Militia Movement Resurfaces across the U.S.

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mark edward marchiafava wrote:

J.Gleason wrote:

They should all unite and become the Defenders of the Constitution. Create such a movement throughout this country that the legislators will be shaking in their shoes thinking a tsunami is on its way.

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Naw, it's too far gone to fix. Wipe the slate clean, start all over.
Allow the 50 states the opportunity to go it alone.

Nutczak, now you can say you DO know of one person wishing for collapse of the government: me.

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That has worked great for areas of Europe and the former Soviet Union....:lol:

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:

I took a vow to protect against all enemies both foreign and domestic.

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I've been waiting for Ed, or Gene German to join Oath Keepers, with me and J. Gleason.

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:

That has worked great for areas of Europe and the former Soviet Union....:lol:

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Yes, it has and beyond sarcastic irony. We have about a dozen L-1's here that seem to think (relating my impressions of their speech) that the breakup of the former-USSR is a good thing.

The BBC has a travelogue, 'The New Europe' that portrays the Balkan and Baltic states of the fUSSR as successful. My college classmates that studied in Split and Dubrovnik, Yugoslavia/Croatia call the balkanization of the fUSSR successful.

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Take from Interceptors post....the red is my response...

If they would stick to protesting and education while stocking up on rations should the SHTF, they would have more credibility. The fact is that we still have free elections. They should get off of their butts and get involved in politics instead of pointing fingers and dictating what "the government" should do. We are the government. We the people elected everyone who is in office.

I took a vow to protect against all enemies both foreign and domestic. It is offensive to me that anyone would suggest that it is a good idea to forcefully overtake the government which would suggest that they would wish to appoint someone to power. Interceptor , Maybe you can't see it...but our current form of governemnt is Broken beyond repair , the wealthy, greedy & corrupt " elected officials" have been in power since the end of WW2, democracy is the problem as this country was originally founded as a REPUBLIC, Our founding fathers would be getting the militia together today if they were alive, but now they just spin in their graves. That there would be indirect violation of the US Constitution. The very thing that they wish to pick and choose what articles and amendments they wish to recognize while ignoring others.

Abuses by individuals whether they are in the FBI, CIA or your local PD need to be addressed at the appropriate levels, not by overthrowing the entire government and Balkanizing the country.

If they believe an individual elected officialto be acting out of line then they should have the balls and ambition to address that individual and get them out of office through legal means instead of fantasizing about a Civil War.

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Glock34 wrote:

Take from Interceptors post....the red is my response...

If they would stick to protesting and education while stocking up on rations should the SHTF, they would have more credibility. The fact is that we still have free elections. They should get off of their butts and get involved in politics instead of pointing fingers and dictating what "the government" should do. We are the government. We the people elected everyone who is in office.

I took a vow to protect against all enemies both foreign and domestic. It is offensive to me that anyone would suggest that it is a good idea to forcefully overtake the government which would suggest that they would wish to appoint someone to power. Interceptor , Maybe you can't see it...but our current form of governemnt is Broken beyond repair , the wealthy, greedy & corrupt " elected officials" have been in power since the end of WW2, democracy is the problem as this country was originally founded as a REPUBLIC, Our founding fathers would be getting the militia together today if they were alive, but now they just spin in their graves. That there would be indirect violation of the US Constitution. The very thing that they wish to pick and choose what articles and amendments they wish to recognize while ignoring others.

Abuses by individuals whether they are in the FBI, CIA or your local PD need to be addressed at the appropriate levels, not by overthrowing the entire government and Balkanizing the country.

If they believe an individual elected officialto be acting out of line then they should have the balls and ambition to address that individual and get them out of office through legal means instead of fantasizing about a Civil War.

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But arguing about this is pointless, we all have our own varying take on this issue & Some people are just happy to have the illusion of freedom. But, please know this > WE ARE NOT FREE & WE HAVE NOT BEEN FREE FOR ALONG, LONG TIME, America has been bought and paid for.. How much of it does China own ?

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Glock34 wrote:

this > WE ARE NOT FREE & WE HAVE NOT BEEN FREE FOR ALONG, LONG TIME, America has been bought and paid for.. How much of it does China own ?

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Dr. John R. Lott, Jr., economist author of More Guns, Less Crime: Understanding Crime and Gun Control Laws, says, "For all the discussions about the Chinese holding our debt, it is a relatively small portion of the total." Today, 0047
http://johnrlott.blogspot.com/2009/11/who-holds-us-governments-debt.html#links

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Glock34 wrote:

I took a vow to protect against all enemies both foreign and domestic. It is offensive to me that anyone would suggest that it is a good idea to forcefully overtake the government which would suggest that they would wish to appoint someone to power. Interceptor , Maybe you can't see it...but our current form of governemnt is Broken beyond repair , the wealthy, greedy & corrupt " elected officials" have been in power since the end of WW2, democracy is the problem as this country was originally founded as a REPUBLIC, Our founding fathers would be getting the militia together today if they were alive, but now they just spin in their graves.

