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Thread: So, how did you guys get unrestricted carry

  1. #1
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    I am living in the land of beer farts and cow pies, AKA Wisconsin.

    We are one of the last 2 states that has absolutely no provision for concealed carry, we do have Open-Carry available, but it has taken a few arrests and rights violation lawsuits to get it recognized as legal

    Our goal is to have unlicensed carry in this state just like you VT'ers have. What took place, did you have to fight the anti's real hard? did you not have any anti's to deal with?

    Please lay out a timeline and what provisions you had, and what got them to change to what you have now.

    Thanks,

    Harry N.

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    Unlicensed OC and CC are legal in Vermont because there is no law saying otherwise.

    There wasn't a legal fight to get there, it's just always been that way. There'spretty strong state constitutional support, too.

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    Actually there was a turn of the century (20th) court case that found that concealed carry is a constitutional right. Since then, it has been a free state, at least for firearms.

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    ianto94 wrote:
    Actually there was a turn of the century (20th) court case that found that concealed carry is a constitutional right. Since then, it has been a free state, at least for firearms.
    State v. Rosenthal. 1903. A city (Rutland)tried to ban carrying of firearms except with the police chief's permission. The state supreme court struck it down as a violation of the right to bear arms. We're very lucky we had some good judges on the court then. Consequently the state never went inthe direction our neighbors did in the 20th century with restricting carrying of guns. We were also a very rural state, not particularly wealthy, and for a long time had little law enforcement in most of the state. Guns were seen as useful and necessarytools, nothing else. I shudder to think of what would have happened after the 1960's onward invasion of the state by hippies/socialists/etc. if we didn't have that court decision and such a gun culture in place.

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    It's nice to see an eastern state with some common sense in regard to firearms. Good job Vermont! Here in the Cowboy state we have a pretty much laid back attitiude towards all firearms. You see some folks carrying openly and it usually provokes an inquiry as to what caliber it is and /or what make /model. We do have the problem of "Kalifornians" coming into the state and working in Law Enforcement positions. They are routinely educated in our culture. I'm wondering , do you have this problem with North eastern anti's? I don't know much about that part of the country.

  6. #6
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    wyocowboy,

    we do get rookie cops "not from around here", but they usually get schooled by the older, experienced officers pretty quickly and either get with the programme or move on to another state where the laws are more to their liking. i do remember hearing one newbie on my scanner, doing a traffic stop, seeing a .45 in plain sight next to the driver. he called it in to dispatch and she told him it was no problem, he then wasted about a half hour of the dispatcher and driver's time checking the law only to be told the onlylaw on the bookscovered loaded rifles and shotguns in a motor vehicle, and that law specifically exempted handguns by a written opinion, from the states attorney general, that rifles and shotguns are hunting weapons and will be transported unloaded, a handgun is a defensive weapon and may be transported loaded.

    "gunner"

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    ianto,

    see article 16 of the vermont state constitution



    http://www.usconstitution.net/vtconst.html#Article16



    article 17 is also interesting, banning the use of martial law against civilians other than if/when in active service in the militia.

    "gunner"


  8. #8
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    Nutczak wrote:
    I am living in the land of beer farts and cow pies, AKA Wisconsin.

    We are one of the last 2 states that has absolutely no provision for concealed carry, we do have Open-Carry available, but it has taken a few arrests and rights violation lawsuits to get it recognized as legal

    Our goal is to have unlicensed carry in this state just like you VT'ers have. What took place, did you have to fight the anti's real hard? did you not have any anti's to deal with?

    Please lay out a timeline and what provisions you had, and what got them to change to what you have now.

    Thanks,

    Harry N.
    We cheated. We never started down the restriction path at all.

    How do ya like them apples? :P

  9. #9
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    PavePusher wrote:
    Nutczak wrote:
    I am living in the land of beer farts and cow pies, AKA Wisconsin.

    We are one of the last 2 states that has absolutely no provision for concealed carry, we do have Open-Carry available, but it has taken a few arrests and rights violation lawsuits to get it recognized as legal

    Our goal is to have unlicensed carry in this state just like you VT'ers have. What took place, did you have to fight the anti's real hard? did you not have any anti's to deal with?

    Please lay out a timeline and what provisions you had, and what got them to change to what you have now.

    Thanks,

    Harry N.
    We cheated. We never started down the restriction path at all.

    How do ya like them apples? :P
    I wasn't aware that you can carry a concealed handgun in Arizona without a permit or license.

    Or are you referring to some other path?
    A. Gold

    Failure to comply may result in discipline up to and including termination.
    The free man is a warrior. - Nietzsche "Twilight of the Idols"

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    here's the text of the vermont supreme court decision on "state vs. rosenthal". i don't have a reference but the legislatore more recently, in i believe the late '60s or early '70s passed a law preempting the field of firearms legislation to the state.

