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Thread: Wal-mart is NOT gun friendly!

  1. #1
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    So I thought it smart to begin a new topic since this is breaking news!

    I got a phone call today from a person in regards to my "letter to the president" of walmart. Apparently I made someone take notice! They called me and said "I know that the state law allows you to openly carry your firearm but you can't in walmart we are a privately owned business and it is in the best interest of walmart to not allow open carry in our stores." So I reply with: everything that I have heard or read about walmart is that it complies with state and local laws, is there anything that you can give me in writing or direct me to to show me where I can read this? His reply is "I do not have the authority to do that." I said Ok, well, can I talk to someone who does? He replies with "no, do you have a CWP?" I replied with I do, but OC and CC are two completely different things. He then said "Then this is a non issue just conceal it next time you are in the store" I said what if I didn't have a ccw permit? He said that then I could not enter the store and that if I enter the store again and they can tell that I am carrying they will escort me out of the building... So I said that I would like something in writing so that I can write something up for some friends of mine to show them walmart's position on this issue. He again said "I do not have the authority." Then he goes on to say that he had four complaints from people being scared that I had a weapon in open display. I replied "ok, so if I see a person and they scare me, say they have a slogan on their t-shirt that frightens me, if I go and tell you about it will they be treated as I was treated? Like a criminal?" His reply was "that is the first amendment sir" My reply was "What happened to my second amendment?" He said "I am not going to argue with you about this, I am not trying to impede upon your rights I am simply telling you how it is. I now see that I'm getting nowhere with him, ask again for something in writing or maybe a simply link to anything that pertains to this and he again says that he doesn't have authorization... so I tell him to have a good day and hang up the phone... opinions?? I thought that walmart was supposed to go along with state and federal laws? I did nothing to bring this upon me, I was simply exercising my right to OC... Maine is an OC state and wal-mart is the only chain store that has given me a hard time...

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    Alright, look guy, unless you can give a position for the guy that called you, this has no credence.

    If he doesn't have the authority to give you anything written, then he doesn't have authority to make official statements for Wal-mart.

    Just carry your darn gun in wal mart, you wont be bothered 99% of the time.

    What's so dang special about wal mart? Shoot, so they may or may not like guns.

    Who Cares?

    This dang Wal mart crap goes back and forth, back and forth. It's like watching a dang tennis match.

    Get over wal mart everyone.

    If everybody worried about gun legislation and electing gun friendly officials as much as they worry about Wal mart, we would be in a much better position.

    Sheesh.

    http://thx997303.blogspot.com/2009/1...pen-carry.html

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    You may wish to do a little research on this site; there are multiple threads on Walmart across the US.

    I'd also recommend that you get names, and name names when you speak with folks on a corporate or managerial level - so that misinformation can be verified and also counseled by the appropriate personnel - if need be.

    Walmart in Virginia have never been an issue for me - when I OC. I will not state that I have been to every Walmart in the state, but the three near me have never asked me to leave or CC when shopping. I have even spoken to no less than 4 managers at the stores where I shop to commend the sales staff (particularly those in Sporting Goods) as being very customer friendly and helpful.

    If you are having those issues at your local Walmart, compile a list of names and work up the food-chain; to include names - the first rule of negotiation is that you must first assure that the person on the other side of the table has the authority to state what they are telling you.

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    shanebelanger wrote:
    So I thought it smart to begin a new topic since this is breaking news!

