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Thread: Seattle Open Carry Gathering

  1. #1
    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    This needs to include people who are primarily CC and have not OC'd before. We need more people than just the OC group around Western Washington.

    When this happens, there needs to be enough time to notify people and/or spread information so more people show up.

    WHERE:
    (Best Choice) Cal Anderson Park, 1635 11th Ave, Seattle, WA
    http://www.cityofseattle.net/parks/p...il.asp?ID=3102
    Cal Anderson Park includes Lincoln Reservoir and Bobby Morris Playfield.

    Google Maps:
    http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...55747&z=15

    Pictures:
    See post #5 below or go to the City of Seattle link above.


    WHEN:
    TBA


    WHY:
    Nickels Gun Ban in Seattle
    http://www.cityofseattle.net/parks/P...earms_rule.pdf


    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...gunban14m.html


    This will be a protest gathering and possibly a picnic for Open Carry and Concealed Carry!!!

    This should be thought out and news stations should be notified once the plans for time and place are final.

  2. #2
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    swatspyder wrote:
    WHERE:
    Queen Anne Community Center 1901 1st Ave W, Seattle, WA (206) 386-4240
    or
    TBD

    WHEN:
    TBA

    WHY:
    Nickels Gun Ban in Seattle
    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...gunban14m.html


    This will be a protest gathering for Open Carry and Concealed Carry!!!

    This should be thought out and news stations should be notified once the plans for time and place are final.

    Queen Anne Community Center. It is fairly close to Seattle Center.


    I noticed that there is the QA Middle School right there next to the center... Might be a good or bad thing. Let me know.
    Only thing to consider is that the federal law requires you to be licensed by your state if you're in possession of a firearm within 1000 feet of school property. Unless you feel like challenging federal law, too, make sure you at least have a CPL (doesn't have to be on you).
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

  3. #3
    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    Tawnos wrote:
    swatspyder wrote:
    WHERE:
    Queen Anne Community Center 1901 1st Ave W, Seattle, WA (206) 386-4240
    or
    TBD

    WHEN:
    TBA

    WHY:
    Nickels Gun Ban in Seattle
    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...gunban14m.html


    This will be a protest gathering for Open Carry and Concealed Carry!!!

    This should be thought out and news stations should be notified once the plans for time and place are final.

    Queen Anne Community Center. It is fairly close to Seattle Center.


    I noticed that there is the QA Middle School right there next to the center... Might be a good or bad thing. Let me know.
    Only thing to consider is that the federal law requires you to be licensed by your state if you're in possession of a firearm within 1000 feet of school property. Unless you feel like challenging federal law, too, make sure you at least have a CPL (doesn't have to be on you).
    Well, we are going to have to find another center then since some people might not have their CPL.


    How about Alki Community Center, 59th Ave SW and SW Stevens St, just two blocks south of Alki Beach Park

  4. #4
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  5. #5
    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    M1Gunr wrote: Cal Anderson Park 1635 11th Ave, Seattle, WA

    http://www.cityofseattle.net/parks/p...il.asp?ID=3102








  6. #6
    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    We are going to have to keep an eye on what happens. Even if this is reversed before we have a time to gather, we will still make our position known by gathering for a victory party.

    Anyone have ideas for what day to get everyone together? I was thinking Saturday, November 7th?

  7. #7
    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
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    Tawnos wrote:
    Only thing to consider is that the federal law requires you to be licensed by your state if you're in possession of a firearm within 1000 feet of school property. Unless you feel like challenging federal law, too, make sure you at least have a CPL (doesn't have to be on you).
    Could you cite that please?
    "I'm just a no-account screed-peddler" Dave Workman http://goo.gl/CNf6pB

    "We ought to extend the [1994] assault weapons ban" George W Bush

    "The Bush Administration declared a permanent ban today on almost all foreign-made semiautomatic assault rifles." George Bush Sr, New York Times on July 8, 1989

    "I support the Brady bill and I urge the Congress to enact it without delay." Ronald Regan.

