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Thread: Race for Governor/CCW

  1. #1
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    As most of are aware we have the votes in the assembly and state senate to get a CCW bill passed. Doyle has vetoed the bills. If we want CCW we are going to have to work hard to get a pro-gun candidate in that office.

    Regardless of all the back and forth on this site about which would be the best candidate, I realistically believe Neumann, Walker, and Todd will all sign such a bill if they are elected. I know there are some people here that have extremely strong feelings for one candidate or the other, and thats good, but when the primary is over and the candidate selected I think we should all stand united behind him/her, regardless of who it is, as long as their 2a beliefs align with our own.

    As for the anti-gun side I think if Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett runs he is going to be the democratic candidate, and we all know his positions gun rights. But whoever ends up winning the democratic primary, I think its safe to say they will probably be anti-gun.

    So what do we do about it? I know a good number of us are members of the NRA, WGO, etc. and they all do damn good work. But what do you guys think of a true grass-roots effort, by us, the members of this forum, to organize and fight for our candidate, and against the anti-gunners? We are in a very ideal situation, we are all pro 2a, well informed, and spread throughout the 4 corners of the state. I really think that with a concerted effort we could really make a difference.

    If we are going to do this, I think we need to get started now, get things figured out, get organized , and be ready when that candidate is selected so we can hit the ground running.

    Thoughts? Ideas? Am I crazy?

    Oh and by the way, I want to nominate Doug to run things!

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    This is OpenCarry.org Please take your poisonously-honeyed divisiveness elsewhere.

    You obviously know nothing of my principles.

    Either we are equal or we are not. Good people ought to be armed where they will, with wits and guns and the truth. NRA *******

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    I think it is a Great Idea. I will be willing to participate in anything it entails. as for Ideas, I will be posting a huge board in my front yard this spring. I am also on facebook with a Group I created called"Open/Concealed Carry". Please, if your interested to joining, feel free to come and log in. Ifyou choose to join, send me a message so I know your from opencarry.com.I'm sure Ideas will be flooding in on this page soon. Gov. Jim Doyle said he will NOT be seeking another term, so at least he wont be an issue. Lets hope he doesn't change his mind. Good luck to all and lets get this state where it need to be from a firearm standpoint!!!

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    Constitutionalist wrote:
    As most of are aware we have the votes in the assembly and state senate to get a CCW bill passed. Doyle has vetoed the bills. If we want CCW we are going to have to work hard to get a pro-gun candidate in that office.

    Regardless of all the back and forth on this site about which would be the best candidate, I realistically believe Neumann, Walker, and Todd will all sign such a bill if they are elected. I know there are some people here that have extremely strong feelings for one candidate or the other, and thats good, but when the primary is over and the candidate selected I think we should all stand united behind him/her, regardless of who it is, as long as their 2a beliefs align with our own.

    As for the anti-gun side I think if Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett runs he is going to be the democratic candidate, and we all know his positions gun rights. But whoever ends up winning the democratic primary, I think its safe to say they will probably be anti-gun.

    So what do we do about it? I know a good number of us are members of the NRA, WGO, etc. and they all do damn good work. But what do you guys think of a true grass-roots effort, by us, the members of this forum, to organize and fight for our candidate, and against the anti-gunners? We are in a very ideal situation, we are all pro 2a, well informed, and spread throughout the 4 corners of the state. I really think that with a concerted effort we could really make a difference.

    If we are going to do this, I think we need to get started now, get things figured out, get organized , and be ready when that candidate is selected so we can hit the ground running.

    Thoughts? Ideas? Am I crazy?

    Oh and by the way, I want to nominate Doug to run things!

    Well, about time I see a real post about our next Governor. The simple reality is just that. We will have two choices, when we vote next round. Not three or four, just two (one Dem. and one Rep.). I might not agree with it, but it is just a fact at this time. Any other vote, will be lost in the wind... We need to make sure that who ever does get the nomination for the Republican side wins the office. I fear that any other choice will only help the other side. Safe to say that none of us on this forum wants to see a Doyle look alike get the office. Again, my vote is not set in stone. I will support the Republican side this vote, if I can, and I will try. I will not support anyone that is going to try to take rights away from the people that I live around, so there is one person running that I can not vote for, ever. He might like guns, but this is not my only issue. Again, this is just me. We all need to look at all the people running, and make our own choice about this. Also again, I would say that if we do not end up with a Republican win, we might not see CCW for 4 more years...

