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Thread: National Park Open Carry

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    Regular Member Mainsail's Avatar
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    From what I understand, in February 2010 (that’s three months from now!) firearms carry in the National Parks will be legal, and will follow the laws of the state where the park is located.

    Please, if you don’t know the difference between a National Park and a National Forest or a Wilderness Area, please withhold your comments.

    I’m sure there will be some serious learning curve to overcome and will likely be a few problems. What I’m interested in knowing is what are our rights in regards to contact with Park Rangers. Do Rangers in the National Park need reasonable articulable suspicion to detain someone for merely carrying a holstered handgun? We know that (at least in most states) the police and sheriffs need RAS to detain someone for openly carrying a handgun; mere handgun carry does not by itself arouse suspicion that the person so armed is committing a crime. I believe Game Wardens and the like do not need RAS, but I may be wrong about that. Do the Rangers follow those same rules?

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    Regular Member Squeak's Avatar
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    Do game wardens patrol Nat. land? I thought they only did state land. I could be wrong-Iwas just thinking. Gotta stop that thinking! Gets me into trouble!

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    I would wager that they all need RAS. Game wardens are allowed to contact you about a pistol if you are bow hunting, and I think musket hunting (I could be wrong on that one.) If you are not hunting then they have no RAS for a stop because a firearm is present. They have to follow the same laws and regs that any other peace officer does.

    As far as Game Agents they do patrol in Nat'l forests. They would not be patrolling in a nat'l park as hunting is unlawful and would be responded to by a park ranger.
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Glock 23:40

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Since Mt. Baker ski area is in a national forest, can I snowboard opencarrying? LOL.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Since Mt. Baker ski area is in a national forest, can I snowboard opencarrying? LOL.
    Great question SVG! I'd do it if it were legal!!!!
    I am the person responsible for myself, my wife and my son. I take that VERY seriously.

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    Regular Member Bobarino's Avatar
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    i'm pretty happy about this. now i won't have to disarm and disassemble when i go to my favorite campground on the Olympic Peninsula inside the Nat'l park. i also have some property right by Willapa Nat'l Wildlife Refuge and i like to go hike there too. it's about dang time.

    Bobby

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    Bobarino wrote:
    i'm pretty happy about this. now i won't have to disarm and disassemble when i go to my favorite campground on the Olympic Peninsula inside the Nat'l park. i also have some property right by Willapa Nat'l Wildlife Refuge and i like to go hike there too. it's about dang time.

    Bobby
    I'd be careful in the Olympic National Park as it is a world heritage site and is primarily controlled by the U.N.

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    virgil47 wrote:
    Bobarino wrote:
    i'm pretty happy about this.* now i won't have to disarm and disassemble when i go to my favorite campground on the Olympic Peninsula inside the Nat'l park.* i also have some property right by Willapa Nat'l Wildlife Refuge and i like to go hike there too.** it's about dang time.*

    Bobby
    I'd be careful in the Olympic National Park as it is a world heritage site and is primarily controlled by the U.N.
    The UN can make no laws restricting firearms within the boundaries of the US.
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Glock 23:40

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    virgil47 wrote:
    Bobarino wrote:
    i'm pretty happy about this. now i won't have to disarm and disassemble when i go to my favorite campground on the Olympic Peninsula inside the Nat'l park. i also have some property right by Willapa Nat'l Wildlife Refuge and i like to go hike there too. it's about dang time.

    Bobby
    I'd be careful in the Olympic National Park as it is a world heritage site and is primarily controlled by the U.N.
    Where's the penalty flag image...dude, cite your source and cite your law.

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    Regular Member Bobarino's Avatar
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    ys, i'm not too worried about the guys in blue helmets pumping me full of lead around Lake Quinault.



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    Mainsail wrote:
    From what I understand, in February 2010
    Anybody know the exact date and have a source for this info??

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    virgil47 wrote:
    I'd be careful in the Olympic National Park as it is a world heritage site and is primarily controlled by the U.N.

    There is no measurable amount of land inside this country controlled by any other government entity,other than foreign consulates, even those are mostly just offices.
    I am the person responsible for myself, my wife and my son. I take that VERY seriously.

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    Mike wrote:
    Mainsail wrote:
    From what I understand, in February 2010
    Anybody know the exact date and have a source for this info??
    Effective 2/22/2010 ???

    http://www.concealnc.com/News_and_upcoming_laws_.html



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    Regular Member Mainsail's Avatar
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    NRA News Release: http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Fe...d.aspx?id=4901

    Friday, May 22, 2009


    On Wednesday, NRA-backed legislation to restore the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding citizens in national parks and wildlife refuges passed in the U.S. House of Representatives by an overwhelming bipartisan majority of 279-147. Today, the measure was signed into law and, as specified in the legislation, will take effect in nine months, on February 22, 2010. This was a major repudiation of the gun control community's anti self-defense agenda....

