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Thread: Being harassed by local police

  1. #1
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    my videos

    Jackson Crossing Mall(July 10, 2008)
    part1(coming soon)
    part2(coming soon)
    part3(coming soon)

    Burger King(May 15, 2009)
    part1
    part2
    part3

    Motorcycle(June 27, 2009)
    part1
    part2 a
    part2 b
    part3
    part4

    Shell Gas Station(Nov 21, 2009)
    part1
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    a little about my self. I am a US Marine, I have served in Iraq, I am a reservist and love what I do. on the civilian side I am a financial adviser and also teach ballroom dance part time. the RKBA, and OC are very important to me. I am known I believe quite well in the Michigan portion of OCDO for my efforts and stories.

    At the moment, I am torn. in the past 18 months or so, i have been harassed by my local police dept 6 times. 4 of those times were by the same officer, 2 of those times he was off duty. one was just this Saturday morning at 530am. I have sat down with the chief of police, apparently this morning goes to show me that it was to no avail. I am considering a lawsuit against the chief of police, and several of the officers involved. I am also the only person in the area who has had this much issues.

    this is where all you come in, despite everything I do, my wife and I are barely getting by, and I am looking for donations to help with the possibility of a lawsuit. I guess I am looking more to find out if this is even possible. Michigan does have our own non profit incorporation, and any donations would be put through them.


    thank you for your time in reading this.


    link: MI Open Carry Inc.

  2. #2
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Michigan has state preemption and is an open carry state; therefore your objections seem well founded.

    You are documenting quite well. Have you talked with an attorney yet? If not your request for assistance might be premature. Let us know as things develop and in what direction you intend to move.

    Will add this to my watched list.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  3. #3
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    I have an attorney that I will be contacting this week. I don't want anyone to give anything anywhere just yet. I'm am asking who may be able to if I decide to go this route.

    this has been a continual issue, and I want nothing more than for it to stop. people tell me i should sue every time something happens, but it is very much a last resort for me. I don't want to do that to my PD or my city. But on the other hand it may be the only thing they are willing to listen to. The mayor is the only person left in the chain of command to talk to from this point forward.

    I will be sure to keep updates.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Kimberguy,

    This sort of abuse cannot be tolerated. Lawsuits have their place, but there are many other ways to get your point across.

    A) An open carry rally in Jackson, Michigan should be step 1.

    B) I do not know what Michigan has for open government laws, but a Freedom of Inforation Act (FOIA) set of requests will be a huge pain in the a$$ for the police chief. Often the administrative burden of the FOIA will get higher ups to ensure minions play by the rules.

    C) Write letters to elected officials and to the city attorney.

    D) Complain to your state representatives and Congressman.

    In short shake the tree and get some consequences for the JBT who is persecuting you.

    Live Free or Die,

    Thundar
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

  5. #5
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    Thundar wrote:
    Kimberguy,

    This sort of abuse cannot be tolerated. Lawsuits have their place, but there are many other ways to get your point across. . . . In short shake the tree
    Right, also consider formal and informal complaints to the chief of each police department; submit state law FOIA requests for records relating to their policies on officer conduct when encountering an open carrier, emails to local councilmen and members, etc.



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    I have found most police officers that that take delight in harassing citizens (similar to the one that is harassing you) you will be able tofollow the trail of crap right to the top and realize the chief encourages this behavior.

    By talking to the chief, you are showing him your weaknesses and game plan and only giving this officer and that departmentmore reason to continue this cycle of harassment.

    You got most of it documented, SoI would go up the totem pole a little higher and start talking to the alphabet-soup agencies that oversee lower government.

    A month or so ago, a member named "codename47" spelled out how to file a lawsuit on your own with little to no cost to you. Start looking for his postings on that and see if it something that you could make work.

  7. #7
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    First file a FORMAL complaint with the PD naming the officer involved 4 times and follow up. If you get the blow off then file formal complaint naming the officer and chief of police with your state police and AG's office. Make sure you FOIA EVERY single piece of video/audio available. If those fail to get any results THEN file a lawsuit for harassment and violations of your rights.

