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Thread: Brady Campaign, "Guns in the Home"

  1. #1
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    Well I was just browsing the Brady Campaign to see what OC.org is up against. So I charted browsing based on images and was wondering where I could find the most argumentative statements.

    I understand the background checks and all but recently its becoming more and more ridiculous. I am all for taking the weapons out of the hands of criminals but they are starting to take them out of everyone's hands. Too far...

    Anyways while browsing for these misleading facts here is what I find the most oblivious.

    [img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-1.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-2.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-3.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-4.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-5.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-6.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-7.png[/img]


    Click.




    Who the hell would leave a loaded weapon anywhere near a child under the age of 16 when you are not around. Most, if not all, of us lock them up in that 5 ton thing we call a safe. If you don't then you are asking for trouble... If your child does shoot him or herself with a loaded firearm that hasn't been locked up then you will most likely be facing a lot of jail time.

    PROBLEM: Keeping a gun in the home increases the risk of injury and death. Gun owners may overestimate the benefits of keeping a gun in the home and underestimate the risks.
    There are risks and we compensate for them.

    4.
    DID YOU KNOW? Where there are more guns, there are more gun deaths.
    So, what your telling me is the same as saying where there are more coconuts, there are more coconut related deaths? For example, in Hawaii people die from falling fruit more often than Virginia. There is risk involved in everything, where there are more falling fruit more people die.

    FYI, guns don't kill people... people kill people.

    3.
    DID YOU KNOW? Keeping a gun in the home raises the risk of homicide.
    Lets do some math.


    Lets take the maker of the Glock and the maker of the 1911.

    (Gun Related Deaths / Gun Owners) *100 = Percentage of Deaths per Gun Owner

    * Gun owners are calculated upon the amount of weapons per 100 peoples. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._gun_ownership

    Austria: (18 / 2,590,130) * 100 = 0.0007%
    USA: (10,177 / 277,108,200) * 100 = 0.0036%

    Alright, we have a slightly high percentage but how many of those deaths occurred from weapons that were not documented and/or stolen. Also, last time I checked, Austria doesn't have a gang problem. We do... Take the guns away from the criminals and leave us be. This is still a blue moons chance that a legal gun owner might commit murder.

    Frankly, I doubt in Austria they have to defend themselves from criminals as much.

    2.
    DID YOU KNOW? Keeping a gun in the home raises the risk of suicide.
    Hm...

    Again, most gun related suicides are in acts of desperation and irrational thinking. Frankly this doesn't bother me because it was that person's decision. People with these problems can usually be picked out by friends but sometimes it is just too late. When someone has these thoughts they are most likely going to try and find the easiest way out. I am sure if guns were never invented then the amount out suicides would still be the same, just by different means.

    For them they will choose the easiest way out, don't blame the gun, blame the person behind the trigger.

    1.
    DID YOU KNOW? Many children and teens live in homes with firearms, including ones that are loaded and unlocked.

    Between 6% and 14% of firearm owning households with a child under 18 have an unlocked and loaded firearm.
    Ok, out of the 6 to 14 percent how many had adult supervision around the weapon. I.E. CARRYING IT! It does not say, thus it does not tell the full story.

    There are plenty more but I need to be headin home. Its been a long day at work.


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    97 guns for every 100 people?? thats way too low! we need like 300 guns for every 100 people. that way we can all have a rifle, shotgun, and pistol

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    r6-rider wrote:
    97 guns for every 100 people?? thats way too low! we need like 300 guns for every 100 people. that way we can all have a rifle, shotgun, and pistol
    If every law abiding citizen would carry competently than there would be very very little crime.

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    Remember, Australia (and I think most, if not all of the places on the list) doesn't have any guns!!!! They banned guns years ago! So, how can they have ANY firearm related incidents if they don't have any guns!? To have this discussion intelligently (I know, impossible for the Brady Bunch, but humor me for a minute) we must look at percentages! Lets try How many firearm related incidents per LEGAL gun owner vs percentage of Illegal gun owners! I bet the number change drastically!!!