    I got a phone call today from a person in regards to my "letter to the president" of walmart. Apparently I made someone take notice!
    They called me and said "I know that the state law allows you to openly carry your firearm but you can't in walmart we are a privately owned business and it is in the best interest of walmart to not allow open carry in our stores." So I reply with: everything that I have heard or read about walmart is that it complies with state and local laws, is there anything that you can give me in writing or direct me to to show me where I can read this?
    His reply is "I do not have the authority to do that." I said Ok, well, can I talk to someone who does? He replies with "no, do you have a CWP?" I replied with I do, but OC and CC are two completely different things. He then said "Then this is a non issue just conceal it next time you are in the store" I said what if I didn't have a ccw permit? He said that then I could not enter the store and that if I enter the store again and they can tell that I am carrying they will escort me out of the building...
    So I said that I would like something in writing so that I can write something up for some friends of mine to show them walmart's position on this issue. He again said "I do not have the authority." Then he goes on to say that he had four complaints from people being scared that I had a weapon in open display. I replied "ok, so if I see a person and they scare me, say they have a slogan on their t-shirt that frightens me, if I go and tell you about it will they be treated as I was treated? Like a criminal?"
    His reply was "that is the first amendment sir" My reply was "What happened to my second amendment?" He said "I am not going to argue with you about this, I am not trying to impede upon your rights I am simply telling you how it is. I now see that I'm getting nowhere with him, ask again for something in writing or maybe a simply link to anything that pertains to this and he again says that he doesn't have authorization... so I tell him to have a good day and hang up the phone... opinions??
    I thought that walmart was supposed to go along with state and federal laws? I did nothing to bring this upon me, I was simply exercising my right to OC... Maine is an OC state and wal-mart is the only chain store that has given me a hard time...

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    I do not patronize Wal-Mart. I give what custom that I can to Mom&Pops shops where I can have a business relationship.

    Here is an even better reason not to give custom to Wal-Mart and to avoid the class that does...

    http://media.peopleofwalmart.com/



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    thx997303 wrote:
    ...
    Just carry your darn gun in wal mart, you wont be bothered 99% of the time.

    What's so dang special about wal mart? Shoot, so they may or may not like guns.

    Who Cares?

    This dang Wal mart crap goes back and forth, back and forth. It's like watching a dang tennis match.

    Get over wal mart everyone.

    If everybody worried about gun legislation and electing gun friendly officials as much as they worry about Wal mart, we would be in a much better position.

    Sheesh.......
    Other than here is a Wal-Mart in almost every neighborhood I don't understand the fanication with OC at Wal-Mart either. It almost seems like this board, and others, have taken up the crusade of other groups in protest of Wal-Mart. Why Wal-mart, why not McDonalds or Burger King. Very seldom do I ever see them mentioned one way or the other so is there something different? You would think people are required to shop at Wal-Mart from the way they act.

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    PT111 wrote:
    You would think people are required to shop at Wal-Mart from the way they act.
    They are, by training and economic necessity. Wal-Mart is a client of the Chinese and will always be able to offer the lowest priced commodities at a quality and price point deemed adequate by other than its customers.

    Corporatism is not conservatism is not capitalism.

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    Wal-mart is really the only store around... I live in the sticks and if you want to get something usually walmart is the only place that carries it unless you want to go to fifteen different little places and hope they have what your looking for. It is also rather large so imo if we get a chain retailer to openly encourage oc or atleast quietly back it then that is simply another victory for us... No there is nothing SPECIAL about walmart but if we get a minor victory here and there they WILL add up...

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    He then said "Then this is a non issue just conceal it next time you are in the store"

    Sounds like Wal-Mart is gun friendly, they requested you to conceal which in no way disarms you or leaves you unprotected or violates your 2A rights. Your statementis why the OC movement is referred to as "fledgeing" and "In your face Attitude"

    You can spend your money anywhere you choose, but these boycotts are laughable. Lets look at the facts, 1) Gunowners are a minority. 2) OC is a bigger minority. Do you feel 1 or 2 people who boycott because they cant OC means anything? When more people, either CC or people who don't carry at all will boycott if a store allows OC. Which group will the store side with?

    In a civilized society thereis always a compromise, that would be to conceal when asked. Enough with the corporations andOC, you are dealing with people thatare told policies and notthe ones who make them. Try OC on the small business, like Joe's Pizza,Mel's Diner, a Mom and Pop's, someplace that is independently owned.

    I'm no legal expert but, I don't recall OC being a right, I understood it as a Law. And lawscan be changed.