    You have no real damages but repeated violations constitute harassment under color of law and that is illegal.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
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    Carry around a print out of the law then hand it to him the next time & everytime you get pulled over. Stop talking to this doughnut eatting butthole, from now on YES & NO answers. By now my temper would be getting a bit short at the clear ignorance & unprofessional behavior of this police depts officers.....Officer, it's apparent that you need to do a little research regarding the fact that I can open carry & Carry concealed If I so decide to.... I can't believe you didn't say something when he insulted you, regarding the mental hold thing & calling you stupid, Insults get rebutles with me, Cop or no cop.
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

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    You have the right to remain silent, and this is prior to arrest too, you don't need to talk to him. I'd suggest identifying yourself, and not say another word to the guy. Then all he'll have on his lovely dashcam footage is him ranting on someone who is standing on their rights.

    Oh, I forgot, ask if you'refree togo from time to time, just so the footage will make it abundantly clear that he's detaining you against your will, since there's no legal basis for the stop.

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  11. #11
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    OK. One more time:

    We are 22, 859 members.

    If just half of us, 11,429 (rounding down, ‘kuz I’m conservative) were to each contribute $5, that would be $57,130. I would think that, in most jurisdictions, that would be enough to pay lawyers’ fees for one 1983 case.

    Now, must each harassed individual reinvent the funding wheel for his/her own case?

    Let us set up a fund to which members can contribute a little each month or out of each paycheck, if they wish, so we can support these cases all over the country.

    But, there I go wasting my breath again. . .

  12. #12
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    Thundar wrote:
    Kimberguy,

    This sort of abuse cannot be tolerated. Lawsuits have their place, but there are many other ways to get your point across.
    You and I agree.

    A) An open carry rally in Jackson, Michigan should be step 1.
    this is something we have done many times, to include picnics and a food drive


    B) I do not know what Michigan has for open government laws, but a Freedom of Inforation Act (FOIA) set of requests will be a huge pain in the a$$ for the police chief. Often the administrative burden of the FOIA will get higher ups to ensure minions play by the rules.
    I Have requested FOIAs for everything, that is where the video comes form.


    C) Write letters to elected officials and to the city attorney.
    I will need to look into who these people are.

    D) Complain to your state representatives and Congressman.
    Have not done that yet

    In short shake the tree and get some consequences for the JBT who is persecuting you.

    Live Free or Die,

    Thundar
    thank you for your message, you and I see very eye to eye.

  13. #13
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    Watch "Don't Talk to the Police."

    By talking to them, you are only aiding in their investigation of you. You have the right to remain silent, before or after you are detained.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

    Also read:
    Training Cops to Lie - Pt 1 The tangled web of police deception
    http://www.officer.com/web/online/Investigation/Training-Cops-to-Lie---Pt-1/18$49343

    I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice.

  14. #14
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    Statesman wrote:
    Watch "Don't Talk to the Police."

    By talking to them, you are only aiding in their investigation of you. You have the right to remain silent, before or after you are detained.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

    Also read:
    Training Cops to Lie - Pt 1 The tangled web of police deception
    http://www.officer.com/web/online/In...-Pt-1/18$49343

    I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
    have watched that. it is a hard thing to do, especially two days ago, when they threatened arrest and impounding my truck. it was the first time i actually stood my ground. Practice makes perfect.
    it is amazing even knowing what I know, knowing that what they are saying to me are complete lies, when you are surrounded by 3 of them, it makes it hard.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Statesman's Avatar
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    Kimberguy wrote:
    Statesman wrote:
    Watch "Don't Talk to the Police."

    By talking to them, you are only aiding in their investigation of you. You have the right to remain silent, before or after you are detained.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

    Also read:
    Training Cops to Lie - Pt 1 The tangled web of police deception
    http://www.officer.com/web/online/In...-Pt-1/18$49343

    I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
    have watched that. it is a hard thing to do, especially two days ago, when they threatened arrest and impounding my truck. it was the first time i actually stood my ground. Practice makes perfect.
    it is amazing even knowing what I know, knowing that what they are saying to me are complete lies, when you are surrounded by 3 of them, it makes it hard.
    "Easier said than done." That's completely understandable. I'm also writing this for other open carriers in Michigan.

    If you feel the need to respond to their questions with something, you can always just answer their question with worthless information, or the following question: "Officer, am I being detained, or am I free to go?" and/or "I know my rights, sir. I don't have to talk to you." If you feel you must respond, just don't give them anything useful. "I don't know, sir. What time is it?".