    "gunner"


    http://www.guncite.com/court/state/55a610.html

  11. #11
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    Wow, that is great guys, I guess it is time for me to start looking up Alaska, and how they went about getting non-licensed carry.

    In WI he have 2, maybe3 cities that can be considered major population centers, The one that screws things up for the rest of the state is Milwaukee. The MKE police chief is in import from MA, and he brought his rabid anti-2A attitude with him.

    Have your VT'ers considered trying to get a voluntarypermit system so you can have reciprocity with other states without needing to get their specific permits? My understanding is that for a small fee, AK will issue you a carry permit just so you can carry in other states that recognize it. I think itmay be good for you too.

  12. #12
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    Nutczak.

    this is another era, with different judges and legislators, we might not get lucky this time. remember it was howlin' howie dean'ssupreme court that forced "civil unions" through the legislature. carpetbaggers and scalawags are not confined to the south.

  13. #13
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    You lucky dogs in Vermont! My "America over there" meter is off the charts! I'm jealous to be sure. Here were about to be sold down the river by our local governments, who are trying to break OC by "considering" to allow us CC. A shell game to be sure. Definitely more America where you guys are than here!

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    Shotgun wrote:
    PavePusher wrote:
    Nutczak wrote:
    I am living in the land of beer farts and cow pies, AKA Wisconsin.

    We are one of the last 2 states that has absolutely no provision for concealed carry, we do have Open-Carry available, but it has taken a few arrests and rights violation lawsuits to get it recognized as legal

    Our goal is to have unlicensed carry in this state just like you VT'ers have. What took place, did you have to fight the anti's real hard? did you not have any anti's to deal with?

    Please lay out a timeline and what provisions you had, and what got them to change to what you have now.

    Thanks,

    Harry N.
    We cheated. We never started down the restriction path at all.

    How do ya like them apples? :P
    I wasn't aware that you can carry a concealed handgun in Arizona without a permit or license.

    Or are you referring to some other path?
    Oops, sorry, I'm originally from Vermont, just temporarily located in AZ for the convenience of the Air Force. They have neglected to maintain a base in Vermont for MY convenience.

  15. #15
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    PavePusher wrote:
    Shotgun wrote:
    PavePusher wrote:
    Nutczak wrote:
    I am living in the land of beer farts and cow pies, AKA Wisconsin.

    We are one of the last 2 states that has absolutely no provision for concealed carry, we do have Open-Carry available, but it has taken a few arrests and rights violation lawsuits to get it recognized as legal

    Our goal is to have unlicensed carry in this state just like you VT'ers have. What took place, did you have to fight the anti's real hard? did you not have any anti's to deal with?

    Please lay out a timeline and what provisions you had, and what got them to change to what you have now.

    Thanks,

    Harry N.
    We cheated. We never started down the restriction path at all.

    How do ya like them apples? :P
    I wasn't aware that you can carry a concealed handgun in Arizona without a permit or license.

    Or are you referring to some other path?
    Oops, sorry, I'm originally from Vermont, just temporarily located in AZ for the convenience of the Air Force. They have neglected to maintain a base in Vermont for MY convenience.
    pavepusher,

    i thought there was an air nasty guard base up in northwestern vermont, or did they close it when i wasn't looking, anyway good luck on making it back to god's country, we need good vermonters to counter the granola addicts and birkenstock shufflers in burlington and montpeculiar.

    "gunner"

  16. #16
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    gunner wrote:
    PavePusher wrote:
    Shotgun wrote:
    PavePusher wrote:
    Nutczak wrote:
    I am living in the land of beer farts and cow pies, AKA Wisconsin.

    We are one of the last 2 states that has absolutely no provision for concealed carry, we do have Open-Carry available, but it has taken a few arrests and rights violation lawsuits to get it recognized as legal

    Our goal is to have unlicensed carry in this state just like you VT'ers have. What took place, did you have to fight the anti's real hard? did you not have any anti's to deal with?

    Please lay out a timeline and what provisions you had, and what got them to change to what you have now.

    Thanks,

    Harry N.
    We cheated. We never started down the restriction path at all.

    How do ya like them apples? :P
    I wasn't aware that you can carry a concealed handgun in Arizona without a permit or license.

    Or are you referring to some other path?
    Oops, sorry, I'm originally from Vermont, just temporarily located in AZ for the convenience of the Air Force. They have neglected to maintain a base in Vermont for MY convenience.
    pavepusher,

    i thought there was an air nasty guard base up in northwestern vermont, or did they close it when i wasn't looking, anyway good luck on making it back to god's country, we need good vermonters to counter the granola addicts and birkenstock shufflers in burlington and montpeculiar.

    "gunner"
    There is (or used to be) an ANG unit at Burlington Airport. Not sure I'm ready to go Guard just yet, got two more years Active Duty commitment before I have to decide what to do after AD retirement. It's on the short list, along with Salt Lake City.

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