chatting at oc get-together - take out your gun?

Hawaii FiveO · Nov 25, 2009

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Ok, I'm not sure if this is the correct sub forum, but when oc people get together in a public setting, say at a Starbucks, and they're sitting outside, talking oc, or the weather, or football, or whatever, can you take out, or has anyone taken out their gun to show the others what you have? Like I see someone carrying a gun I've beenaching to have and eventually maybe buy, could I ask the owner to let me inspect it? I'd like to see how much it weights, how it fits in my hand, etc. Is this done? Is it frowned upon? Is it better to just chat and ignore each other's weapons? When I'm at the range I go up to people when I see they havesomethingof a gun or rifle that isunusual orbig or small orold or loud that gets my attention I'lladmire from short distancebut not touch it and eventually the owner will say, you wanna shoot it? Hell yeah, I say. Ok, we're not going to shoot anything ata meet, butis it considered bad manners to show off your gun out of the holster in public? I know I wouldn't hesitate to ask if I could handle a gun belonging to another in a private setting like a home, but in public, what say ye?

TheMrMitch · Nov 25, 2009

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NO! Absolutely NO. Weapons stay holstered at all time until needed and showing is not needed.

Do this in a safe place like a firing range or what ever after all agree the weapon is cleared.

Admire, discuss and what you wanna do but do NOT remove from holster. Period.:shock:

Hawkflyer · Nov 25, 2009

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Welcome to the forum.

No it is not common practice to show your firearms to others. Handling a firearm in such a setting is not just bad form it is unsafe. The purpose of these sort of gatherings or events is to make firearms carry by regular citizens visible. You can certainly ask a person about their carry weapon, but people do not take out a firearm under these circumstances and pass it around.

Remember, these are self f=defense tools. They are loaded. Taking them out and clearing them to pass around disarms the carrier, and is a generally unsafe practice in most places these events are held. Remember also that at these events there are a lot of people who are not familiar or comfortable about firearms present. Handling the weapons and passing them around will cause a degree of fear and discomfort for these people which is counterproductive to the entire purpose of the gathering.

If you want to feel a firearm in your hand, you should go someplace appropriate to that activity such as private home, a store or a range.

Regards

RJHORSE66 · Nov 25, 2009

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SUCH VULGAR WORDS DANG MAN EVERYONE HAS A RIGHT TO ASK QUESTIONS CHILL-OUT DUDE !!:lol:

Bull Frog · Nov 25, 2009

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I appreciate your attempt to moderate conversations here, but - what I said stands. Any attempts to describe my statements as vulgar will be ignored.

ABNinfantryman · Nov 25, 2009

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I am completely comfortable with whipping out all three. You don't have to look if you don't want to and I'm pretty sure we've all seen one before. Case in point, pissing on the side of a moving subway car in Munich during Oktoberfest. My knife, if you're close enough to me that I stab you in the midst of pulling out my knife then you're probably not someone I care too much about offending. My gun, I'm comfortable enough with it that I know it won't fire unless I squeeze the trigger. Drop the mag, eject the round, and hand it to you with the slide open so you can look at it. There's no threat to you other than your fragile sensibilities.

GLOCK21GB · Nov 25, 2009

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TheMrMitch wrote:

NO! Absolutely NO. Weapons stay holstered at all time until needed and showing is not needed.

Do this in a safe place like a firing range or what ever after all agree the weapon is cleared.

Admire, discuss and what you wanna do but do NOT remove from holster. Period.:shock:

THIS. never unholster in public. it's considered Brandishing.

r6-rider · Nov 26, 2009

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i cant stand when people ask to see my gun. it happens almost daily and its usually some stupid kid with no trigger discipline or muzzle awareness

GLOCK21GB · Nov 26, 2009

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r6-rider wrote:

i cant stand when people ask to see my gun. it happens almost daily and its usually some stupid kid with no trigger discipline or muzzle awareness

it's funny when the ladies ask to see it, I tellem I will give them a private showing..

r6-rider · Nov 26, 2009

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haha i defiantly need to steal that one from you:lol:

Notso · Nov 26, 2009

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Just adding my thoughts to the original question. Not just no, but HELL NO.

kimbercarrier · Nov 26, 2009

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I say NO! The more you handle a firearm the more there is a chance for a negligent or accidental discharge. It wouln't be good for you or those around you or open carry in general.

