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Thread: Detained at Lowe's Marero

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    So Sunday 3 weeks ago i was shoppin at Lowe's OCin like i do everytime i go in there, which isa minimum of 3x's a week. This time the MOD decided they dont' allow firearms in the store, but without saying anything to me he sent the JPSO detail to get me out the store. I was desarmed, handcuffed, and put in the back of his car for 30min while he ran me and my gun and then had to get permission from his Lt. to release me. Later that week i talked to the store manager and he said i was welcome in there at any time carrying. Then an hour later he called me back to say he spoke with HR and they told him that "any empolyee or anyone doing business with Lowe's is not allow to carry firearms" and he called JPSO and they gave him stuff like "can't carry on private property without consent". I tried to explain his HR department wouldn't have anything to do with a customer and that i have it in black and white that the SO was making stuff up but he refused to meet with me to look at it. So i called corporate and 3 different people told me today that "Lowe's policy is that the stores follow federal and state laws of where that store is located.", but they have to get a regional manager to look into the matter and he'll call me tomorrow sometime.

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    I wouldn't do businesswith them regardless of their decision now... They handled it poorly. You can't have a customer removed and handcuffed and then expect them to remain a patron. We dont need then, they need us. Thanks for the heads up witerango.

    Also, you wereremoved and "arrested" without reasonable suspision. A "1983" is in order.

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    Regular Member turbodog's Avatar
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    This may be of interest to you. It's from a previous thread on Lowes.

    Get in touch and see if this is still true and advise the lowes manager.
    I carry in the lowes in Hammond all the time (will be doing so this morning as a matter of fact). Never had any problems.

    And definitely pursue FOIA requests from JPSO.


    -----Original Message-----
    From: WeCare@Lowes.com [mailto:WeCare@Lowes.com]
    Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 7:45
    To: Stone, Jeffrey A PRC FRCNW
    Subject: EIT000001946692Lowes: (Order Questions)
    Replied On 8/7/2008 10:42:23 AM----------------------------------------
    Dear Jeff Stone:
    Thank you for giving Lowe's the opportunity to respond to your concerns regarding our
    policy on firearms in our stores.
    Lowe's currently does, and will continue to abide by federal, state and local laws
    regarding firearms, and we do not prohibit customers from carrying firearms into our
    stores.
    Our first and foremost concern is for the safety of our customers, however; we take all
    comments and concerns from our customers seriously. We are considerate of all
    customers, and will remain neutral regarding the right to carry firearms. We will respect
    federal, state and local laws regarding this.
    If Lowe's can be of further assistance, please do not hesitate to call 1-866-284-8989 or
    email execustservice@lowes.com. You may also contact us by mailing your
    correspondence to P.O. Box 1111, Mail Code CON8, North Wilkesboro, North Carolina
    28659.
    Thank you,
    Julie Holloway
    Lowe's Executive Customer Service
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Him: "I carry my gun concealed"
    Me: "You're not very good at it"
    Him: "What do you mean?"
    Me: "I know you have a gun"
    End of conversation.

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    turbodog wrote

    And definitely pursue FOIA requests from JPSO.

    Please explain FOIA ? something like fair information I'm guessing?

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    Freedom Of Information Act (foia)

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    I wasn't arrested just "detained" without cause, but it wasted alot of my time.

    turbo: that is exactly what they told me on the fone from 3 different agents. What exactly should i be requestion from JPSO?

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    There was a home depot in allentown, PA where something similar happened, it didn't turn out so well for the cop.

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    witerango wrote:
    I wasn't arrested just "detained" without cause, but it wasted alot of my time.
    That's not necessarily true... I remember learning this in law class a couple of years ago, but I can't find my notes at the moment. Here's what I remember...

    You are arrested when a police officer takes you into custody or otherwise deprives you of your freedom of movement in any significant way, in order to hold you to answer for a criminal offense. The fact that you have been deprived of your freedom of movement in some significant manner may amount legally to an arrest.