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    Gator5713 wrote:
    Remember, Australia (and I think most, if not all of the places on the list) doesn't have any guns!!!! They banned guns years ago! So, how can they have ANY firearm related incidents if they don't have any guns!? To have this discussion intelligently (I know, impossible for the Brady Bunch, but humor me for a minute) we must look at percentages! Lets try How many firearm related incidents per LEGAL gun owner vs percentage of Illegal gun owners! I bet the number change drastically!!!
    Oh yes. But remember, I used Austria not Australia.

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    97 guns for every 100 people, huh? I'd say we're doing pretty good. :P

    Oh, and who cares about total gun related deaths? That's a worthless number. Let's see the per-capita homicide rate instead.

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    Well, now. My latest tally here was about 75 guns I own. Their figures are way too low.

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    Mike_Hawke wrote:
    97 guns for every 100 people, huh? I'd say we're doing pretty good. :P

    Oh, and who cares about total gun related deaths? That's a worthless number. Let's see the per-capita homicide rate instead.
    The year 2005 was overall the safest year in the past thirty years. The recent overall decrease has reflected upon all significant types of crime, with all violent and property crimes having decreased and reached an all-time low. The homicide rate in particular has decreased over 42% between its record high point in 1991 and 2005.

    Recently, however, the homicide rate has stagnated.[8][/suP] While the homicide rate decreased continuously between 1991 and 2000 from 9.8 homicides per 100,000 persons to 5.5 per 100,000, it has remained level through 2005. In the years between 2000 and 2005 the homicide rate has remained at an all-time low between 5.5 and 5.7 homicides per 100,000 individuals.

    Despite the recent stagnation of the homicide rate, however, property and violent crimes overall have continued to decrease, though at a considerably slower pace than in the 1990s.[8][/suP] Overall, the crime rate in the U.S. was the same in 2004 as in 1969, with the homicide rate being roughly the same as in 1966. Violent crime overall, however, is still at the same level as in 1974, despite having decreased steadily since 1991.[7][/suP]




    Crime Rate[7][/suP][11][/suP]
    1960
    1961
    1963
    1965
    1967
    1969
    1971
    1973
    1975
    1977
    1979
    1981
    1983
    1985
    1987
    1989
    1991
    1993
    1995
    1997
    1999
    2001
    2003
    2005
    2008

    Violent crime rate
    160.9
    158.1
    168.2
    200.2
    253.2
    328.7
    396.0
    417.4
    487.8
    475.9
    548.9
    594.3
    537.7
    556.6
    609.7
    663.1
    758.1
    746.8
    684.6
    610.8
    523.0
    504.4
    475.8
    469.2
    454.5

    Homicide rate
    5.1
    4.8
    4.6
    5.1
    6.2
    7.3
    8.6
    9.4
    9.6
    8.8
    9.8
    9.8
    8.3
    8.0
    8.3
    8.7
    9.8
    9.5
    8.2
    6.8
    5.7
    5.6
    5.7
    5.6
    5.4

    Property crime rate
    1,726
    1,747
    2,012
    2,249
    2,736
    3,351
    3,769
    3,737
    4,811
    4,602
    5,017
    5,264
    4,637
    4,650
    4,940
    5,078
    5,140
    4,738
    4,591
    4,312
    3,744
    3,656
    3,591
    3,430
    3,213


    It looks like you are substantially more likely to be a victim of violent crime even murder than a gun related death in your home. So it is statistically worth the risk to avert becoming a victim.

    Also where I lived when I had my first apartment simply you are a fool if you didn't have a weapon. Check out Youngstown, Ohio.

    http://www.cityrating.com/citycrime....n&state=OH

    Now here is something worth chewing on. I lived there for two years. Six murders occured within four blocks of my home in that time frame. I was one of about 6 white people within a four block radius and govt housing was right around the corner. I never experienced a single problem. I met lots of nice people and saw both sides of the welfare coin, positive and negative. I saw people utilizing the system to get on their feet and moving up. Majority of people on welfare that I encountered were not that way.