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They would be spinning in their graves if they knew that people were just bitching about the elected officials instead of getting involved. We still have free elections. Those in power were elected by the majority of voters.

The problem is that a significant portion of the population does not vote and has an entitlement attitude. "What is the government going to do for me?" is their battle cry....:cuss:

They procede to elect who they perceive to be capable of giving them the largest hand out.

The government is not broken... The population is broken.... Throw out the government and you still have the same people eager to elect more of the same...:banghead:



We need to wake thePatriots up and get them off of the couch... This is the message and mission of Appleseed if you didn't already notice... Saving America one person at a time.... When we have enough woken up and voting, there will be no need to ever overthrow the government as we will be back on track...:dude:

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Master Doug Huffman wrote:

Interceptor_Knight wrote:

I took a vow to protect against all enemies both foreign and domestic.

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I've been waiting for Ed, or Gene German to join Oath Keepers, with me and J. Gleason.

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Not quite yet. I take my oaths very seriously. I am still trying to compare the Oathkeepers oath to reality. I am still evaluating Oaths 4 and 5.

I took my oath.If there is a premature revolution, I will defend the USA against domestic enemies. I will not defend those who are only looking out for their own self interests and not interested in maintaining a Constitutional government.

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:

If there is a premature revolution, I will defend the USA against domestic enemies.

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So, you believe revolution is OK when you're ready, or can you tell us when revolution is not premature?

Sounds like agreeable tyrants are OK as long as y'all agree.

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Master Doug Huffman wrote:

Interceptor_Knight wrote:

If there is a premature revolution, I will defend the USA against domestic enemies.

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So, you believe revolution is OK when you're ready, or can you tell us when revolution is not premature?

Sounds like agreeable tyrants are OK as long as y'all agree.

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They're okay as long as they monitor the internet.

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Master Doug Huffman wrote:

So, you believe revolution is OK when you're ready, or can you tell us when revolution is not premature?

Sounds like agreeable tyrants are OK as long as y'all agree.

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You misunderstand my position. I am ready now if something catastrophic or otherwise extraordinary occured and it were time to act.

I prefer to think independently, and not get caught up in a mob mentality. I can tell you that although there is plenty of injustice to get angry at, there is absolutely nothing to justify a revolution right now. There are alot of people
(some are vocal so-called militia groups) waiting for someone else to start something so that they can join in. Ruby Ridge and Waco are far from justification for a revolution.

If one were to begin today, I would be defending my country.

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Tomahawk wrote:

Master Doug Huffman wrote:

Interceptor_Knight wrote:

If there is a premature revolution, I will defend the USA against domestic enemies.

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So, you believe revolution is OK when you're ready, or can you tell us when revolution is not premature?

Sounds like agreeable tyrants are OK as long as y'all agree.

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They're okay as long as they monitor the internet.

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For all of the smart talk that is going on, that is all that you and Doug are doing right now.....

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:

Master Doug Huffman wrote:

Interceptor_Knight wrote:

I took a vow to protect against all enemies both foreign and domestic.

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I've been waiting for Ed, or Gene German to join Oath Keepers, with me and J. Gleason.

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Not quite yet. I take my oaths very seriously. I am still trying to compare the Oathkeepers oath to reality. I am still evaluating Oaths 4 and 5.

I took my oath.If there is a premature revolution, I will defend the USA against domestic enemies. I will not defend those who are only looking out for their own self interests and not interested in maintaining a Constitutional government.

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4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state, or to enter with force into a state, without the express consent and invitation of that state’s legislature and governor.
One of the causes of the American Revolution was the attempt “to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil Power” by disbanding the Massachusetts legislature and appointing General Gage as “military governor.” The attempt to disarm the people of Massachusetts during that martial law sparked our Revolution. Accordingly, the power to impose martial law – the absolute rule over the people by a military officer with his will alone being law – is nowhere enumerated in our Constitution.
Further, it is the militia of a state and of the several states that the Constitution contemplates being used in any context, during any emergency within a state, not the standing army.
The imposition of martial law by the national government over a state and its people, treating them as an occupied enemy nation, is an act of war. Such an attempted suspension of the Constitution and Bill of Rights voids the compact with the states and with the people.
5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty and declares the national government to be in violation of the compact by which that state entered the Union.
In response to the obscene growth of federal power and to the absurdly totalitarian claimed powers of the Executive, upwards of 20 states are considering, have considered, or have passed courageous resolutions affirming states rights and sovereignty.
Those resolutions follow in the honored and revered footsteps of Jefferson and Madison in their Kentucky and Virginia Resolutions, and likewise seek to enforce the Constitution by affirming the very same principles of our Declaration, Constitution, and Bill of Rights that we Oath Keepers recognize and affirm.
Chief among those principles is that ours is a dual sovereignty system, with the people of each state retaining all powers not granted to the national government they created, and thus the people of each state reserved to themselves the right to judge when the national government they created has voided the compact between the states by asserting powers never granted.
Upon the declaration by a state that such a breach has occurred, we will not obey orders to force that state to submit to the national government.


