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Thread: CHP - proof that the applicant has demonstrated competence

  1. #1
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    I know this site is dedicated to OC; but, I was hoping someone can answer a question about getitng my CHP. On the VA State Police Website, it says...

    "The court shall require proof that the applicant has demonstrated competence with a handgun and the applicant may demonstrate such competence by one of the following, but no applicant shall be required to submit to any additional demonstration of competence:" And in the list of what qualifies as "proof" it has;

    Presenting evidence of equivalent experience with a firearm through participation in organized shooting competition or current military service or proof of an honorable discharge from any branch of the armed services;

    So...my question is, do I just need to make a copy of my DD214 and submit it with my application for a CHP?

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    I just took my DD214 down to the Va Beach courthouse and they made the copy for me!

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    Cool...well, Friday I will have my application for CHP submitted then!

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    You can do that. We took a CHP class at our local range and used copies of those certs to apply.

    Be aware that your DD-214 does have your SSN on it so if you give them a copy of it, make sure the copy has the SSN redacted. CHP info is often treated as public info.

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    Regular Member CRF250rider1000's Avatar
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    Another quick question. Where is the online class? I need to take it since I procrastinated on signing up for the Utah one

    Edit: Found it http://www.concealed-carry.net/

    Didn't feel the need to start a new thread

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    Yeah...I was just thinking about that. I'll make a copy of it here at work and hand-carry the original with me, making sure my SSN is blacked out on the copy. Thanks for the info!

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    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    ...But definitely bring your original DD-214. I offered to bring a copy of mine and they wanted to see the original to make a "certified copy".


    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    MSC 45ACP wrote:
    ...But definitely bring your original DD-214. I offered to bring a copy of mine and they wanted to see the original to make a "certified copy".
    Requiring a certified copy would seem to be extra-legal, IMHO.

    I have provided documents for other purposes whereon I inscribed: "I certify this to be a true copy." Then signed and dated it. Never had one refused.

    You could go one step further and have a notary certify/sign it, but I do not think that is needed.

    Yata hey


    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Grapeshot wrote:
    MSC 45ACP wrote:
    ...But definitely bring your original DD-214. I offered to bring a copy of mine and they wanted to see the original to make a "certified copy".
    Requiring a certified copy would seem to be extra-legal, IMHO.

    I have provided documents for other purposes whereon I inscribed: "I certify this to be a true copy." Then signed and dated it. Never had one refused.

    You could go one step further and have a notary certify/sign it, but I do not think that is needed.

    Yata hey

    Well...my wife is a notary so it would bepretty easyto have the copy notarized...not sure of the legalities of her notarizing something for me though...I'll have to check on it.

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    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    If you don't want to use your DD-214 a Hunters Safety Course is the cheapest way to go, iirc.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

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    fully_armed_biker wrote:
    Grapeshot wrote:
    MSC 45ACP wrote:
    ...But definitely bring your original DD-214. I offered to bring a copy of mine and they wanted to see the original to make a "certified copy".
    Requiring a certified copy would seem to be extra-legal, IMHO.

    I have provided documents for other purposes whereon I inscribed: "I certify this to be a true copy." Then signed and dated it. Never had one refused.

    You could go one step further and have a notary certify/sign it, but I do not think that is needed.

    Yata hey

    Well...my wife is a notary so it would bepretty easyto have the copy notarized...not sure of the legalities of her notarizing something for me though...I'll have to check on it.




    Under the Virginia Notary Act, a notary may not perform any notarial act with respect to any document if:

    The notary is a party to the document

    The notary’s spouse is a party to the document

    The notary or his or her spouse has a "direct beneficial interest" in the document

    Notaries should not notarize any document when there is any possibility that the contents of the document will benefit them or their spouse. Notaries may notarize wills in which the notary is fiduciary. Notaries must NEVER notarize wills in which they are named beneficiaries. If you are uncertain about the difference, please consult an attorney before notarizing.
    Regardless of whether any beneficial or other interests exist, a notary may never take his or her own acknowledgment, oath, affidavit, or deposition.


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    MSC 45ACP wrote:
    ...But definitely bring your original DD-214. I offered to bring a copy of mine and they wanted to see the original to make a "certified copy".

    Nuh-uh. Nothing in the law requires you to submit an original with your SSN on it. Nor an original without an SSN.

    Remember, you are attesting all the information in the application is true and correct, with a notary witnessing your signature. Should be more than enough.

    My court took a copy, SSN redacted.

    Any more of this "bring the original" by a court deputy clerk should be straightened out by the citizen.

    As far as I am concerned, if the court wants to question the validity of my "proof of competence" the same cop that does the back-round check can call the NRA instructor. Or, the judge can accompany me to the shooting range.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Glock27Bill...Yeah, that's what I found out when I asked my wife about it tonight.



    Citizen...the more I thought about it...and especially after finding out the wife can't notarize it, I think that's what I'm going to do...SSN is OPTIONAL on the CHP app. I'm going to signa copylike grapeshot suggested...that I attest that the above information is true and correct.

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    fully_armed_biker wrote:
    Glock27Bill...Yeah, that's what I found out when I asked my wife about it tonight.