    Both parties also know it's their job to intimidate you into participating in their investigation against you. The worse they can do to you is take you to jail, which only furthers your case against them if they do so illegally. Just don't give them any excuse to do so, because they are likely trained to provoke you in some way that would warrant a resisting arrest charge. To avoid these scenarios, watch,
    "BUSTED: The Citizen's Guide to Surviving Police Encounters"http://www.flexyourrights.org/busted

    Also available on youtube.

    It was interesting to watch the cop in the background of the city council video. Aside from sticking his finger in his mouth constantly, he looked a bit agitated at the speech.


  16. #16
    Campaign Veteran XD-GEM's Avatar
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    A formal Internal Affairs Bureau complaint is in order - assuming this department has some sort of self-investigating body. If they do not have such a procedure, then a formal complaint to the DA or the State Attorney General is in order. Repeated harassment under color of law is a Federal crime when the harassment is over a civil right.

    If you know any media types who might treat you fairly, you might want to talk with them.

  17. #17
    Regular Member UtahJarhead's Avatar
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    Come on, Kimberguy! You gave us the first episode then part of the second. Don't leave us hanging, brother! I want to see what these schmoes did to you. The first few videos are obviously very incriminating against them.

  18. #18
    Regular Member UtahJarhead's Avatar
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    hahahaha... I like how in video 4, the second cop says "Yeah, the card says it's legal!" "Well the card's a piece of s***."

    BTW, 2 thumbs up for standing your ground like that. Well done!

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    "Why are you carrying a gun?"



    Uhhhh.......because i want to? Here's your sign.



    did he say what i thought he said? I'm sick and tired of this f---er? I don't mean to

    bash cops they have a hard job i know, been there done it, butthe first thing

    through my head was tough s--t.


  20. #20
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  21. #21
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    McX wrote:
    I've had some past experience at Police harassment. And posted my experience here on the forum some time back. To get it off my chest- so to speak. Obviously common sense should dictate your every action from here out. Presume you are being watched, at ALL times. Conduct yourself in a low key manner. Vary your routine, as to not be an easy target. Be mindful of your surroundings, and particularly WHO is around you. Keep a notebook with you, to record your observations. Talk to no one about the specific experience. Be watchful for alot of Police "drive-bys", or any other obvious attempt to monitor, harrass, or intimidate you. Witnesses are and will be invaluable to you for even the smallest noted things. Don't cave to the "I'm just being paranoid" thought. Brace for what may come, protect yourself, and consider "moving" your property- if you get my drift, to keep it away from prying hands. Make sure the registration on your car is current. You obey traffic laws. Give them nothing to approach you on. Your lawyer, upon hearing what has happened to you, may, and probably should do as mine did, and inform the Police agency that is antagonizing you: Do not approach my client without a warrant. Do not speak to him without me (lawyer) present. Above all, be cool!
    I am not the one posting the videos, I have some one else doing all that for me. Michigan is doign really well at working together.

    as for the above quote, thank you, the support from all of you is invaluable. thank you all.

    I will be posting the link to the next video as soon as it is posted.

  22. #22
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    just got this from the guy posting the videos:

    mikestilly wrote:
    Hey guys. Worked on the second video today. It's going to take a while. There were 3 conversations sometimes at the same time. So I've been capturing the most important stuff and been able to mix some of the conversations as they made sense in the video. This has been the trickiest video editing I've ever done with 4 videos all happening at the same time I'll knock it out hopefully before the end of this week.

  23. #23
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Wow. The nickname"cement head" fits that guy. I love how he keeps referring to "CCW rules". And who told him that haircut was a good look?

  24. #24
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    buster81 wrote:
    Wow. The nickname"cement head" fits that guy. I love how he keeps referring to "CCW rules". And who told him that haircut was a good look?
    LMFAO!!!! I have been in the Marine Corps for going on 6 years now, and a few years back that haircut(known as the horse shoe) was banned because it looked so retarded.

  25. #25
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Kimberguy wrote:
    buster81 wrote:
    Wow. The nickname"cement head" fits that guy. I love how he keeps referring to "CCW rules". And who told him that haircut was a good look?
    LMFAO!!!! I have been in the Marine Corps for going on 6 years now, and a few years back that haircut(known as the horse shoe) was banned because it looked so retarded.
    Horse Shoe huh? There is nothing lucky about looking like that.

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