    I just think based on my own life experience that those involved with drugs and other pools of individuals that commit crime are those being shot (most of the time). That is why I think, even as a substantial minority in the ghetto I did not have problems. I simply am not part of the drug game and do not infringe on others rights. I imagine that being on the right side of the law is the best deterrent, for everything else there is Kimbercard!



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    eddyys wrote:
    The answer is clear... we must sell more Glocks in the US =)

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    eddyys wrote:
    Well I was just browsing the Brady Campaign to see what OC.org is up against.┬* So I charted browsing based on images and was wondering where I could find the most argumentative statements.

    I understand the background checks and all but recently its becoming more and more ridiculous.┬* I am all for taking the weapons out of the hands of criminals but they are starting to take them out of everyone's hands.┬* Too far...

    Anyways while browsing for these misleading facts here is what I find the most oblivious.

    [img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-1.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-2.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-3.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-4.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-5.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-6.png[/img][img]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/eon/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-7.png[/img]


    Click.




    Who the hell would leave a loaded weapon anywhere near a child under the age of 16 when you are not around.┬* Most, if not all, of us lock them up in that 5 ton thing we call a safe.┬* If you don't then you are asking for trouble...┬* If your child does shoot him or herself with a loaded firearm that hasn't been locked up then you will most likely be facing a lot of jail time.

    PROBLEM: Keeping a gun in the home increases the risk of injury and death. Gun owners may overestimate the benefits of keeping a gun in the home and underestimate the risks.
    There are risks and we compensate for them.
    ┬*
    4.
    DID YOU KNOW? Where there are more guns, there are more gun deaths.
    So, what your telling me is the same as saying where there are more coconuts, there are more coconut related deaths?┬* For example, in Hawaii people die from falling fruit more often than Virginia.┬* There is risk involved in everything, where there are more falling fruit more people die.

    FYI, guns don't kill people... people kill people.

    3.┬*
    DID YOU KNOW? Keeping a gun in the home raises the risk of homicide.
    Lets do some math.


    Lets take the maker of the Glock and the maker of the 1911.

    (Gun Related Deaths / Gun Owners) *100 = Percentage of Deaths per Gun Owner

    * Gun owners are calculated upon the amount of weapons per 100 peoples.┬* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._gun_ownership

    Austria: (18 / 2,590,130) * 100 = 0.0007%
    USA: (10,177 / 277,108,200) * 100 = 0.0036%

    Alright, we have a slightly high percentage but how many of those deaths occurred from weapons that were not documented and/or stolen.┬* Also, last time I checked, Austria doesn't have a gang problem.┬* We do...┬* Take the guns away from the criminals and leave us be.┬* This is still a blue moons chance that a legal gun owner might commit murder.

    Frankly, I doubt in Austria they have to defend themselves from criminals as much.┬*

    2.
    DID YOU KNOW? Keeping a gun in the home raises the risk of suicide.
    Hm...

    Again, most gun related suicides are in acts of desperation and irrational thinking.┬* Frankly this doesn't bother me because it was that person's decision.┬* People with these problems can usually be picked out by friends but sometimes it is just too late.┬* When someone has these thoughts they are most likely going to try and find the easiest way out.┬* I am sure if guns were never invented then the amount out suicides would still be the same, just by different means.┬*

    For them they will choose the easiest way out, don't blame the gun, blame the person behind the trigger.

    1.
    DID YOU KNOW? Many children and teens live in homes with firearms, including ones that are loaded and unlocked.

    Between 6% and 14% of firearm owning households with a child under 18 have an unlocked and loaded firearm.
    Ok, out of the 6 to 14 percent how many had adult supervision around the weapon.┬* I.E. CARRYING IT!┬* It does not say, thus it does not tell the full story.

    There are plenty more but I need to be headin home.┬* Its been a long day at work.
    The glowing "we sell guns" billboard is a political parody sign that a young "social entrepreneur" erected. He was profiled in some business magazine. He claims, as usualy, to "support gun rights" but feels that "firearms are still too accessible."

  11. #11
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    Mike_Hawke wrote:
    97 guns for every 100 people, huh? I'd say we're doing pretty good. :P

    Oh, and who cares about total gun related deaths? That's a worthless number. Let's see the per-capita homicide rate instead.
    Any child could compare total populations between any of the countries mentioned the United States and see the whole thing is nonsense.