    I also have learned to respect Doug a lot (Doug, you piss me off all the time, and I love you for it). I wish he would head up a thing like this, but I can see why he might never do it. The idea of the permit CCW, and the free open carry is a real problem. Also, to have to support a person that is running for an office, that is not in full agreement with your feelings is a problem (just to name two)... Mark my words, Doug does not have any fear of this, he just has his own feelings about the whole thing, and he does not want to give up his values for a "win".

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    We'll be doing whatever we can at ICarry.org to help the candidate that stands a chance at winning and will most likely sign a CCW bill. Any step towards less restriction is a good step. So while we'd all like vermont-style carry, IMHO it's better to aim at what's possible and after achieving that go for more ground.

    Our stance at ICarry.org is to be no-compromise in that we won't support MORE restrictions of any kind. We want less Gotta advance a foot before you can advance a mile though. We lost rights this way, and we can get them back this way.

    We'll be devoting lots of resources and $$$ to the next gubernatorial election in Wisconsin. Grassroots style.

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    Further empowering the state is no sort of a win. Further enabling the NRA is no win for any but its shills.

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    I should have been more specific, I did not mean JUST CCW. Yes, CCW, but also a candidate that would support continuing our open carry rights, re-shaping the laws to eliminate the gray area when you are either carrying a concealed weapon, or have an un-encased firearm within your reach in your vehicle, eliminate the DNR laws that prevent us from open carrying on certain days before hunts, work with us to elimainate local ordinances that are supposed to be pre-empted, repeal that god awful school zone law, and prevent all the other "sensible" gun restrictions the pols want to impose on us.

    I am not a single issue person either. If a candidate is 100% pro-gun, but I disagree with him on all the other issues I would have a real problem supporting him. Not everyone is going to support "our" candidate when it does come down to just two, and that is fine.

    Doug, when I mentioned nominating you to run the thing it was half tongue in cheek. The only reason I did was because after reading a number of your posts I have gained a great respect for your knowledge, vision and intellect. If I offended you, or led you to beleive my post was meant to be divisive, I assure you it most certainly was not meant to be, and offer my most sincere apologees.

    I was just trying to start another threat relating to the gubernatorial race that wasn't just "Todd is great.", "No, Walker is better." , "No, my candidate ...blah blah blah..." Thats great dialouge... for now, but sooner or later it will be down to just two, and I thought organizing a little political action might be a good idea.

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    it's not a question of whether or not a candidate supports open carry or concealed carry. For me the only acceptable candidate for governor is one who demonstrates a committment that Article I section 25 bestows on Wisconsin citizens a fundamental right to carry arms for any lawful purpose, including for personal protection. The manner of careto be at the election of the person doing so.

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    And to me 'commitment' means having bled political blood for my issues and not spouting empty words.

    Again, "read, understand and practice" (a-la Norm Abams) 'The Real Nature of Politics and Politicians: America's System Works, But Not the Way You Think!' by Michael I. Rothfeld.

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    Constitutionalist wrote:
    So what do we do about it? I know a good number of us are members of the NRA, WGO, etc. and they all do damn good work. But what do you guys think of a true grass-roots effort, by us, the members of this forum, to organize and fight for our candidate, and against the anti-gunners? We are in a very ideal situation, we are all pro 2a, well informed, and spread throughout the 4 corners of the state. I really think that with a concerted effort we could really make a difference.

    If we are going to do this, I think we need to get started now, get things figured out, get organized , and be ready when that candidate is selected so we can hit the ground running.

    Thoughts? Ideas? Am I crazy?
    My thought is that WI definitely needs a unifying organization of sorts. Afresh grass roots organization that can unify the special interest groups. OCDO is just a single special interest group. As such, OCDO is not the answer. "Just" the members of this forum are not the answer. I have done the research and am looking at a new web presence just for starters.

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    Entities must not be needlessly multiplied. Meet me at

    http://www.jbs.org/

    http://www.jbs.org/forum

    Not good enough, I wonder why?

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    Constitutionalist wrote:
    I was just trying to start another threat relating to the gubernatorial race that wasn't just "Todd is great.", "No, Walker is better." , "No, my candidate ...blah blah blah..." Thats great dialouge... for now, but sooner or later it will be down to just two, and I thought organizing a little political action might be a good idea.
    You doubt Mark Todd but what other candidate has had the balls to stand up and give his position on the issues whether you agree with that position or not?

    Where is this miraculous candidate of yours?

    Your right, it will be down to 2 candidates soon and unless you get behind the candidate that genuinely cares about your gun rights it will be to your detriment that your rights may fall away sooner then you think.

    I also agree with Doug's statement on bleeding political blood. However, I would like to know just which candidate he believes has bled for our cause.