    Bottom line is carry you firearm legally, safely, and wisely.

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    BizOwner wrote:
    He then said "Then this is a non issue just conceal it next time you are in the store"

    Sounds like Wal-Mart is gun friendly, they requested you to conceal which in no way disarms you or leaves you unprotected or violates your 2A rights. Your statementis why the OC movement is referred to as "fledgeing" and "In your face Attitude"

    You can spend your money anywhere you choose, but these boycotts are laughable. Lets look at the facts, 1) Gunowners are a minority. 2) OC is a bigger minority. Do you feel 1 or 2 people who boycott because they cant OC means anything? When more people, either CC or people who don't carry at all will boycott if a store allows OC. Which group will the store side with?

    In a civilized society thereis always a compromise, that would be to conceal when asked. Enough with the corporations andOC, you are dealing with people thatare told policies and notthe ones who make them. Try OC on the small business, like Joe's Pizza,Mel's Diner, a Mom and Pop's, someplace that is independently owned.

    I'm no legal expert but, I don't recall OC being a right, I understood it as a Law. And lawscan be changed.

    Bottom line is carry you firearm legally, safely, and wisely.
    QFT

    Compromise is failure on the installment plan and especially with such intractable ignorance as demonstrated above.

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    BizOwner wrote:
    He then said "Then this is a non issue just conceal it next time you are in the store"

    Sounds like Wal-Mart is gun friendly, they requested you to conceal which in no way disarms you or leaves you unprotected or violates your 2A rights. Your statementis why the OC movement is referred to as "fledgeing" and "In your face Attitude"

    You can spend your money anywhere you choose, but these boycotts are laughable. Lets look at the facts, 1) Gunowners are a minority. 2) OC is a bigger minority. Do you feel 1 or 2 people who boycott because they cant OC means anything? When more people, either CC or people who don't carry at all will boycott if a store allows OC. Which group will the store side with?

    In a civilized society thereis always a compromise, that would be to conceal when asked. Enough with the corporations andOC, you are dealing with people thatare told policies and notthe ones who make them. Try OC on the small business, like Joe's Pizza,Mel's Diner, a Mom and Pop's, someplace that is independently owned.

    I'm no legal expert but, I don't recall OC being a right, I understood it as a Law. And lawscan be changed.

    Bottom line is carry you firearm legally, safely, and wisely.
    The right as spelled out & recognized in the 2nd Amendment does NOT specify mode of carry. It merely states the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

    Read logically it means my right to keep / own / possess arms shall not be infringed / marginalized.

    It also means my right to bear / carry arms likewise shallnot be infringed or otherwise marginalized. Thus by the 2nd Amendment alone I should be able to OC or CC as *I* deems necessary. Such would apply to every man, woman, and child too.

    Never quite understood what made it difficult to figure out. I remember being taught how to dissect the English language to determine the meaning of any sentence.

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    2nd Amendment does NOT specify mode of carry.

    Thank you for agreeing with me.



    It also means my right to bear / carry arms likewise shallnot be infringed or otherwise marginalized. Thus by the 2nd Amendment alone I should be able to OC or CC as *I* deems necessary. Such would apply to every man, woman, and child too.

    The Supreme Court says: Justice Antonin Scalia 2008 wrote that the right to bear arms is not unlimited and is subject to reasonable prohibitions and regulations and subsequently federal court rulings have upheld existing gun prohibitions and regulations.



    Never quite understood what made it difficult to figure out. I remember being taught how to dissect the English language to determine the meaning of any sentence.

    Thank you again, for agreeing with me, the "In your Face" attitude. I remember being taught reading comprehension. Read Justice Scalia qoute again, it will answer all your 2A views, We may not agree with them but as of now they are the laws of the land.

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    Actually it was fairly recently in Wisconsin, if I remember correctly, that the existing right to open carry was used as their excuse for not allowing concealed carry at all.