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    Although many may go on ignorant of this new law,the soon-to-be lawful carry of firearms in this country's national parks by every citizen should be acknowledged for the milestone that it is ...

    We are making forward progress, and I for one will be returning to the national parks for family recreation after years of a personal boycott due to the law that previously prohibited legal carry in the parks.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    tyguy808 wrote:
    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Since Mt. Baker ski area is in a national forest, can I snowboard opencarrying? LOL.
    Great question SVG! I'd do it if it were legal!!!!

    The head security up there is a real *&%#. She tried to take my tag one time because she didn't realize I just saved her from getting her head beat in when she was harrassing this other guy I stepped in and told her to take her hands off of him or I would be a witness that she assaulted him first.

    My guess is they can't kick us out of the park, but could take our tags if they have rules against it. We would just have to hike. Would be fun open carry on chair 8? LOL....

    Hmmm makes me think Mt. Baker ski lodge is ran by the Mills family I wonder how they feel about the 2A.

    P.S. they might be able to kick us out under that whole, managed by second party thing though? Not sure.

    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Ajetpilot's Avatar
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    National Park Service to educate public on gun rights:

    http://tinyurl.com/y97yju9

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    In regards to the change in the Code of Federal Regulations (36 CFR Part 2) changing the possesion of firearms in National Parks - I understand this only applies to concealed carry. Open carrry continues to be illegal.

    Yes?

    Hendo



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    NavyLT wrote:
    Hendo wrote:
    In regards to the change in the Code of Federal Regulations (36 CFR Part 2) changing the possesion of firearms in National Parks - I understand this only applies to concealed carry. Open carrry continues to be illegal.

    Yes?

    Hendo
    The change in 36 CFR had an injunction against it by a Federal Judge and never really went into effect. That is what prompted Congress to pass the new law. The new law basically just does away with the National Park boundary. Whatever is legal outside the park, isNOW legal inside the park.

    In fact the new law makes it illegal for the National Park Service to enact their own firearms restrictions.
    Correction?
    I am the person responsible for myself, my wife and my son. I take that VERY seriously.

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    Hendo wrote:
    In regards to the change in the Code of Federal Regulations (36 CFR Part 2) changing the possesion of firearms in National Parks - I understand this only applies to concealed carry. Open carrry continues to be illegal.

    Yes?

    Hendo

    I amnot sure that this is the final language but it looks like it. I am surprised that the press reports several interpretations that this applies to open carry as well. The only reference to state laws are in the context of concealed carry.

    I hope it does apply to open carry - comments, clarifications??



    Hendo





    IV. Section-by-Section Analysis

    36 CFR Part 2

    Section 2.4—Weapons, Traps, and Nets

    Previously, Section 2.4 generally prohibited visitors from possessing an operable

    and loaded firearm in national park areas unless the firearm is used for lawful hunting

    activities, target practice in areas designated by special regulations, or other purposes

    related to the administration of federal lands in Alaska. Under the final rule, an

    individual may possess, carry, and transport concealed, loaded, and operable firearms

    within a national park area in the same manner, and to the same extent, that a person may

    lawfully possess, carry, and transport concealed, loaded and operable firearms in the state

    in which the federal park, or that portion thereof, is located. Possession of concealed

    firearms in national parks as authorized by this section must also conform to applicable

    federal laws. Accordingly, nothing in this regulation shall be construed to authorize

    concealed carry of firearms in any federal facility or federal court facility as defined in

    18 U.S.C. 930.

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    Thanks NavyLT and tyguy808,

    Can you refer to any reference?

    Hendo

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    I've got nothing, just making a correction (I hope I didn't step on your toes)to NavyLT's post.
    I am the person responsible for myself, my wife and my son. I take that VERY seriously.

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    tyguy808,

    Toes are good. Like many here, I want to know what the latest laws are so I can keep all my appendages, especially my firearm (sorry).

    BTW - long guns are not included evidently. I am very interested if there is indeed an injunction or major change.

    Hendo


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    Thanks NavyLT,

    So it looks like what I thought was the new NP/WR law was from the previous law change initiated in early 2009 and what you have cited is the New new National Park/Wildlife Refuge law "shoe horned" into the new credit card law.

    Appreciate the current info

    Hendo

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    we should all celebrate with a Feb 22 OC hike. I have carried in parks before, but if I see a ranger I always get hassled. this will be nice. although, the law never stopped me before.

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