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Thread: Transporting Hand Gun on Motorcycle

  1. #1
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    I'm a 22-year-old student living in Gainesville, FL. I have applied for my concealed permit but I'm still waiting to receive it. I used to carry a handgun in the glove compartment of my car. I know this is legal (read this link) because you can transport a handgun as long as you are 21 and it is contained in some sort of way (box with lid, glove compartment, snapped holster, zipped bag, etc).

    I recently bought a motorcycle that has become my primary mode of transportation. The motorcycle has no compartment on it (no saddle bags or compartment under the seat). Is there any way to legally transport via my motorcycle? I typically wear a backpack as I ride, but I'm worried that carrying a handgun in it may be interpreted as having a concealed weapon.

    A couple points of clarification:
    1)I would never transport my weapon to campus. I used to take it out of my glove compartment before going to campus.

    2)I understand that once I get off the motorcycle, having a gun in my backpack is definitely a concealed weapon. For this reason, I would only take it to private residences or have it with me when I go cruising, with no destination other than home.

    Anyone know of any hard statutes on this? You're welcome to speculate, but speculation doesn't keep me from getting arrested if you're wrong. I'm really looking for a sure, legal answer.

    Whatever the case, it becomes a null point once I get my permit in 3-5 years (at least, that's what it feels like).

    Thanks for your time.

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    OMG.... no lie!

    My roommate just came in with the mail. My permit is in!

    I'd still like to see the question answered though.

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    my guess is you would be fine with it in your backpack. The reason I say this is because if you were driving in your car, you could have the gun in a backpack and even be wearing it, if you so desired. W/O a permit and while traveling by private conveyance , it just hast to be securely encased. If its in a zippered bag (backpack), it meets this requirement. As you pointed out though, when not on the bike, you would not longer be considered traveling by private conveyance and having the weapon in the backpack would be illegal.

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    There was a florida case where the man was carrying a weapon ion a zippered fanny pack, and thought that would allow him to carry, he was wrong and lost the case.



    The weapon, in order to trasnpport it without a concealed weapons permit, has to be inaccessable for immideate use. In other words, you can carry it zippered in a case in a backpack, and that is good, but if you put it in a zippered case on your hip, and it is loaded, then it is concealed without a permit. I know it's crazy, but that is how they ruled.

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    I'm still questioning the legality of the "No Guns at School" clauses.

    It's quite obvious that Texas is changing their position on this issue. They've now started to let Teachers CCW in School to help prevent/help resolve anymore school shootings.

    Florida recently upheld the right to keep your gun in your car at work.

    I don't see why a CCW permitted individual would be restricted for protecting themselves just because they are on a campus...if some CCW holders had been at Columbine or the any of the recent college campus shootings, the bad guys might have been resolved a bit quicker with less harm done to innocents.

    Florida's CCW course is Intensive and VERY well thought out. CCW licensees are directly responsible for helping lower Florida's crime rate, along with the "10-20-LIFE" & "Stand Your Ground" laws.

    It will only be a matter of time before a legal challenge excepting CCW licensees to this silly policy is taken up.

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    Oh, to answer the question, use the Three-Step Rule.

    Gun must be in case/holstered while inside the backpack.

    Gun must be UNLOADED & magazine(s) stored elsewhere...like in your pantspocket or a separate pocket of the backpack.

    In this manner, you have to take at least three steps for it to be ready to fire. This meets Florida's Transport requirements for non-CCW licensees.



    Given the requirements for the CCW are mostly background oriented...why not go ahead and take the class & get the permit?? It's never taken less time than now




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    WHERE DOES THIS THREE STEP CRAP COME FROM????????

    Assume no CCW. The gun can be as ready to go as you want it to be. It cannot be on you or immediately around you, think drivers seat. It can be pretty much anywhere else in the car, as long as you have to lift a lid, undo a zipper, unsnap a holster, open a console or a glove box door. Fla Stat. 790.25

    I am not aware of any "Transport" requirement in FL. If you are aware of such a statute please let me know.

    The operative part of the private conveyance statute is IN a private conveyance. quote from the court below about the case Gideon mentioned.