    Each state has their own circumstances, but I'd say your understanding of what "rights" are confirmed by the 2nd Amendment are in the small minority view, certainly around here.

    TFred


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    BizOwner wrote:
    He then said "Then this is a non issue just conceal it next time you are in the store"

    Sounds like Wal-Mart is gun friendly, they requested you to conceal which in no way disarms you or leaves you unprotected or violates your 2A rights. Your statementis why the OC movement is referred to as "fledgeing" and "In your face Attitude"
    Wal Mart has a policy of abiding by state law with regards to firearms carry, but they, being the largest corporation in the world, have numerous uninformed managers that continually suggest that open carry is not allowed in their stores. Some managershave suggested that concealed carry is also not allowed in past incidents that have been posted on other forums. I have read of some people that have actually sued based on what a rogue manager has done inacting outside the actual written policy of the company for not just carry issues, but an array of different issues.

    As for violating your right to bear arms, that is exactly what they are doing considering what the term Bear means.

    Here is the interpretation of Bear in the Heller decision...






    10 DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA v. HELLER Opinion of the Court


    At the time of the founding, as now, to "bear" meant to"carry." See Johnson 161; Webster; T. Sheridan, A Complete Dictionary of the English Language (1796); 2 Oxford English Dictionary 20 (2d ed. 1989) (hereinafter Oxford).When used with "arms," however, the term has a meaningthat refers to carrying for a particular purpose—confrontation. In
    Muscarello v. United States, 524 U. S. 125 (1998), in the course of analyzing the meaning of "carries a firearm" in a federal criminal statute, JUSTICE GINSBURG wrote that "[s]urely a most familiar meaning is,as the Constitution’s Second Amendment . . . indicate[s]: ‘wear, bear, or carry . . . upon the person or in the clothing or in a pocket, for the purpose . . . of being armed and ready for offensive or defensive action in a case of conflict with another person.’" Id., at 143 (dissenting opinion)

    We think that J
    USTICE GINSBURG accurately captured thenatural meaning of "bear arms." Although the phraseimplies that the carrying of the weapon is for the purpose of "offensive or defensive action," it in no way connotesparticipation in a structured military organization.

    You can spend your money anywhere you choose, but these boycotts are laughable. Lets look at the facts, 1) Gunowners are a minority. 2) OC is a bigger minority. Do you feel 1 or 2 people who boycott because they cant OC means anything? When more people, either CC or people who don't carry at all will boycott if a store allows OC. Which group will the store side with?
    This is true, you can go elsewhere and Wal Mart actually has the perogative to restrict your carry rights in their stores. However, they should provide documentation andpostagefor proof and their stores and management should all be on the same page. That is not too much to ask for as a large group of consumers would like to have thatclarification.



    In a civilized society thereis always a compromise, that would be to conceal when asked. Enough with the corporations andOC, you are dealing with people thatare told policies and notthe ones who make them. Try OC on the small business, like Joe's Pizza,Mel's Diner, a Mom and Pop's, someplace that is independently owned.
    What of they are "told" the wrong policies and what if the manager is in error? Should gun owners just abide by the draconian actions of the uninformed managers or should they make inquiries andtry to do something about it.

    In my opinion, people that have the means should try to shop in smaller, local companies anyway, I would agree with you there. But Wal Mart is the largest company in the world and if open carry is allowed and frequently done there, it could provide a lot of good exposure for the cause.


    I'm no legal expert but, I don't recall OC being a right, I understood it as a Law. And lawscan be changed.

    Bottom line is carry you firearm legally, safely, and wisely.


    Most states don't have any laws specifically mentioning open carry and the general consensus is that if there are no laws against something, it is therefore considered legal.

    I am no lawyer either but it seems pretty plain to me what "to keep and bear means." The Supreme Court as I previously pasted, outlines it's definition in detail in the Heller Opinion.After reading it closely, I personally consider that to mean to carry in any fashion, whether openly or concealed.

