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Thread: Required to Notify?

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    A friend was stopped in his car by a Suffolk police officer for a traffic violation. Nearing the end of the encounter, the officer asked if he had any weapons in the car. He notified the officer that he was carrying his gun on his right hip. The officer told him that he was required to notify immediately upon the encounter that he had a weapon.

    Is there a new regulation that is now requiring notification upon encounter? (I haven't heard of anything, and expect that there isn't.) If not, is this something that the Suffolk police dept. are teaching their officers? Or just the ignorance of the officer? How should we proceed from here? To whom and how should we notify of the problem (assuming that there is no such regulation.)

    Thanks for your help.

    Glenn

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    Campaign Veteran pourshot's Avatar
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    Nope

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    pourshot wrote:
    Nope
    Double nope! The officer was mistaken.
    James Reynolds

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    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.

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    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    then you handed him the classified ads and suggested that he find a new line of work?
    James Reynolds

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    Campaign Veteran pourshot's Avatar
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    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    Don't challenge him. Wait a week and say you are being challenged by friends and you need the code section badly so you don't look foolish. See how he reacts to that.



    Edit: Actually you might want to email him a link to preemption with another email address....Sounds like anonymously baiting/correcting this guy could be fun!

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    pourshot wrote:
    Edit:* Actually you might want to email him a link to preemption with another email address....Sounds like anonymously baiting/correcting this guy could be fun!
    That's exactly what I did after class last week. I never received a reply from him.

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    I don't trust many people with degrees, for some reason they think they own the world but are actually more stupid than a box of rocks. If you have a chp, and you are driving a vehicle, whom ever pulls you over knows you could be in possession of a fire arm. If not it is there guess. Personally depending on the location of the weapon I may let them know I am carrying. Va law does not require up font notification all though if you are asked it is best to tell the truth. IANL

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    ProShooter wrote:
    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    then you handed him the classified ads and suggested that he find a new line of work?*
    bwahahahaha! Good call, that!

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    ProShooter wrote:
    then you handed him the classified ads and suggested that he find a new line of work?


    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    "Those who can't ... teach."

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    Repeater wrote:
    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    "Those who can't ... teach."
    I am constantly amazed at two things:

    How much ugly there is in this world...

    How much Stoopid there is in this world...

    Seems like a lot of PD's have a high percentage of both!

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    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    Repeater wrote:
    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    "Those who can't ... teach."
    Hey now!
    James Reynolds

    NRA Certified Firearms Instructor - Pistol, Shotgun, Home Firearms Safety, Refuse To Be A Victim
    Concealed Firearms Instructor for Virginia, Florida & Utah permits.
    NRA Certified Chief Range Safety Officer
    Sabre Red Pepper Spray Instructor
    Glock Certified Armorer
    Instructor Bio - http://proactiveshooters.com/about-us/

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    +1
    I have been a trainer, instructor or "teacher" in just about every job I have ever had. Respectfully, I must disagree with that statement.

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    I was under the impression, as stated above, the officer will know you have a CHP and you have to present it with your license in a traffic stop, or if you are OC'ing you should have it on the seat or somewhere near you?

    Because technically at your right hip, even at OC, its not in common observation and the officer could pull a bonehead move from there.
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
    CC/OC Sig Sauer 229 - trijicon night sights

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    ProShooter wrote:
    Repeater wrote:
    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    "Those who can't ... teach."
    Hey now!
    Present company excepted, of course.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  17. #17
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    ProShooter wrote:
    Hey now!
    Don't worry, Jim. I'm sure he didn't mean you're stupid.

    ~ Boyd

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    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    I was under the impression, as stated above, the officer will know you have a CHP and you have to present it with your license in a traffic stop, or if you are OC'ing you should have it on the seat or somewhere near you?

    Because technically at your right hip, even at OC, its not in common observation and the officer could pull a bonehead move from there.
    Common observation = if the observing person could see all sides of you they would be able to see the firearm for what it is.

    IOW, you aren't making any intentional or accidental attempts to conceal / obscure it.

    Thus, having it on your hip and the police are facing you from the opposite side = firearm NOT concealed.

    Very much the same thing by doing the 'virgina tuck' and the officer being on the opposite side of your body. Anyone who observed your whole body would see it as it was openly carried.

    Keep in mind that yarn about not being a lawyer and all.