    The one thing I find that is most ironic in all of this is the fact that those who are members of this forum and are crying about all of the other issues such as Gay Rights and what ever other issue you can pull out of your magical hat of excuses is this; Go back to October 2, 2009 in the Milwaukee Urinal and read the article about Walker.

    http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/63205267.html

    Walkers plan for the Milwaukee budget crisis is for the budget shortfalls to be paid for off the backs of county workers to reach a sum of $8400 per employee. Nice huh? How would you feel if that were your job? How would you feel if that were your pay and benefits being taken from you?

    You talk about standing up for other peoples rights? What about their right to prosperity? their right to provide for their families and loved ones, and yes that means their gay partners as well.

    So you're all good on the rights thing as long as any infringements are limited to county and state workers. Thanks for clearing that up for us.

    IMHO, Lammie put it best when he stated,

    "it's not a question of whether or not a candidate supports open carry or concealed carry. For me the only acceptable candidate for governor is one who demonstrates a committment that Article I section 25 bestows on Wisconsin citizens a fundamental right to carry arms for any lawful purpose, including for personal protection. The manner of careto be at the election of the person doing so."

    He has it exactly right.

    And funniest of all, everyone of you had the opportunity to meet Mark Todd and throw some serious questions his way. On more than one occasion. Where were you? What excuse did you have for not showing up this time? No money? Well you could have gotten in free! It wasn't about the money. Yes it was a fund raiser but more than that he wanted the opportunity to meet with people like us and to let everyone know how dedicated he is to these issues. Maybe that is why those of us who actually did show up and talk to the guy realize he in fact is the right candidate for Wisconsin.

    What about the back yard BBQ? Couldn't make it? Hmmm. It is funny how those of you who claim to be so stead fast and strongly supportive of this issue can't seem to make it to an event where a candidate for Governor will be.

    The single biggest gripe any of you have had about this guy is that he is into his religion. Well blow me to hell. If that is the worst thing you can find on him then your argument is moot.

    Why didn't you show up and ask him about his plan for jobs in this state? or the environment? or education? or taxes? Hell some even talked to him about Round a bouts in Wisconsin. He was open for any topic.

    So again, I ask, what your definition of bleeding political blood is. Please put it in laymen terms so everyone can understand. And then please tell us which candidate you believe has actually bled and how.

    The only statement I have heard from Walkers mouth on the gun rights issue was that he would sign that ccw bill that Doyle vetoed. Is that what you really want?
    You want to pay a fee? You want mandatory training at your expense? You want a permit so your right to carry becomes a privilege?

    Not me. He can have that Bill.

    If you are serious about your RKBA then you will not compromise. For those of you who continuously say there is no chance for a VT/AK system here is Wisconsin, please go away you are only hurting the chances with your negative remarks.

    Why is it not possible? Didn't they say the same things in VT and AK? Hell yes they did and look at them now. The fact is it is POSSIBLE! and with the right candidate it will happen.

    Now the question for you is....Do you have the balls to vote for that candidate?


  13. #13
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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    Entities must not be needlessly multiplied. Meet me at

    http://www.jbs.org/

    http://www.jbs.org/forum

    Not good enough, I wonder why?
    Are you starting a thread there to discuss this or are you trying to say that the JBS is fillingsome need? What exactly is the JBS doing for WI? WI consists of a loose network of groups each with similar interests but each having a different focus. There is no single unifying group. No single strong force. A message board does not a group make. Message boards are but a single form of communication. There needs to be a group of substance.

    Do you realize how much money groups like WAVE are getting to fight us? The received a single grant of over $600K. Do you realize how much money groups like WGO are getting and doing nothing to unify the State?

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    Interceptor_Knight wrote:
    Doug Huffman wrote:
    Entities must not be needlessly multiplied. Meet me at

    http://www.jbs.org/

    http://www.jbs.org/forum

    Not good enough, I wonder why?
    Are you starting a thread there to discuss this or are you trying to say that the JBS is fillingsome need? What exactly is the JBS doing for WI? WI consists of a loose network of groups each with similar interests but each having a different focus. There is no single unifying group. No single strong force. A message board does not a group make. Message boards are but a single form of communication. There needs to be a group of substance.

    Do you realize how much money groups like WAVE are getting to fight us? The received a single grant of over $600K. Do you realize how much money groups like WGO are getting and doing nothing to unify the State?
    Your exactly right. We need to unite as one large group and pool all monies and contributions into a fund to fight the antis on their level. With the way things are today, more and more people are falling in line to support gun rights. Now is the time for action and not just talk. It is great to sit in this forum and talk about these issues and banter back and forth on our positions. However, we need to take action and I mean action like no politician or legislator has ever seen in this state.