    When any imbecile tries these sorts of rhetorical tricks, I just ask, how many STABBINGS were there in the respective countries? There are a LOT more of us and we kill a LOT more of us, with ALL means, including frozen legs of lamb.

    If you have to lie to make your point, you don't HAVE a point. The only pack of pathological liars who even approach anti-gunners are Holocaust deniers and by personal experience, there's a lot of overlap between the two groups.
    --- Gun control: The theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists.

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    Deanimator wrote:
    including frozen legs of lamb.
    I'm sorry, I am going to have to ask you to cite your source.

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    Deanimator wrote:
    When any imbecile tries these sorts of rhetorical tricks, I just ask, how many STABBINGS were there in the respective countries? .


    Yes, that was exactly my point. GUN homicides are irrelevant. I want to see TOTAL. Your country isn't any safer if the gun killers just go grab knives, bats, axes, etc. instead.

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    Deanimator wrote:
    If you have to lie to make your point, you don't HAVE a point. The only pack of pathological liars who even approach anti-gunners are Holocaust deniers and by personal experience, there's a lot of overlap between the two groups.
    ....um... wtf?

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    eddyys wrote:
    Also, last time I checked, Austria doesn't have a gang problem.┬* We do...
    I prefer to think of it as a prohibition problem.

    Drugs are prohibited in Europe (and Australia, since you mention it), but there is generally little enforcement. Drug dealers are generally left unmolested as long as they don't commit acts of violence.

    Here in America, we wage "war" on nonaggressive behavior.

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    Hey! A red-white-and-blue Python!!! COOL!

    But wait! "Guns murdered" all those people? Why haven't the guns been arrested, given a trial by a jury of their peers (imagine Eric Holder talking to 12 assorted revolvers) and executed ?

    Seriously, that "murdered" figure is the figure for ALL firearms deaths, including accidental and justifiable, which ain't murder. And it is about the same figure as for automobile accidents. NOBODY (except maybe Luddites) says automobiles are responsible for MURDER. Sheesh.

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    Mike_Hawke wrote:
    Deanimator wrote:
    If you have to lie to make your point, you don't HAVE a point. The only pack of pathological liars who even approach anti-gunners are Holocaust deniers and by personal experience, there's a lot of overlap between the two groups.
    ....um... wtf?
    I've got a lot of experience with both anti-gunners and Holocaust deniers in usenet. Not only do they use the same mendacious rhetorical tricks, they often share the same opinions on race. The anti-gunners frequently felt that it was ok for them to use racial epithets against Black people who refused to support repressive gun controls merely because a White anti-gunner told them to. Some of them actually denied the Holocaust. For a little education on the racial attitudes of anti-gunners, do a Google Groups search in soc.culture.african.american.moderated on "Rack Jite". It's not too often that you can see somebody bring Black Democrats, Republicans, liberals, conservatives and even socialists together in such unanimous... contempt.

    There's a big slice of the anti-gun movement that's not afraid of guns. They're afraid of BLACK people (and Jews) with guns.
    --- Gun control: The theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists.

  18. #18
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    canadian wrote:
    Deanimator wrote:
    including frozen legs of lamb.
    I'm sorry, I am going to have to ask you to cite your source.
    As I recall, it was discussed rather extensively in usenet back in the late '80s.
    --- Gun control: The theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists.

  19. #19
    Lone Star Veteran Gator5713's Avatar
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    In 2006, Guns Murdered:
    Why are we killing so many guns? What did they ever do that they weren't 'instructed' to by a human?


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    Perhaps this would be a good time to remind the Brady Campaign to Promote NWO Sanctioned Global Genocide, about the following inconvenient historical truths:

    "Innocents Betrayed"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwdO2FLg1Rs


    from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_..._the_Holocaust

    In every ghetto, in every deportation train, in every labor camp, even in the death camps, the will to resist was strong, and took many forms. Fighting with the few weapons that would be found, individual acts of defiance and protest, the courage of obtaining food and water under the threat of death, the superiority of refusing to allow the Germans their final wish to gloat over panic and despair.

