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Thread: Fort Hood, Nidal Malik Hasan impeaches warriors, LEOs as trustworthy 'elites'.

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    A thought while sitting in Church and disarmed by the ignorant conspirators. How do we respond to "How can a citizen be trusted armed when an 'officer' may not be trustworthy?"

    Truly we are not equal.

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    First of all, I'm not sure when LEO's were trusted elites, ever and there have been LOTS of other people who impeached any trust long before Nidal.


    I don't think Nidal did anything to hurt the credibility of the everyday soldier

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    Certainly not the everyday soldier that may be, or have been, anyone of us, but as certainly the credibility of those that would deny the citizen-soldier his arms.

    Before I saw your reply I was going to add, consider that we commonly may not be armed in church, 'it won't happen here', even after Charl Van Wyk and the Saint James' Church Massacre, that he reported in Shooting Back, and which lesson has been repeated more than once again.

    Every 'leader' on whose watch disarmed/unarmed innocents are killed and that suggested that 'it can't happen here' must be unhorsed or demoted or unseated - forever impeached.

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    This is what I'm 'talking' about, the Department of Homeland Severity and

    Big Sis warns against anti-Muslim backlash...

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...Jh8owD9BR9GPG0

    Homeland chief warns against anti-Muslim backlash (AP) – 9 hours ago
    ABU DHABI, United Arab Emirates — The U.S. Homeland Security secretary says she is working to prevent a possible wave of anti-Muslim sentiment after the shootings at Fort Hood in Texas.
    Janet Napolitano says her agency is working with groups across the United States to try to deflect any backlash against American Muslims following Thursday's rampage by Army Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, a Muslim who reportedly expressed growing dismay over the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.
    The shootings left 13 people dead and 29 wounded.
    Napolitano was in the United Arab Emirates on Sunday for talks with security officials and a meeting with women university students in Abu Dhabi.


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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Doug,

    I see you are building windmills to tilt against again. Your quetion is not relevant, as it has nothing to do with either civilian carry or Nida's actions last Thursday (or his other actions prior to last Thursday).

    As a group we are declared even more law-abiding than the cops. That's nice, but it gets us nowhere when dealing with the spectacular behavior of some individual.

    Let's focus on this one person, see if the "experts" can come up with a plausable explanation for his behavior, and proceed from there. So far his behavior is an enigma with overtones of race/religion baiting.

    In the mean time, could we discuss what we as individuals and as a group ought to/agree to do about the one we see as acting a bit off the beam? The reluctance to turn in a felllow gunny seems to run high, even when all the hairs on the back of your neck are standing at attention. I'm all for having a quiet personal conversation with someone, but if that leaves me still feeling like I need to find cover and plausable deniability I'm not sure I want to leave it at that. Then again, having been on one side of the fence professionally, I'm not sure I want to see everybody turning in the next guy on the street just because they are a little odd (what would happen to me? would I be one of the first to go?).

    stay safe.

    skidmark
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    I too sat in church this morning and only one other knew I was weighted to the side of not being defenseless. She backing up my 1911 with her Kel-Tec 9. I have a need, you see.

    I don't feel so motivated to determine accurately the total number of personnel in the service of their county - then divide that into the incidents wherein one of them caused injury or death with a gun to non-combatant victims - willing to bet that the resultant ratio would extremely low. Perhaps even with 4 or 5 zeros following the decimal point.

    Perhaps I am the one with cloven hooves, as in most of my waking hours I am more equal than those entrusted to "protect us from enemies, domestic and foreign" when they are American soil.

    A man may be my brother, but when he insults the standard of conduct by word or deed, at the very least he ceases to be my friend. He may quickly transition to being considered dangerous/enemy if his conduct is egregious enough and I will do what I think is correct to rectify that.

    My decision will not be based on the color of his uniform or his face; rather by his conduct, beliefs and rhetoric. To that degree, sir, we are all equal.

    Knee jerk reactions benfite no one. Carefully thought, common sense and deliberate follow through will likely produce better results.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member SouthernBoy's Avatar
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    Master Doug Huffman wrote:
    A thought while sitting in Church and disarmed by the ignorant conspirators. How do we respond to "How can a citizen be trusted armed when an 'officer' may not be trustworthy?"

    Truly we are not equal.
    Simple. We own the military - all of it. Since we are their superiors, it is we, if anyone, who should remained armed at all times.

    In the final seconds of your life, just before your killer is about to dispatch you to that great eternal darkness, what would you rather have in your hand? A cell phone or a gun?

    Si vis pacem, para bellum.

    America First!

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    SouthernBoy wrote:
    Master Doug Huffman wrote:
    A thought while sitting in Church and disarmed by the ignorant conspirators. How do we respond to "How can a citizen be trusted armed when an 'officer' may not be trustworthy?"

    Truly we are not equal.
    Simple. We own the military - all of it. Since we are their superiors, it is we, if anyone, who should remained armed at all times.
    +1...........if kimberly munley hadnt been armed.........i dont want to think of how many more would have been killed. i condem him for his actions, and commend her for hers.

