it all: LEO, FF, and EMT
    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

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