    Our holding in Gemmill is no less applicable where a defendant is riding a motorcycle. In this regard, we further note that the private conveyance exception of section 790.25(5), by its express terms, applies only to the carrying of a concealed weapon “within the interior of a private conveyance.” We interpret this language to require a person carrying a concealed weapon without a permit, while riding a motorcycle, to keep the concealed weapon securely encased and in an interior compartment of the motorcycle. Doughty v. State, 979 So.2d 1048
    Fla.App. 4 Dist.,2008

    I am not sure that even in a saddlebag would be enough on a motorcycle. The issue a court would have to decide is if that qualifies as not on the person, securely encased would not be problem.

    THIS POST IS FOR DISCUSSION OF LEGAL ISSUES ONLY. NO ATTORNEY CLIENT RELATIONSHIP IS INTENDED OR IMPLIED. CONSULT AN ATTORNEY FOR SPECIFIC ADVICE ON YOUR SITUATION.

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    I have been told personally by FHP that it is indeed legal to carry my loaded firearm in the TourPak or the Saddlebags of my Harley. He stated to me that because I had to stop the bike and dismount before being able to retrieve my weapon I was well within my rights to do so.

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    THERE IS NO 3 STEP RULE, A myth that some want you to believe

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    It mostly comes from LEO's on the job...it's what THEY want to see when they pull someone over for a ticketable offense, if they see it at all.

    CCW does solve the whole issue

    Pre-CCW, I went with the rule as I was told by many LEO's & Gun Store Guru's. Never had an issue. Cops were happy, I was happy. Much to be said for a lockedgun case with an unloadedweapon within...most cops see the lock & just ask if it's loaded or not...which it ain't.





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    Big Shrek wrote:
    It mostly comes from LEO's on the job...it's what THEY want to see when they pull someone over for a ticketable offense, if they see it at all.

    CCW does solve the whole issue

    Pre-CCW, I went with the rule as I was told by many LEO's & Gun Store Guru's. Never had an issue. Cops were happy, I was happy. Much to be said for a lockedgun case with an unloadedweapon within...most cops see the lock & just ask if it's loaded or not...which it ain't.


    The three step rule is a myth. LAW ENFORCEMENT officers are required to know and follow the LAW and not the myths.

    The cops were happy and you were happy and technically unarmed. You had the RIGHT to be armed as long as that firearm was securely encased.

    Be happy you never had the need for you firearm and that you didn't have to find the key, unlock the glove box, grab the gun, find the magazine and put the magazine into the gun and chamber a round while some bad guy is standing at your window patiently waiting for you to get in the fight.


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    Three step law is a myth... no where in the 790 section is it stated a person needs 3 steps...

    The "Securely Encased" statue is weak in its holding in a court room... even as broad as the statue is to allowed to be construed to uphold your second amendment right it is not...

    A motorcycle is not considered a private conveyance because it does not have an "interior" now as for the saddle bag it may or may not fly depending on the court and judges and how willing the state is to press the issue...

    my cases decision in the 4th district of appeals has even foiled the securely encased within a private conveyance... from what they say even if you are in a car and the firearm is securely encased and it is within range of being readily accessable you are guilty of carrying a concealed firearm...

    the way the law is written it is a catch 22 as one judge wrote... so the best bet is get the permit... wish i had gotten mine; but then again this debate wouldnt be happening right now if i didnt...

    I think that the law is there but just not upheld...

    the reason still stands in my book; There is a definition of "concealed weapon" and a definition for "securely encased" there for it is one or the other and can not be both..!

    Signed
    Doughty v. State

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    DANNiE wrote:
    Three step law is a myth... no where in the 790 section is it stated a person needs 3 steps...

    The "Securely Encased" statue is weak in its holding in a court room... even as broad as the statue is to allowed to be construed to uphold your second amendment right it is not...

    A motorcycle is not considered a private conveyance because it does not have an "interior" now as for the saddle bag it may or may not fly depending on the court and judges and how willing the state is to press the issue...

    my cases decision in the 4th district of appeals has even foiled the securely encased within a private conveyance... from what they say even if you are in a car and the firearm is securely encased and it is within range of being readily accessable you are guilty of carrying a concealed firearm...

    the way the law is written it is a catch 22 as one judge wrote... so the best bet is get the permit... wish i had gotten mine; but then again this debate wouldnt be happening right now if i didnt...