    If you were to pursue a federal civil suite, I would suggest you do some research to find out if what happened to you was actually an arrest.

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    georg jetson wrote:
    You are arrested when a police officer takes you into custody or otherwise deprives you of your freedom of movement in any significant way, in order to hold you to answer for a criminal offense.
    I agree with George. In a recent encounter I had with LEO, I kept using the term detained. I spoke to a lawyer about the whole thing, the lawyer told me if I asked the LEO "am i free to leave?" and the LEO tells me no, then I was under arrest (by the legal definition). Regardless of "charges filed" or "booked at the station", you WERE under arrest.

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    well my contacting lawyers over the past few weeks has proved nothing as there are no civil rights lawyers in the new orleans metro area. I've contacted one in Baton Rouge but he won't call me back and i did talk to a few criminal lawyers in Gretna and they all said "if i have a gun they can do whatever they want" one went was far to say "that apprently you know more about what the f***ing laws are than i do" and hung up on me

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    witerango wrote:
    ...i did talk to a few criminal lawyers in Gretna and they all said "if i have a gun they can do whatever they want" one went was far to say "that apprently you know more about what the f***ing laws are than i do" and hung up on me


    Lawyers....can't live wit 'em. Can't live witout 'em....

    Sorry you got hassled, witerango. Did the arresting officers seem to know what they were doing. What did they say while arresting you?

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    He was a member of LASER who was suppoesd to be on marine duty and got called to do a detail instead. Talking to another LEO "you can't expect him to know the laws cause he's never on the street." I wasn't to impressed with him. I had 10 sticks of 10' conduit on my shoulder and was lookin for an outlet when he walked up behind me told me to turn around slowly and asked if i was "26" as he disarmed me. than asked me to put mystuff down and handcuffed me and walked me out the store. put me in teh back of his unmarked unit while he ran my name and serial on my pistol (never asked for proof of ownership) then when i came back clean he uncuffed me put me back in his car and gave me my pistol back while waiting for clearance from his Lt. to release me.

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    i have a question.

    since you KNOW the law, then where in the LAW does it say you are required to have, or prove PROOF of ownership of any weapon other than NFA weapons in louisiana.

    you are pissed the cop didnt know the law. you open carry because you can, but then dont know the law pertaining to ownership?

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    witerango wrote:
    I wasn't arrested just "detained" without cause, but it wasted alot of my time.

    turbo: that is exactly what they told me on the fone from 3 different agents. What exactly should i be requestion from JPSO?
    I believe you would request copies of any phone calls (911) made to the sheriffs office relating to your incident, any radio calls by the sheriffs office relating to your incident and any documents (officers reports) relating to your incident.

    Some people have also requested copies of cell phone calls made by officers relating to an incident when they knew the officer was calling someone about it.

    You can also file a complaint with the internal affairs dept.

    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Him: "I carry my gun concealed"
    Me: "You're not very good at it"
    Him: "What do you mean?"
    Me: "I know you have a gun"
    End of conversation.

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    it not that i have to have proof it just that every time i've been pulled over i've been asked if i'm the owner or if i can prove it's mine. I'm guessing if there was an issue when they ran my nameand if i couldn't prove ownership on the spot then they would probably have ran the serial to see if it's stolen. BTW... i never said anything about any law about me haveing to prove anything.... so why the attack on me?

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    turbodog wrote:
    I believe you would request copies of any phone calls (911) made to the sheriffs office relating to your incident, any radio calls by the sheriffs office relating to your incident and any documents (officers reports) relating to your incident.

    Some people have also requested copies of cell phone calls made by officers relating to an incident when they knew the officer was calling someone about it.