    The time is now.

    Carry On!
    Molon Labe!

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    J.Gleason wrote:
    You tout[sic] Mark Todd but what other ...
    Noun: Someone advertising for customers in an aggressive way.

    Verb: To flaunt, publicize, boast, brag or promote.

    Maybe you meant 'doubt'?

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    J.Gleason wrote:
    You tout[sic] Mark Todd but what other ...
    Noun: Someone advertising for customers in an aggressive way.

    Verb: To flaunt, publicize, boast, brag or promote.

    Maybe you meant 'doubt'?
    yes a typo....corrected, thank you.

    Was this not me admitting to be in error?

    You still have not defined your meaning of bleeding political Blood and exactly which candidate you believe has done so. Are you avoiding the question?

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    Interceptor_Knight wrote:
    Are you starting a thread there to discuss this or are you trying to say that the JBS is fillingsome need? What exactly is the JBS doing for WI? WI consists of a loose network of groups each with similar interests but each having a different focus. There is no single unifying group. No single strong force. A message board does not a group make. Message boards are but a single form of communication. There needs to be a group of substance.

    Do you realize how much money groups like WAVE are getting to fight us? The received a single grant of over $600K. Do you realize how much money groups like WGO are getting and doing nothing to unify the State?
    Good research NOT.

    JBS was founded in 1958 and broadly defined conservatism through the VietNam Era and the Sixties. It does not sell our Rights as its stock in trade as the National Rifle Association does. It does not sell our Rights as its reason for existence like your NRA clients do. Do you realize how much money the NRA et alii gets and divides and divides and divides freedom loving pro-gun people with its lying.

    WGO is not a client of the NRA and that is not reason for YOU to disparage it.

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    Re "typo"; no, rain on my leg is not warm. There are too many and different letters to be a typographical error.

    What does it say of one afraid to be in error?

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    J.Gleason wrote:
    Maybe that is why those of us who actually did show up and talk to the guy realize he in fact is the right candidate for Wisconsin.
    I didn't want Constitutionalist's original post to be hijacked by the exact banter he specified, but I also can't let certain arguments go unanswered.

    I did go to the BBQ and meet with Todd. In fact, after talking to him for so long, I felt like I was taking up too much of his time and not giving anyone else the chance to get their questions answered. In the end, we covered what he'd do for business (has plans to bring in 2 or 3 fortune 100 companies, creating thousands of jobs), gun rights (of course), and even welfare (told me a story about a homeless guy that lost everything, and how we should be helping him, because that could be any of us).

    In the end, I enjoyed our conversation, but he didn't win me over outright. I actually went to the BBQ extremely excited about Mark Todd, and left with a "eh, not what I thought he'd be" attitude. He seemed less than genuine (can't explain, its in the body language and speech). And when I asked about 2A rights, he didn't know much about the CCW permit system, and just said he's sign it into law, no permit, etc etc. Good stance, but didn't seem to be a true advocate about it.

    And when Doug says "bled political blood," I believe he's talking about the fact that Todd hasn't actually done anything to further our cause, just said he would. And that's why I brought my tape recorder!

    Sorry for the long post, but I really wanted to address J.Gleasons statement saying that anyone that met with Mark Todd will see he is the right candidate. I met the guy, not as impressed as I thought I'd be, and I'm still looking into other candidates.

    **As a side note, his website is extremely vague about his positions (another reason why I felt I needed a voice recorder, to hold him to his word as he defined his actual position with statements other than "I am not for anything unconstitutional." Just another of my 2 cents!

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    Sgt_Habz wrote:
    J.Gleason wrote:
    Maybe that is why those of us who actually did show up and talk to the guy realize he in fact is the right candidate for Wisconsin.
    I didn't want Constitutionalist's original post to be hijacked by the exact banter he specified, but I also can't let certain arguments go unanswered.
    The thread is titled Race for Governor/CCW and therefore pertains to candidates. There is no high jacking involved here.

    I did go to the BBQ and meet with Todd. In fact, after talking to him for so long, I felt like I was taking up too much of his time and not giving anyone else the chance to get their questions answered. In the end, we covered what he'd do for business (has plans to bring in 2 or 3 fortune 100 companies, creating thousands of jobs), gun rights (of course), and even welfare (told me a story about a homeless guy that lost everything, and how we should be helping him, because that could be any of us).

