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VA Man Shoots and Kills Burglar

HankT

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gThis is the first report of a shooting/death incident that took place last night around 11:30 PM. Details are very sketchy and incomplete. But we do know that:

  • Alex Richard Totherow, a neighbor, is dead by gunshot wound.
  • Totherow's neighbor, Mr. X., shot him for being in Mr. X's living room.
That's about it, so far. Too early to tell if Mr. X was a valiant protector of his wife and child or a nervous Nellie quick shot artist.

We can't even tell if Totherow had a weapon ("He could have had a knife!," some are already exclaiming...).

If no weapon, then....uhm....could it be? Yes, it could very well be that the world-famousHankT's Postulateof Civilian Self-Defense (HPCSD) will come into play. Here it is for those who mayhave somehow forgotten it:


It is a bad strategy to shoot an unarmed person.


Hmmm, I wonder where the late Mr. Totherow was actually shot?

Developing...






Burglar Shot and Killed
09/19/09 3:47 pm


Danville - Friday just before 11:30 p.m., Danville Police (web) received a call and responded to an apartment complex at 427 Wooding Avenue for burglary in progress. When officers arrived, they found a man with a gun shoot wound lying in a grassy area near the building. He was transported to Danville Regional Medical Center where he was pronounced dead Saturday at 12:15 a.m. A male, who was occupying a unit in the apartment, says he, his 6-month-old child, and his girlfriend were asleep when he was awakened by the sound of breaking glass. He picked up his firearm, went into the living room area and saw an intruder whom he identified as his next door neighbor, Alex Richard Totherow, 42. The male occupant and Totherow ran from the apartment. That is when the resident fired a shot, which struck Totherow. The case is currently under investigation. Anyone with information is asked to call Danville Crimestoppers.


http://www.wset.com/news/stories/0909/660794.html
 

Evil Ernie

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Taking from what was said in the article, Mr Badguy was shot while in retreat and outside of the apartment. Bad mojo there...unless he had the 6 mo old in his hands and trying to get away, thats not sounding like a clean defensiveshoot.
 

KansasMustang

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Does NOT look good, just me sayin' it. I agree with Mr.Mitch but, in truth, as we all know, the perp had withdrawn therefore the threat was no longer there. 911 should have been the most aggressive action taken, along with guarding the breeched entry. But, I wasn't there.
 

Deanimator

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HankT wrote:
It is a bad strategy to shoot an unarmed person.
In Ohio, it's a bad strategy to be inside somebody else's home without their permission, armed or otherwise, when they're there. You're considered to be a threat to life and limb. They have no duty to incur ANY risk to see if you're armed or not.

If you ignore that advice and the occupant shoots you, he'll have the benefit of the doubt, and you'll still be shot.

If I find you in my home and you do ANYTHING besides run away or stand perfectly still, you're probably going to get shot. I'll almost certainly walk. You will have no cause of action against me.

Moral of the story: Don't break into occupied dwellings. It's dangerous.
 

HankT

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Deanimator wrote:
HankT wrote:
It is a bad strategy to shoot an unarmed person.
In Ohio, it's a bad strategy to be inside somebody else's home without their permission, armed or otherwise, when they're there. You're considered to be a threat to life and limb. They have no duty to incur ANY risk to see if you're armed or not.

If you ignore that advice and the occupant shoots you, he'll have the benefit of the doubt, and you'll still be shot.

If I find you in my home and you do ANYTHING besides run away or stand perfectly still, you're probably going to get shot. I'll almost certainly walk. You will have no cause of action against me.

Moral of the story: Don't break into occupied dwellings. It's dangerous.


D, for this discussion, I'll agree with your contention that you'd "walk." Uh, excuse me, I just noticed. You didn't say that you would "walk." You said that you would "almost certainly walk."

Aha! Yet another confirmation of HankT's Postulateof Civilian Self-Defense (HPCSD) !!

It's truly amazing how robust and comprehensive the HPCSD is...it always applies!

Thank you, D.

P.S. Of course, your point about it being a bad strategy to be inside someone else's house without permission is a very good one. You should make your own postulate on that, D. And, you will find, after you think about it some more .... that both my postulate and yours are not contradictories. They would not even be contraries. They could both be true....
 

MSC 45ACP

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Texas has a law about "Criminal Mischief at night"... Justifiable to shoot them if they're on your property, even if they're outside your dwelling, just messing with your PROPERTY. It goes back to the days of cattle and horse thieves... Still on the books, Still enforced, still happens...
 

nobucks

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It didn't say if the neighbor/burglar was armed or not.

What it did suggest and which would be a postulate I would agree with, is that it's a bad idea to shoot a fleeing burglar in the back.

Still, not enough details, though. It only says they both left the apartment and one was shot.
 

bohdi

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I agree with Hank. It is a bad idea to shoot a person who has no arms. You won't get much sympathy from a jury for shooting a handicapped person.

However, if the person does have arms and they don't have a weapon you may be justified in shooting them :shock:, just depends on the circumstances.

That's where Hank's postulate is flawed, but he doesn't see that....

You most certainly are not justified in shootinganyone as they are fleeing from you. Unless of course, they are still shooting at you I suppose. Then the threat hasn't been stopped.Man, that's the problem with these things. They just don't all fit into a nice neat box all the time....
 

MSC 45ACP

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HankT wrote:
nobucks wrote:
It didn't say if the neighbor/burglar was armed or not.

Good point. He ...MIGHT HAVE HAD A KNIFE!

Even if he were armed, it is very difficult to justify shooting someone that is retreating. There is no more threat.

Even LE can only shoot a fleeing felon in very strict circumstances: They still pose a substantial threat to the populace; they are stealing nuclear material; or they are in posession of secret material that, if released, endangers the security of the country.
 
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