    "Guns are an abomination." Richard Nixon

  8. #8
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    Dave_pro2a wrote:
    Tawnos wrote:
    Only thing to consider is that the federal law requires you to be licensed by your state if you're in possession of a firearm within 1000 feet of school property. Unless you feel like challenging federal law, too, make sure you at least have a CPL (doesn't have to be on you).
    Could you cite that please?
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18...2----000-.html

    (A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

    (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm— (i) on private property not part of school grounds; (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;

    ...
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18...1----000-.html
    (25) The term “school zone” means— (A) in, or on the grounds of, a public, parochial or private school; or (B) within a distance of 1,000 feet from the grounds of a public, parochial or private school.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    swatspyder wrote:
    M1Gunr wrote: Cal Anderson Park 1635 11th Ave, Seattle, WA

    http://www.cityofseattle.net/parks/p...il.asp?ID=3102
    I like it!
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    just have to wait for the signs to go up

    and it its to be at cal anderson.



    then remove the other places from the first post

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    You have wait until the signs go up.

    Quoted from the PI blog.....
    Firearms will be prohibited at designated facilities only after signs are posted notifying visitors of the new rule, according to Nickels' office.
    Signs are expected to be posted at South Park Community Center, Garfield Community Center, and Bitter Lake Community Center by noon Friday.


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    Hold on every one. Last time this was discussed was last year at the folk life festival.
    The SAF said no they had other plans. Also a senior member of this foram his name is Grey works very close with the SAF. I would get his input first. This is serious everyone. Hold off!!

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    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    No matter what, state preemption still applies.

    RCW 9.41.290

    State preemption.

    The state of Washington hereby fully occupies and preempts the entire field of firearms regulation within the boundaries of the state, including the registration, licensing, possession, purchase, sale, acquisition, transfer, discharge, and transportation of firearms, or any other element relating to firearms or parts thereof, including ammunition and reloader components. Cities, towns, and counties or other municipalities may enact only those laws and ordinances relating to firearms that are specifically authorized by state law, as in RCW 9.41.300, and are consistent with this chapter. Such local ordinances shall have the same penalty as provided for by state law. Local laws and ordinances that are inconsistent with, more restrictive than, or exceed the requirements of state law shall not be enacted and are preempted and repealed, regardless of the nature of the code, charter, or home rule status of such city, town, county, or municipality.
    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.290

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    phone guy wrote:
    Hold on every one. Last time this was discussed was last year at the folk life festival.
    The SAF said no they had other plans. Also a senior member of this foram his name is Grey works very close with the SAF. I would get his input first. This is serious everyone. Hold off!!
    The ban took effect today and Cal Anderson Park was one of the first places posted, as some of my intel has stated. We will be asked to leave, and if we refuse, we WILL be hauled off in handcuffs and our guns taken from us. The city is looking for a huge media spectacle and said media will NOT be friendly to us at all.

    SAF has been waiting for them to finally "pull the trigger". I will be asking Dave to comment in this thread, and I will be contacting SAF tomorrow morning since I heard about this after business hours today.

    -Gray

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    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    Gray Peterson wrote:
    phone guy wrote:
    Hold on every one. Last time this was discussed was last year at the folk life festival.
    The SAF said no they had other plans. Also a senior member of this foram his name is Grey works very close with the SAF. I would get his input first. This is serious everyone. Hold off!!
    The ban took effect today and Cal Anderson Park was one of the first places posted, as some of my intel has stated. We will be asked to leave, and if we refuse, we WILL be hauled off in handcuffs and our guns taken from us. The city is looking for a huge media spectacle and said media will NOT be friendly to us at all.

    SAF has been waiting for them to finally "pull the trigger". I will be asking Dave to comment in this thread, and I will be contacting SAF tomorrow morning since I heard about this after business hours today.