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    http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/fort-h...ory?id=9030873

    U.S. intelligence agencies were aware months ago that Army Major Nidal Hasan was attempting to make contact with people associated with al Qaeda, two American officials briefed on classified material in the case told ABC News.

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    i sense a disturbance in the force............this is the 2nd time that the US government knew about a terrorist tardo and his plans to kill americans and did NOTHING!..........de-ja-vu anyone?

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    None dare call it terrorism.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...vdr8WBocxSgNUI

    Army massacre fiend Nidal Malik Hasan attended a Virginia mosque at the same time as two of the 9/11 hijackers -- and the FBI is now investigating whether there is a connection between the men, an official confirmed yesterday.

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    skidmark wrote:
    Doug,

    I see you are building windmills to tilt against again. Your quetion is not relevant, as it has nothing to do with either civilian carry or Nida's actions last Thursday (or his other actions prior to last Thursday).

    As a group we are declared even more law-abiding than the cops. That's nice, but it gets us nowhere when dealing with the spectacular behavior of some individual.

    Let's focus on this one person, see if the "experts" can come up with a plausable explanation for his behavior, and proceed from there. So far his behavior is an enigma with overtones of race/religion baiting.

    In the mean time, could we discuss what we as individuals and as a group ought to/agree to do about the one we see as acting a bit off the beam? The reluctance to turn in a felllow gunny seems to run high, even when all the hairs on the back of your neck are standing at attention. I'm all for having a quiet personal conversation with someone, but if that leaves me still feeling like I need to find cover and plausable deniability I'm not sure I want to leave it at that. Then again, having been on one side of the fence professionally, I'm not sure I want to see everybody turning in the next guy on the street just because they are a little odd (what would happen to me? would I be one of the first to go?).

    stay safe.

    skidmark


    Hitting the nail on the head as usual. The above is much more relevant than the original topic.

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    Master Doug Huffman wrote:
    None dare call it terrorism.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...vdr8WBocxSgNUI

    Army massacre fiend Nidal Malik Hasan attended a Virginia mosque at the same time as two of the 9/11 hijackers -- and the FBI is now investigating whether there is a connection between the men, an official confirmed yesterday.
    Heck im a Enlisted Marine............i will flat out call it terrorisim. the man does not deserve the titles "american" or "soldier" in his name. In my mind any man who ruthlessly murders 12 soldiers is and always will be a terrorist. I would glady put a round in his face right now. Wouldnt bring back the soldiers we lost, but it would sure as hell make me feel better.

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    jay75009 wrote:
    Master Doug Huffman wrote:
    None dare call it terrorism.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...vdr8WBocxSgNUI

    Army massacre fiend Nidal Malik Hasan attended a Virginia mosque at the same time as two of the 9/11 hijackers -- and the FBI is now investigating whether there is a connection between the men, an official confirmed yesterday.
    Heck im a Enlisted Marine............i will flat out call it terrorisim. the man does not deserve the titles "american" or "soldier" in his name. In my mind any man who ruthlessly murders 12 soldiers is and always will be a terrorist. I would glady put a round in his face right now. Wouldnt bring back the soldiers we lost, but it would sure as hell make me feel better
    That, sir, is the very type of response that is seen as detrimental to our cause. It states a willingness for illegal action, vigilantism not unlike that which Jack Ruby undertook. No matter how horrific the deed at Ft. Hood, the threat is over and now it is up to the legal process not the individual.

    It may well have been and act of terrorism. Surely there are some signs of that - time will tell. While Hasan was by act of congress an officer and a gentleman, I have no doubt he will be relieved of that and much more in due course.

    Nothing will bring back those lost. Had Hasan died at the scene or shortly thereafter, you wouldn't likely have been moved to make such statements. I understand the emotion, but we must be better than that.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    do you really? do you really understand the emotion? have you served? have you watched terrorists and islamic extremists kill your friends? have you held someone you grew up with in your arms as they died because of a man like him?

    if not you understand nothing. everyone asks me why i carry. people like HIM are the reason, not because its my right, not because i have a cause. but because there are people who want to kill every american there is in a absolutely un-just, and insane jihad war.

    you have the right to believe the criminal system should take care of him. lock him up. interrogate him. give him a lawyer. a fair trial. the chance to be heard and attempt to justify his actions. that is your right.

    my right as a soldier , and someone who has sworn to defend this country and die for the people in it........is to openly admit as any other soldier would......that man should have died that day, he doesnt deserve to be heard, seen or thought of again.

    you can call me wrong for saying if i could i would remove him from this planet. that is your right. but my right is to believe that he deserves exactly that. and not a stitch more.

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    jay75009 wrote:
    do you really? do you really understand the emotion? have you served? have you watched terrorists and islamic extremists kill your friends? have you held someone you grew up with in your arms as they died because of a man like him?

    if not you understand nothing. everyone asks me why i carry. people like HIM are the reason, not because its my right, not because i have a cause. but because there are people who want to kill every american there is in a absolutely un-just, and insane jihad war.

    you have the right to believe the criminal system should take care of him. lock him up. interrogate him. give him a lawyer. a fair trial. the chance to be heard and attempt to justify his actions. that is your right.

    my right as a soldier , and someone who has sworn to defend this country and die for the people in it........is to openly admit as any other soldier would......that man should have died that day, he doesnt deserve to be heard, seen or thought of again.

    you can call me wrong for saying if i could i would remove him from this planet. that is your right. but my right is to believe that he deserves exactly that. and not a stitch more.
    Somebody should'a dubble-tapped the traitorous Islamoterrorist bastard 'n been done with him. 'Act of War? OK... game on!