I have no problem upholding my oath. What part of these unlawful orders are you evaluating? Just Curious.

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The dual sovereignty system is a myth. Without a 2/3 majority of Congress to change the Constitution, no state may secede.


I do not believe that it takes the legislature to declare a state of emergency, just the governor.

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:

The dual sovereignty system is a myth. Without a 2/3 majority of Congress to change the Constitution, no state may secede.


I do not believe that it takes the legislature to declare a state of emergency, just the governor.

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Tell that to Texas and if it can happen for Texas it could happen to any state.

#5 Refers to the Federal Government attempting to take control of a state because the feds are in conflict with the policies or governing body of that state.

Similar to what Russia did to Georgia.

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:

I do not believe that it takes the legislature to declare a state of emergency, just the governor.

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4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state, or to enter with force into a state, without the express consent and invitation of that state’s legislature and governor.


It is the militia of a state and of the several states that the Constitution contemplates being used in any context, during any emergency within a state, not the standing army.
The imposition of martial law by the national government over a state and its people, treating them as an occupied enemy nation, is an act of war. Such an attempted suspension of the Constitution and Bill of Rights voids the compact with the states and with the people.

This is referring to the national government overtaking the state government. What your saying is true. It would only take the state legislature OR the Governor to declare a state of emergency (Katrina for example).

However, when the federal Government steps in and takes over and imposes martial law as it did during Katrina, then comes the disarming of Americans as well as the placing of Americans into detention camps

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It could be argues that the bad economy driving people from their homes into apartments is comparable to camps in some respects. It would be a lot easier to empty an apartment building out and get a larger number of people than to clear a city block out.

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J.Gleason wrote:

Interceptor_Knight wrote:

The dual sovereignty system is a myth. Without a 2/3 majority of Congress to change the Constitution, no state may secede.


I do not believe that it takes the legislature to declare a state of emergency, just the governor.

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Tell that to Texas and if it can happen for Texas it could happen to any state.

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I am telling it to Texas.. Texas no longer has the "right" to secede. They haven't since before the Civil War.

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J.Gleason wrote:

Interceptor_Knight wrote:

I do not believe that it takes the legislature to declare a state of emergency, just the governor.

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4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state, or to enter with force into a state, without the express consent and invitation of that state’s legislature and governor.


It is the militia of a state and of the several states that the Constitution contemplates being used in any context, during any emergency within a state, not the standing army.
The imposition of martial law by the national government over a state and its people, treating them as an occupied enemy nation, is an act of war. Such an attempted suspension of the Constitution and Bill of Rights voids the compact with the states and with the people.

This is referring to the national government overtaking the state government. What your saying is true. It would only take the state legislature OR the Governor to declare a state of emergency (Katrina for example).

However, when the federal Government steps in and takes over and imposes martial law as it did during Katrina, then comes the disarming of Americans as well as the placing of Americans into detention camps

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In accordance to the Posse Comitatus act, the Governor may only bring in the National Guard. It takes Congress to send in the other forces. In accordance with the Insurrection Act (1807), the standing military forces may be brought in by the President to impose order. During the LA riots, the military was legally used. First the National Guard was deployed but Marine Corps units backed them up later. I was geared up wating for the transport truck to take me and my Company to LA feom Camp Pendleton. We did not deploy as another did. I know of Marines having to shoot 1 person at a road block. I had no problem acting in such a manor when theanimals were burning down the city. Law Enforcement was not capable of controlling the riots as they hesitated to act swiftly and decisively.

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J.Gleason wrote:

This is referring to the national government overtaking the state government. What your saying is true. It would only take the state legislature OR the Governor to declare a state of emergency (Katrina for example).

However, when the federal Government steps in and takes over and imposes martial law as it did during Katrina, then comes the disarming of Americans as well as the placing of Americans into detention camps

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What happened during Katrina (using military as law enforcement) was not lawful. It is lawful for the military to render aid and assist the local government with supplies, construction, etc... There were modifications to the Insurrection Act attempted in 2006 to include natural disaster but they were repealed later.