    -Gray
    So how much money is in Seattle's budget for lawsuits against the city?

  16. #16
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    swatspyder wrote:
    Gray Peterson wrote:
    phone guy wrote:
    Hold on every one. Last time this was discussed was last year at the folk life festival.
    The SAF said no they had other plans. Also a senior member of this foram his name is Grey works very close with the SAF. I would get his input first. This is serious everyone. Hold off!!
    The ban took effect today and Cal Anderson Park was one of the first places posted, as some of my intel has stated. We will be asked to leave, and if we refuse, we WILL be hauled off in handcuffs and our guns taken from us. The city is looking for a huge media spectacle and said media will NOT be friendly to us at all.

    SAF has been waiting for them to finally "pull the trigger". I will be asking Dave to comment in this thread, and I will be contacting SAF tomorrow morning since I heard about this after business hours today.

    -Gray
    So how much money is in Seattle's budget for lawsuits against the city?
    I honestly don't know.

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    so when they arrest us andtoss us in jail. who's going to be my bitch?

    and I am sure we will be waiting awhile for the SAF.

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    "Going to the streets", while emotionally satisfying and mighty dramatic is usually the last choice of the experienced activist - because it's usually the least effective approach and unless you have an *extremely well-disciplined* group of experienced protest sorts...street protest has the probability and potential to go sideways in a screaming hurry and provide your opponents (Nickels & Co., in this instance) with all sorts of handy "angry crazy crowd" footage that can be used against your cause for YEARS.

    Grey insightfully notes that the City under the Nickels administration *wanting* a big hairy confrontation so they can be shown triumphantly suppressing the "bad scary gun owners", and in turn portray us as radical sorts that must be controlled for the good of the populace.

    Usually, it's a bad idea to give the hostiles what they want served up on a silver platter. Emotionally appealing as it might be, the discussed protest plays into the anti-gun sorts hands.

    HOWEVER, there are other, more effective, ways to...influence...the City. Nickels, as a lame duck, has no reason to listen. But the rest of the city does.

    CONSULT w/ SAF, but...when a city is 60 million in the hole, hundreds and hundreds of lawsuits alleging civil rights violations (and whatever else one can come up with) suddenly turning up on the docket...is attention-getting.

    Similarly, helping your neighbors file property tax appeals (fill out the paperwork for them, and drop it off for their signature, offering to mail it for them) and mailing the city a note thanking them for inspiring you to such efforts by the gun ban.

    Sudden support of I-1033 is another path to expressing dismay. While the lawsuits process through the courts, hitting the city again and again in the pocketbook (shop, whenever possible, outside city limits) obviously and subtly (file all the paperwork you can afford for whatever silly thing you can come up with to bog the city down in a sea of paper) is another approach....

    Of course, one must always keep up a steady stream of "thank you, the gun ban is inspiring me to this effort, I never knew civic activism could be so much fun" letters and comments...

    Show up at every civic hearing and meeting you can and comment at length on the topic of the day, but prefacing with "I'd like to thank Greg Nickels and his unlawful gun ban for inspiring me to be here tonight" every single time.

    It's more labor intensive than showing up and getting arrested, but it's more effective and you get to keep your CPL, too.

    GC

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    New from the Seattle Gun Rights Examiner:

    Seattle Mayor Greg Nickels has made the Seattleparks gun ban official, and the public reaction is overwhelmingly negative, setting the state for a legal confrontation.

    http://www.examiner.com/x-4525-Seattle-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m10d15-Nickels-makes-gun-ban-official-and-the-public-reacts



    Or try this:

    http://tinyurl.com/ylb7oqe



  20. #20
    Regular Member Batousaii's Avatar
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    - Being a former army sergeant in charge of various tactical decisions, i often found it prudent to take a minute and write down who was doing what, what we were doing, and what the next step would be if the plan succeeds...or.. if the plan failed, what were the consequences. Sometimes having that minute of clarity allowed me to analyse my tactics, thus smoothing the operation. As always, listening to the Sergeants above me with more experience proved invaluable.....acarefully calculated consortusually maximises the results....of course all plans are great until the first shot is fired.