    Even passivity was a form of resistance. To die with dignity was a form of resistance. To resist the demoralizing, brutalizing force of evil, to refuse to be reduced to the level of animals, to live through the torment, to outlive the tormentors, these too were acts of resistance. Merely to give a witness of these events in testimony was, in the end, a contribution to victory. Simply to survive was a victory of the human spirit.
    Perhaps these are the acts of resistance the Brady Bunch would have preferred against the use of evil? What were the Jews supposed to fight the Nazi's with Brady Bunch, flaming butter cups?

    Between April and May 1943, Jewish men and women of the Warsaw ghetto took up arms and revolted against the Nazis after it became clear that the Germans were deporting remaining Ghetto inhabitants to the Treblinka extermination camp. Warsaw Jews of the ┼╗ydowski Zwi─ůzek Wojskowy, and the ┼╗ydowska Organizacja Bojowa attacked the Germans and their collaborators with a handful of small arms and Molotov cocktails. After fierce fighting, vastly superior German forces pacified the Warsaw Ghetto and either murdered or deported all of the remaining inhabitants to the Nazi killing centers.
    Yeah, Brady Bunch, the Jews lost in their uprisings, only because of the authoritarian gun control restrictions and confiscations that you are promoting here in America.

    How many millions of people have to die from state sponsored genocide in the future because of your efforts, before people with irrational Hoplophobia such as yourselves finally understand that only an armed population can resist state sanctioned genocide?

    History has the tendency of repeating itself, but the Holocaust does not have to happen again, perhaps here in America, as long as the NRA and the GOA are around to fend off statist authoritarians like you who would unknowingly help tyrants disarm their victims.

    You guys like statistics? How about the hundreds of millions killed after firearms disarmament?

    The Mother of All Stats The Human Cost of "Gun Control" Ideas

    http://www.jpfo.org/filegen-a-m/deathgc.htm#chart

    Government: Nazi Germany & Occupied Europe
    Dates:1933-1945
    Targets: Political opponents; Jews; Gypsies; critics; "examples"
    Civilians Killed: 20 million
    "GunControl"Laws: Law on Firearms & Ammun., 1928
    Weapon Law, March 18, 1938
    Regulations against Jews, 1938

    FeaturesofOver-all"GunControl"scheme

    ÔÇóRegistration & Licensing
    ÔÇóStricter handgun laws
    ÔÇóBan on possession


    "Disarmed people are neither free nor safe - they become the criminals' prey and the tyrants' playthings. When the civilians are defenseless and their government goes bad, however, thousands and millions of innocents die. Professor R.J.

    ##################################################

    Rummel, author of the monumental book Death by Government, said: "Concentrated political power is the most dangerous thing on earth." For power to concentrate and become dangerous, the citizens must be disarmed.

    What disarms the citizens? The idea of "gun control." It's the idea that only the government has the right to possess firearms, and that citizens have no unalienable right to use force to defend against aggression.

    Death by Gun Control
    carefully examines the "gun control" idea: its meaning, its purposes, its effects. It comes in many forms, but in every form it enables the evildoers and works against righteous defense."

    ##################################################

    So, I think you know what to do with your asinine and irrelevant gun control statistics. You people just don't have a clue what gun ownership is about. Not a blasted clue. Now go and gather up some butter cups and matches from the store.


  21. #21
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    Deanimator wrote:
    If you have to lie to make your point, you don't HAVE a point. The only pack of pathological liars who even approach anti-gunners are Holocaust deniers and by personal experience, there's a lot of overlap between the two groups.
    Wow, not even OCDO is immune to Godwin's Law.

  22. #22
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    Come to think of it, for all the dopes who think the 2A refers only to the National Guard; Heinrich Himmler, the Reichsfuehrer-SS, said of German Citizens who wanted to have personal weapons: "If they want a gun then let them join the SA or SS or the Army, blahblahblahblah" The 2A is a safeguard for freedom. Heinrich Himmler was most assuredly NOT

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