    I think that the law is there but just not upheld...

    the reason still stands in my book; There is a definition of "concealed weapon" and a definition for "securely encased" there for it is one or the other and can not be both..!

    Signed
    Doughty v. State
    Carrying on your person - wherever - without benefit of a CWFL is unlawful, that part of Florida's statutes is very clear.


    If this is truly your case and the facts are as presented, you sir are an idiot and lucky to be alive.
    "I have a gun, I’ll kill you." He then lifted his shirt, reached into a leather pack that was around his waist, and grabbed what the officers believed was a weapon.

  14. #14
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    Not what happened at all...

    I was sitting in traffic on my motorcycle when the car in front of me begins to reverse; so i honk my horn...

    The front passenger leans out the front window and says F-U we'll run you over and kill you if we want your nothing but garbage etc. at this point im still on my bike pushing it backward because they have now backed their car up to my front tire...

    after hes done yelling I give him the middle finger; he says oh f-us..!? and goes back into the car i look back to make sure that i dont back my bike into the car behind me as i look forward 3 italian looking goons jump out of the car all with 45s in my face say f us huh m-f-er so i jmped off the bike so fast it stood up on its own and began to run as i got to the side walk they say frezze police so i stop and put my hands in the air... they take me down and cuff me ask me if i have any drugs or weapons on me and i tell them i have my firearm holster in a zipper pack on my side...

    they remove my gun from the pouch a local FHP is flagged down...

    now the guys have badges out on thier belts; before they didnt turns out the 2 badges i could see were NYPD so im like yall are crazy now the FHP is there next to me trooper menner and he has my arm im like you guy jump out on me for no reason and now im going to jail cause you guys dont even have jurisdiciton as i said that the other 3rd guy slams a badge into the face mask of my helmet breaking the visor saying you see that you see that US Marshall now take him...

    so now a Local PD shows up and I go to jail... If you pull the police report the word or phrase "kill" is not mentioned one time... the only thing there is that i said I have a gun and i only said that after they jumped out on me and cuffed and searched me...

    the phrase "i have a gun ill kill you" comes up months later in a written testamony mailed to the state attorneys office... and then in another depo the other NYPD says something different...

    It was a plain out illegal search; but what i got was a bad Public Defender... She knew nothing... she was a plea maker... actually my first assigned PD was great the second was horriable...

    as for the clarification of the weapon being on a person traveling by private conveyance... its not there... nothing there says a person who is carrying a securely encased firearm cant have it on or near them... it is NOT clear... and it is to be construed in favor of the right to bear arms...

    bottom line is there is a difference between a "concealed weapon" and a "securely encased" weapon... matter of fact it has its on clear exception...

    790.25
    (l)A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person's manual possession;

    now "manual possesion" is not defined but one would think it is defined on its natural meaning it is manually available to one to use for immediate use which is very much simalar to the defintion of "concealed weapon" as defined in the statue again I argue a person carring a "securely encased" firearm per this "exception" is within the lawful limits... manual possesion is one who carrys a weapon in thier pocket or waist band with it ready to use with a hand and a single manual action... securely encased takes this all away...

    i have the case law at home of a guy on a motorcycle who had a gun in his motorcycle jacket pocket he argued that his pocket had a zipper on it so it counted as securely encased and the appelet court found it wasnt however a judge writes in his opinion that had it been "securely encased" he would have fallen within the exception...

    bottom line had i had a good PD or did the whole case Pro Se i would have motioned to surpress the verbal content and even proved that it was a made up story i mean how does a person tell another person that they were going to kill them and forget to tell the arresting officer at the time of arrest..? i mean these cops from NY are supposed to professionals how do they just forget that detail on arrest..? and remember to make it up later..?

    I currently have a post conviciton relief motion going and if any GOOD lawyers want to step up the task of making a wrong situation right then let me know... the 790 section of law has been complex for over 20 years...

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