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    ProShooter wrote:
    Repeater wrote:
    hunter45 wrote:
    My criminal justice teacher told us last week that you must notify in Virginia (he is a former Hampton PD officer). I didn't feel like challenging him because we were already in an argument about OC earlier in that class period. He said someone walking down the street carrying a gun was enough reasonable suspicion to detain someone. And then he said OC is not legal in all parts of Virginia.
    "Those who can't ... teach."
    Hey now!
    Well, of course you are not 'instructing' within the dark realm of academia. So, the above obviously does not apply to you.

    Still, it appears many are sensitive to Shaw's famous quote. See here:

    “Those who can, do. Those who can’t, teach.” WTF, George BernardShaw?


    I hate this quote. I hate it, and I hate admitting that it might just be true.

    I teach. Not all the time, although I’d like to get back to the point where it is all the time, but enough to call myself a teacher without feeling like a complete fraud. A good friend, supposedly in jest, once used this quote against me when I was lamenting the fact that I have two degrees in English and a very narrow skill set. My guess is he only brought this up to get a rise out of me, which he did, but rise or not it got me thinking. And we know the consequences of that.

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    Campaign Veteran T Dubya's Avatar
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    Happened to me once:

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/31411.html

    If I am in a situation again where an officer tells me about some bogus "duty to inform", I am going to ask that they find the code and write me up for it.

    You show me a cop that knows the law, especially as it pertains to gun laws and I will show you an anomoly. Not bashing, just fact. We wouldn't have hadso many LEO teachable moments in Virginia the past few years if the cops knew the law.

    Danbus, Northern Virginia pizza parlor, Chet, etc. etc. etc.

    Show your teacher § 18.2-308.

    § 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.

    http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...0+cod+18.2-308

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    Don't assume that a cop is stupid or ignorant because he gives you misinformation. A lot of cops see that as part of their job. The technical legal term for that kind of behavior is, "dust in the eyes." The theory is that if you believe the hogwash they tell you, or at least will be uncertain about it, it may modify your behavior. And there are some among the law enforcement community who see themselves as responsible not only for detecting crimes and apprehending criminals, but social control, generally.

    Most of the ones I've encountered who engage in that kind of behavior don't believe me when I tell them that they can be held civilly liable for legal malpractice. But you don't have to be a lawyer to be liable for malpractice if you lie to someone about his legal rights and he acts on that misinformation to his detriment. And cops don't enjoy civil immunity.

    With respect to firearms, there are also those in the law enforcement community who feel that everyone who is not in his own home and lawfully minding his own business is a potential "target of investigation". So they regard an armed citizen as a potential threat to themselves, and they want to minimize that threat as much as possible. They do not make a distinction in their minds between law abiding, socially responsible, armed citizens and criminals, and they're afraid.
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

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    user wrote:
    And cops don't enjoy civil immunity.
    Be careful. LEOs do enjoy Qualified Immunity.

    Which, in the Fourth Circuit, is -- for all practical purposes -- civil immunity.

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    Repeater wrote:
    user wrote:*
    And cops don't enjoy civil immunity.
    Be careful. LEOs do enjoy Qualified Immunity.

    Which, in the Fourth Circuit, is -- for all practical purposes -- civil immunity.
    You have a good point. Though acting as an attorney is not normally within the scope of their duties.
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

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    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    user wrote:
    With respect to firearms, there are also those in the law enforcement community who feel that everyone who is not in his own home and lawfully minding his own business is a potential "target of investigation". So they regard an armed citizen as a potential threat to themselves, and they want to minimize that threat as much as possible. They do not make a distinction in their minds between law abiding, socially responsible, armed citizens and criminals, and they're afraid.
    That's a very broad brush you paint with, Counselor.

    In my 12 years in LE, in both NJ and Va, I never experienced such a feeling from an officer.
    James Reynolds

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    ProShooter wrote:
    user wrote:
    With respect to firearms, there are also those in the law enforcement community who feel that everyone who is not in his own home and lawfully minding his own business is a potential "target of investigation". So they regard an armed citizen as a potential threat to themselves, and they want to minimize that threat as much as possible. They do not make a distinction in their minds between law abiding, socially responsible, armed citizens and criminals, and they're afraid.
    That's a very broad brush you paint with, Counselor.

    In my 12 years in LE, in both NJ and Va, I never experienced such a feeling from an officer.

    I agree - you have never experienced it. But that does not make it not exist. Bet you never experienced a pregnancy either! Wanna tell the wife it's just in her mind?

    stay safe.

    skidmark

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