    You can also file a complaint with the internal affairs dept.
    there were no 911 call made he made sure to inform me if there had then i would be under arrest for creating a disurbance. And i've given up on internal affiars... i had a LEO run a red light and would have ran right into the side of me had i not seen him coming... i had it on video and it was "insufficient" for them to do anything

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    Regular Member turbodog's Avatar
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    VORiaSOI wrote:
    i have a question.

    since you KNOW the law, then where in the LAW does it say you are required to have, or prove PROOF of ownership of any weapon other than NFA weapons in louisiana.

    you are pissed the cop didnt know the law. you open carry because you can, but then dont know the law pertaining to ownership?
    He never said he thought it was required, he just said the cop never asked for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Him: "I carry my gun concealed"
    Me: "You're not very good at it"
    Him: "What do you mean?"
    Me: "I know you have a gun"
    End of conversation.

  18. #18
    Regular Member turbodog's Avatar
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    witerango wrote:
    there were no 911 call made he made sure to inform me if there had then i would be under arrest for creating a disurbance.
    You would certainly have had grounds for a lawsuit if he had done that. The mere act of peaceably carrying a handgun in a holster doesn't fulfill the qualifications of "disturbance'.

    Well, it would make finding a lawyer easier anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Him: "I carry my gun concealed"
    Me: "You're not very good at it"
    Him: "What do you mean?"
    Me: "I know you have a gun"
    End of conversation.

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    Regular Member sraacke's Avatar
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    witerango- PM sent.

    Hope this helps.
    President/ Founding Member
    Louisiana Open Carry Awareness League
    www.laopencarry.org

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    im sorry. i didnt mean to sound like i was attacking you.

    i just was wondering where you thought you were required to prove ownership. just i guess its funny people are so positive they know the law, and love to argue with the police, but then really dont know all the laws, but expect the police to.

    before you guys get all wild and stuff, you have the entire internet at your disposal, and are trying to one up the cops and still slip up...... not that they dont need to slip up though.

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    Putting you in handcuffs and seizing your weapon was a violation of your 4th amendment rights. LEO's must think you have or are about to commit a crime before stopping you (Ohio vs. Terry). Refer to the case that just happened in New Mexico where the 9th district circuit court awarded a man $25k dollars when LEO's removed him from a movie theater and disarmed him. All he was doing was watching a movie. This cop illegally seized you and your firearm.

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    HankT wrote:
    witerango wrote:
    ...i did talk to a few criminal lawyers in Gretna and they all said "if i have a gun they can do whatever they want" one went was far to say "that apprently you know more about what the f***ing laws are than i do" and hung up on me


    Lawyers....can't live wit 'em. Can't live witout 'em....
    We CAN live without them. If your car is broken, do you abandon it because you can't find a mechanic... or do you learn how to fix it yourself?

    There's no need to talk to a criminal attorney if you haven't been charged with a crime.

    Filing a civil suit is not difficult, particularly a 42 USC 1983. Courts hold such pro se complaints to less stringent standards than formal pleadings drafted by an attorney and liberally construe such complaints when determining whether they state a cause of action. Alternatively, your first move does not have to be a federal suit. You can seek relief in a statecourt and you would probably have better luck finding council.

    Did you try contacting the ACLU?

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    The larger issue here is police miscnduct - attack both problems - Lowes + police

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    1Grizzly1 wrote:
    Putting you in handcuffs and seizing your weapon was a violation of your 4th amendment rights. LEO's must think you have or are about to commit a crime before stopping you (Ohio vs. Terry). Refer to the case that just happened in New Mexico where the 9th district circuit court awarded a man $25k dollars when LEO's removed him from a movie theater and disarmed him. All he was doing was watching a movie. This cop illegally seized you and your firearm.
    New Mexico is in the tenth district... I'd put a link here but you can justsearch "Mathew St John" and "federal court". Pick the article you want to read. This is binding in the tenth district only, but if the 5th district ruled contrary then the SCOTUS would take an appeal based on contradictory opinions.

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    The ACLU is a possible option... I suggest you look into it...



    http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/275781

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