    Out of the over 20,000 federal gun laws, it's the U.S. Constitution's second amendmentthat is the Supreme law of the Land. The bill of rights putslimits onthe powers of the federal government, not onthe rights of the American people.


    Peace through superior firepower

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    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    thx997303 wrote:
    Alright, look guy, unless you can give a position for the guy that called you, this has no credence.

    If he doesn't have the authority to give you anything written, then he doesn't have authority to make official statements for Wal-mart.

    Just carry your darn gun in wal mart, you wont be bothered 99% of the time.

    What's so dang special about wal mart? Shoot, so they may or may not like guns.

    Who Cares?

    This dang Wal mart crap goes back and forth, back and forth. It's like watching a dang tennis match.

    Get over wal mart everyone.

    If everybody worried about gun legislation and electing gun friendly officials as much as they worry about Wal mart, we would be in a much better position.

    Sheesh.

    http://thx997303.blogspot.com/2009/1...pen-carry.html
    Heh, time to switch to decaf thx.

    But seriously, I know what you mean...

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    Ah man, do I have to? Decaf just doesn't taste "right"

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    thx997303 wrote:

    What's so dang special about wal mart? Shoot, so they may or may not like guns.

    Who Cares?

    This dang Wal mart crap goes back and forth, back and forth. It's like watching a dang tennis match.

    Get over wal mart everyone.

    If everybody worried about gun legislation and electing gun friendly officials as much as they worry about Wal mart, we would be in a much better position.

    Sheesh.

    http://thx997303.blogspot.com/2009/1...pen-carry.html
    Very well said. It apears that the threads are focused on more on Walmart and what did or did not happen in the store instead of legislation. My take is that MAYBE it is the HOPE that something happens so someone can sue.

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    First of all I would like to say something about Wal-Mart. If you don't like their policy then live with it. Trying time after time to change a large corporation view on firearms takes time and cool headed indviduals.

    I for one have have spent a good six months talking with corporate level people which seems to be going nowhere and always get the run around. I have been told several times they would look into the policy.

    Here is a better option if you don't like Wal-Mart then simply put it go somewhere else. I go to Wal-Mart several times a week with no incident and always openly carried.


    Zach
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    I open carry at WalMart almost every time I go, and the worst I've gotten is having the greeter step aside wide-eyed as if I were a cop tailing a BG. OH WAIT. I did have a guy at the electronics counter ask me "Why are you wearing that pistol?" to which I responded "Because my revolver clashes with my cufflinks"; causing three teenagers to fall on the floor laughing. :celebrate

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    Alexcabbie wrote:
    I open carry at WalMart almost every time I go, and the worst I've gotten is having the greeter step aside wide-eyed as if I were a cop tailing a BG. OH WAIT. I did have a guy at the electronics counter ask me "Why are you wearing that pistol?" to which I responded "Because my revolver clashes with my cufflinks"; causing three teenagers to fall on the floor laughing. :celebrate
    You wear cufflinks????:what:No WAAAAYYY. :?

    I've been carrying for overa year now, OC everyday. I'veOC'd in 2 WM in my area without any problems. Even ran across a sheriffs deputy the last time I was in the Holenwald store. He didn't even give me any flak about it either.

    I'm wondering if these Stores people say they are having a problem with are located in prodominently liberal locations?

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    That's funny I also think how one dresses plays a role in Wal-Mart as well.
    Zach
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    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity"

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    Do not associate with these http://www.peopleofwalmart.com/

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    Do not associate with these http://www.peopleofwalmart.com/
    See now this lady here is all kinds of more offending than a smartly dressed person OC'ing, but I bet nobody asked her to leave.

    TFred


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    "Lady?"

    RE: class and behavior, there are lots of "women" out there but not a whole lot of real "ladies."

    But you know, that goes for "men" nowadays, too, maybe more so as many "men" even aren't sure they are male...so we can't even begin to determine if they are "gentlemen" or not.

    The decline of America continues...

    -- John D.


    (formerly of Colorado Springs, CO)

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    I wondered that myself.

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