    In the end, I enjoyed our conversation, but he didn't win me over outright. I actually went to the BBQ extremely excited about Mark Todd, and left with a "eh, not what I thought he'd be" attitude.
    Maybe you should have asked more questions. that is why he came.

    He seemed less than genuine (can't explain, its in the body language and speech). And when I asked about 2A rights, he didn't know much about the CCW permit system, and just said he's sign it into law, no permit, etc etc. Good stance, but didn't seem to be a true advocate about it.
    Because there isn't one. He is in favor of anyone exercising their 2A rights without compromise. His words.

    And when Doug says "bled political blood," I believe he's talking about the fact that Todd hasn't actually done anything to further our cause, just said he would. And that's why I brought my tape recorder!
    So what has Walker or Nuemann or Lawton or Find done?

    Sorry for the long post, but I really wanted to address J.Gleasons statement saying that anyone that met with Mark Todd will see he is the right candidate. I met the guy, not as impressed as I thought I'd be, and I'm still looking into other candidates.
    I was referring to those of us who support him.

    **As a side note, his website is extremely vague about his positions (another reason why I felt I needed a voice recorder, to hold him to his word as he defined his actual position with statements other than "I am not for anything unconstitutional." Just another of my 2 cents!

    And the other candidates sites are not vague? or even more so then Todds?
    With this I will also say, there is no such thing as a perfect candidate. If you agree with everything a candidate says then there is something wrong. Namely, you do not know how to think for yourself.
    Do I agree with everything mark Todd says on every issue? No.

    But remember, this forum is about guns and gun rights and for me personally, that is the number one issue this time around. The time for changes in these laws is ripe for the picking. The time is now. I think Mark Todd will do more on this issue then any other candidate. That is just my own opinion.

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    Re "typo"; no, rain on my leg is not warm. There are too many and different letters to be a typographical error.

    What does it say of one afraid to be in error?
    If you like I can look through your posts and paste all of your typos?

  22. #22
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    I think Mark Todds web site is very well made, and informative. It lists a lot of his positions. It is also the primary driving force, that makes me run away from him as fast as I can.

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    AaronS wrote:
    I think Mark Todds web site is very well made, and informative. It lists a lot of his positions. It is also the primary driving force, that makes me run away from him as fast as I can.
    You keep running but you never seem to leave Milwaukee. I guess your caught up in Walkers guiding light. That is OK though, I support your right to choose.

    Just in case he wins, do you want me to save all of these posts you have supporting Walker, so that way when the proverbial poop hits the fan I can remind you of why you voted for him?

  24. #24
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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    JBS was founded in 1958 and broadly defined conservatism through the VietNam Era and the Sixties. It does not sell our Rights as its stock in trade as the National Rifle Association does. It does not sell our Rights as its reason for existence like your NRA clients do. Do you realize how much money the NRA et alii gets and divides and divides and divides freedom loving pro-gun people with its lying.

    WGO is not a client of the NRA and that is not reason for YOU to disparage it.
    The active NRA bashing has nothing to do with the cash trail of the WGO. Cash comes in and I am willing to bet that you have no clue where it goes (except for a pretty web site and salary for its board). You are prasing the JBS for what it is not, as you are praising the WGO for what they (he) are (is) not. Tell me what the JBS is directly actively doing in WI.????? How about the WGO.???? Other than a pretty web site with recycled news stories, please tell me what the WGO is doing for us andhow the donations are being put to good use. It appears that the WGO has contributed to the fractured structure here in WI instead of trying to unify it.

    The NRA provides grants to ranges. The NRA is a huge force in Washington. I don't support all of their politics, but they are deserving of my yearly membership if for no other reason than then fear they instill in the hearts of the gun grabbers. Of course this is not the only reason. The NRA is another group not meeting all ofour needs in WI. The NRA is too broad for what I am talking about.

    We need a WI based grass roots organization, not just the loose groups of WI residents on a dozen different message boards.

  25. #25
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    J.Gleason wrote:
    AaronS wrote:
    I think Mark Todds web site is very well made, and informative. It lists a lot of his positions. It is also the primary driving force, that makes me run away from him as fast as I can.
    You keep running but you never seem to leave Milwaukee. I guess your caught up in Walkers guiding light. That is OK though, I support your right to choose.

    Just in case he wins, do you want me to save all of these posts you have supporting Walker, so that way when the proverbial poop hits the fan I can remind you of why you voted for him?
    Just in case he wins, that is funny. Don't forget in a few years to also remind me that I voted for Obama as well (you know, the man that had the National Park ban lifted (not to mention he is the first President I know of that will let you carry a gun in "line of sight" of his rallies)). I guess not all us Libs. are anti-gun...

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