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    Sonora Rebel wrote:
    jay75009 wrote:
    do you really? do you really understand the emotion? have you served? have you watched terrorists and islamic extremists kill your friends? have you held someone you grew up with in your arms as they died because of a man like him?

    if not you understand nothing. everyone asks me why i carry. people like HIM are the reason, not because its my right, not because i have a cause. but because there are people who want to kill every american there is in a absolutely un-just, and insane jihad war.

    you have the right to believe the criminal system should take care of him. lock him up. interrogate him. give him a lawyer. a fair trial. the chance to be heard and attempt to justify his actions. that is your right.

    my right as a soldier , and someone who has sworn to defend this country and die for the people in it........is to openly admit as any other soldier would......that man should have died that day, he doesnt deserve to be heard, seen or thought of again.

    you can call me wrong for saying if i could i would remove him from this planet. that is your right. but my right is to believe that he deserves exactly that. and not a stitch more.
    Somebody should'a dubble-tapped the traitorous Islamoterrorist bastard 'n been done with him. 'Act of War? OK... game on!
    exactly my point, i commend the woman who shot him, i really do, god bless her......only mistake she made was not putting 2 in his head after he went down

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    Nyaah, we can learn what he knows before he meets his 72 virgins. The waterboard should break him just as it has the others.

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    Master Doug Huffman wrote:
    Nyaah, we can learn what he knows before he meets his 72 virgins. The waterboard should break him just as it has the others.
    ohhh no 72 virgins for this one, he took these peoples lives and futures, we shoudl do the same, if we covor him in pigs blood, he will be un-clean......and allah wont want his A$$.........then he goes to hell too :-D he deserves it.

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    Whaat, you mean that everyone does not use bacon grease for bullet lube?

    I wonder if it's like vermouth in a martini, a really-dry dry martini is only shown the vermouth bottle, a dry martini might get an aerosol spritz or a glass rinese in vermouth. The classic martini is five or six parts of gin to one part of vermouth.

    So dilute the lard with ethanol and spray it with an aerosol, 1 microGram per bullet.

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    well they believe the body contains the soul, it is a temple..........and when they become a marter......the soul is released to allah............but not if the soul is screwed with lovely bacon grease before it exits the building...........i like your thinking brother :-D

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    jay75009 wrote:
    do you really? do you really understand the emotion? have you served? have you watched terrorists and islamic extremists kill your friends? have you held someone you grew up with in your arms as they died because of a man like him?

    if not you understand nothing. everyone asks me why i carry. people like HIM are the reason, not because its my right, not because i have a cause. but because there are people who want to kill every american there is in a absolutely un-just, and insane jihad war.

    you have the right to believe the criminal system should take care of him. lock him up. interrogate him. give him a lawyer. a fair trial. the chance to be heard and attempt to justify his actions. that is your right.

    my right as a soldier , and someone who has sworn to defend this country and die for the people in it........is to openly admit as any other soldier would......that man should have died that day, he doesnt deserve to be heard, seen or thought of again.

    you can call me wrong for saying if i could i would remove him from this planet. that is your right. but my right is to believe that he deserves exactly that. and not a stitch more.
    You misdirect the intent of my posting.

    It does not challenge your emotion, the righteousness of defense of one's country nor the pain of losing someone dear to you, particularly in combat. Yes, jihad is arguably the greatest evil we as free people have ever encountered.

    Nevertheless, we are a nation of laws and morals. You have the privilege of volunteering and I thank you for exercising that. You have a duty to obey our laws as well as the orders of your superiors, including the rules of engagement.

    In many ways, I would have preferred that Hasan had not survived, but he has and might have information about others - speculation perhaps, but such could save other lives. I doubt that he shall receive a free pass.

    To suggest that you would go outside our laws and morals to gladly deal with him in such a fashion is not worthy of you. It is emotion not tempered with wisdom.

    To put things in perspective, I would be one of those you would have to go through to get to him in such a manner. I have been there before - it was my job, my obligation. Additionally, it is a violation of the very precepts of OCDO - that we post and conduct ourselves legally, with responsibility and to be aware that it is a public forum, scrutinized by many.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Somebody already thought of this, and is making it commercially. It's pretty good stuff, actually. Apparently, several SEALS, Special forces, and Marine Recon troops think it's good stuff too...

    http://www.silverbulletgunoil.net/

    I give a little bottle to every friend or relative who deploys...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggressionand this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    i am so ordering that! and lubing every gun and knife i have :-)

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    Grapeshot wrote:
    I too sat in church this morning and only one other knew I was weighted to the side of not being defenseless.* She backing up my 1911 with her Kel-Tec 9.* I have a need, you see.
    Wish we could carry in our church.... school grounds though

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