    - Lets sort the puzzle pieces before we react.. it is obviously an illegal law(haha-rule), but what course of action will prove us to be the ones in the right, and the ones setting the example. Who the citizens as a whole cheer for is often defined by the image one is afforded through the oppositions actions.

    - I support a strong opposition, but lets think it out carefully, not to rush in where angels fear to tread..... Just my thoughts.

    Bat


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    I would like to see a continually rolling protest location where people come and go from until this gets changed, it's quite ridiculous.

    Seattle PD said they do not give warnings for people knowingly trespassing, they take the offender down to the station and interview them, then release upon no further issues. Though in no way should anyone resist arrest.

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    Criminal and Tyrannical governments NEVER listen to protests. They ignore letters. Their judges throw out cases against them. Their LEO blindly enforce the invalid rules.

    You can file your protests, letters and law suit. But should all that fail and they still enforce an illegal city ordnance, what will be your next step to show they are wrong and you are right? No country or government has ever steered away from tyranny and back to their republic ways without the use of force. You can't vote a a corrupt democracy back into a law abiding republic because once they have corrupted the election system, they control the whole thing.

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    That is why I am proposing a planning meeting at Manus resturant.I am seeinh knee jerk reactions and we need to all get on the same page or the media will shred us.a few of showing up at a park and getting hauled off in cuffs is going to accomplish nothing.Get all groups together and divise a quick decisive and rational strategy.You guys that understand the RCW"S the best could help those of that are a little weak.If we go off half cocked (pun intended) we will lose.

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    Regular Member kwiebe's Avatar
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    sirpuma wrote:
    Criminal and Tyrannical governments NEVER listen to protests. They ignore letters. Their judges throw out cases against them. Their LEO blindly enforce the invalid rules.

    You can file your protests, letters and law suit. But should all that fail and they still enforce an illegal city ordnance, what will be your next step to show they are wrong and you are right? No country or government has ever steered away from tyranny and back to their republic ways without the use of force. You can't vote a a corrupt democracy back into a law abiding republic because once they have corrupted the election system, they control the whole thing.
    Sadly, I couldn't find anything in the above to generally disagree with. I only wish it were a mere academic observation, as opposed to a description of our current trajectory.

    Better days are ahead, but we'll go through hell to reach them. In an odd way, it's really something to look forward to, once we're on the other side at least. We've been on a path to this for about 100 years - it's just that the pedal recently got pressed to the metal.

    Count me as thankful that the issue will at last be resolved.

  25. #25
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    Criminal and Tyrannical governments NEVER listen to protests. They ignore letters. Their judges throw out cases against them. Their LEO blindly enforce the invalid rules.

    You can file your protests, letters and law suit. But should all that fail and they still enforce an illegal city ordnance, what will be your next step to show they are wrong and you are right? No country or government has ever steered away from tyranny and back to their republic ways without the use of force. You can't vote a a corrupt democracy back into a law abiding republic because once they have corrupted the election system, they control the whole thing.
    Let's not be premature. If litigation and letters fail, other means remain wholly available to us ranging from bogging down and bankrupting the city in a flood of paper, political assaults on the municipal wallet, and good old fashioned street (and other) protests.

    I'm simply opposed to raising the Gadsden flag quite yet, BEFORE we've tried less drastic approaches. It's MUCH harder to back down from the more radical options than it is to rachet up.

    Let's wait until at least Monday or Tuesday for SAF to do their thing, and then meet to decide what (if any) further measures may be necessary to turn up the heat (or not).

    The civil rights movement managed to win a lot of battles with the odds heavily against - but the biggest wins were usually in back rooms and court rooms, not on the streets.

    GC

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