    Citizen...the more I thought about it...and especially after finding out the wife can't notarize it, I think that's what I'm going to do...SSN is OPTIONAL on the CHP app. I'm going to signa copylike grapeshot suggested...that I attest that the above information is true and correct.
    May I suggest using his wording for the photocopy? Sounds like he's got experience.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  15. #15
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    Any more of this "bring the original" by a court deputy clerk should be straightened out by the Citizen.
    How very generous of you to volunteer.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  16. #16
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    Citizen...Oh yeah, I was just paraphrasing for my post...I'm going to use his wording word-for-word!

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    Grapeshot wrote:
    Citizen wrote:
    Any more of this "bring the original" by a court deputy clerk should be straightened out by the Citizen.
    How very generous of you to volunteer.

    Yata hey
    Hey!!

    I wrote that with a small "c". Don't go gettin' me into more work!

    Don't you have some friction primers that need polished or something?
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  18. #18
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    Grapeshot wrote:
    Citizen wrote:
    Any more of this "bring the original" by a court deputy clerk should be straightened out by the Citizen.
    How very generous of you to volunteer.

    Yata hey
    Hey!!

    I wrote that with a small "c". Don't go gettin' me into more work!

    Don't you have some friction primers that need polished or something?
    Touche - you left the field open. I just pulled the caisson up and filled the breach.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  19. #19
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    Agent19 wrote:
    If you don't want to use your DD-214 a Hunters Safety Course is the cheapest way to go, iirc.
    Yes, for someone who doesn't have a DD-214, that's the cheapest, I'd say. My proof of demonstrated competence was the Pennsylvania Hunter Safety course that my parents paid for when I was 11.

    The Virginia Department of Game and Inland Fisheries offers a Hunter Education course at no charge. There's even an on-line, Internet-based option, though I haven't tried it. I've attended one in-person recently, as a refresher, and it wasn't a total waste of time. If it's been a while since you've taken one of those courses, you might learn something.

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    fully_armed_biker wrote:
    ... On the VA State Police Website, it says...
    Yes ... a DD-214 w/ "honorable" characterization meets the requirement.

    Keep in mind that resident CHPs are actually issued by the local court, not directly by the VSP.

    The circuit court in my area has a pretty good document detailing their process; complete w/ mailing address and POC info ...

    ... your's down in Tidewater might have the same.

  21. #21
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    Mt Vernon .40 wrote:
    The circuit court in my area has a pretty good document detailing their process; complete w/ mailing address and POC info ...
    Are the good people of Fairfax County really putting up with all of the unrequired, extra-legal nonsense? None of this crap is required by statute.





    First Time Application:
    In addition to the completed application, you must provide the clerk with:



    • Two additional copies of the original completed application. (Wrong)



    • A self-addressed stamped envelope. (Wrong)



    • Three copies of your certificate of competence with a handgun (see p.5). (Wrong)



    • Three copies of documentation to verify residence in Fairfax jurisdiction. (see p. 4 and p.7). (Wrong)






    Renewal Application: Application for permit renewal should be submitted at least 45 days prior to expiration of your current permit. In addition to the completed application, you must provide the clerk with:



    • Two additional copies of the completed application. (Wrong)



    • A self-addressed stamped envelope. (Wrong)



    • Three copies of the previous Concealed Handgun Permit issued by this court or another Virginia circuit court. (Wrong)



    • Three copies of documentation to verify residence in Fairfax jurisdiction. (see p.4 and p.7). (Wrong)








    Background Check:



    After an application is filed at the Fairfax Circuit Court Clerk’s office, the Fairfax County Police Department will conduct a background check on each applicant. As part of the background check, an applicant may be asked to undergo a voluntary interview with the police if the background check indicates a potential reason to disqualify the applicant. (wrong)
    James Reynolds

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    Concealed Firearms Instructor for Virginia, Florida & Utah permits.
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  22. #22
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    LOL, I figured it wouldn't take very long for a response to the FFX County "requirements."

    I dutifully "jumped thru the hoops" and received my CHP about 40 days after mailing it in ...

    ... but these "extra" requirements might well be something worth pursuing up here in the "occupied areas."

    <edit to add>:

    I see this as a clear shifting of the clerical burden from the Court's CHP clerk to the applicant.

    That said, I perceived that the minimal additional cost to me -- making extra copies and return envelope (I was making a complete copy set for myself anyway) -- ...

    ... outweighed the potential benefit gained in accuracy of the application. (reduced chance for copying / collating / stapling errors in the clerks office)

  23. #23
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Oppps.

    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  24. #24
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    May I suggest the "gentle" approach with the extra-legal requirements about copies of this and that and the self-addressed, stamped envelope.

    If she still works there, Carol Snow is the deputy clerk who processes the CHP applications. Last I talked to her, they were processing about 2000 applications a year. That's something like5.5 applicationsa day.

    She is very helpful. I'm not convinced she deserves a harsh or demanding approach.

    Of course, if she needs more help, the court,or whoever is the authority,should provide it, but in the meantime, it might be worth working with her to try to solve the problem.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  25. #25
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Wasn't there a case on proof of residency requirements that went to appeal not too long ago? My court google fu is not up to operating speed today. Anybody?

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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