If you had an AD or ND at the very least it's an embarrassment and at worst death.
JMHO. Hope this helps.

NightOwl · Nov 26, 2009

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How about showing off a nice firearm that wasn't brought in the holster, but rather unloaded in a gun case? Just a thought.

Citizen · Nov 26, 2009

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Count me in with the "keep it holstered" crowd.

Form and safety. Check the VCDL website for their rules about gun handling at events and while working the membership drive booths at gunshows.

Citizen · Nov 26, 2009

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NightOwl wrote:

How about showing off a nice firearm that wasn't brought in the holster, but rather unloaded in a gun case? Just a thought.

I'd schedule the show-and-admire session for some other time and place.

Starbucks and others are creating the atmosphere of a public gathering/cafe sort of place; but I don't think firearms is quite what they have in mind.

MSC 45ACP · Nov 26, 2009

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"Show & Tell" should be held somewhere very private so that no bystanders can see what is going on. If ANYONE sees an unholstered weapon, you are opening yourself up to a Brandishing charge (in Virginia, anyway).

It isrude, inconsiderate, foolish and seriously lacking in judgement to draw and clear a weapon anywhere other than a "safe direction" and away from curious onlookers. John Q. Public just doesn't understand the clearing procedure and is quite likely to experience a significant emotional event in his Fruit of the Looms or worse, his tick-tocker... It could quit working alltogether at the sight of an unholstered pistol andassume the functionality of a quivering bowl ofJello,AKA: V-fib orVentricular fibrillation.

We have enoughsheep having apoplexy at the sight of a HOLSTERED weapon! Can you just IMAGINE for a moment:
Panic in a crowded Starbucks if my Lovely Modern Art Masterpiece (Kimber Ultra Crimson Carry II with the most beautiful Rosewood grips I've EVER seen) were to be seen by MommaSheep and her little lambs? Think about MommaSheep's reaction at the sound ofa slide locking to the rear (after the magazine had been removed, of course) and then seeing it passed from one person to another?

Not only would I have an interesting conversation with local LE, but in this New Age of OsamaCare, I would also be responsible for the medical bills of the people trampled by MommaSheep and her lambchops as they exited the premises post-haste.

Yeah... THAT's a GREAT idea... clearing a weapon in a room full of people. Remember when EF Hutton Spoke, EVERYONE LISTENED?

The sound of a 1911's slide (or most any semi-auto pistol) locking to the rear is rather unmistakeable.

WTF ARE YOU THINKING??? :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:

Silliness like this is what sets our cause BACK to caveman days, not forward.

<rant off>

msc

ABNinfantryman · Nov 26, 2009

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MSC 45ACP wrote:

"Show & Tell" should be held somewhere very private so that no bystanders can see what is going on. If ANYONE sees an unholstered weapon, you are opening yourself up to a Brandishing charge (in Virginia, anyway).

It isrude, inconsiderate, foolish and seriously lacking in judgement to draw and clear a weapon anywhere other than a "safe direction" and away from curious onlookers. John Q. Public just doesn't understand the clearing procedure and is quite likely to experience a significant emotional event in his Fruit of the Looms or worse, his tick-tocker... It could quit working alltogether at the sight of an unholstered pistol andassume the functionality of a quivering bowl ofJello,AKA: V-fib orVentricular fibrillation.

We have enoughsheep having apoplexy at the sight of a HOLSTERED weapon! Can you just IMAGINE for a moment:
Panic in a crowded Starbucks if my Lovely Modern Art Masterpiece (Kimber Ultra Crimson Carry II with the most beautiful Rosewood grips I've EVER seen) were to be seen by MommaSheep and her little lambs? Think about MommaSheep's reaction at the sound ofa slide locking to the rear (after the magazine had been removed, of course) and then seeing it passed from one person to another?

Not only would I have an interesting conversation with local LE, but in this New Age of OsamaCare, I would also be responsible for the medical bills of the people trampled by MommaSheep and her lambchops as they exited the premises post-haste.

Yeah... THAT's a GREAT idea... clearing a weapon in a room full of people. Remember when EF Hutton Spoke, EVERYONE LISTENED?

The sound of a 1911's slide (or most any semi-auto pistol) locking to the rear is rather unmistakeable.

WTF ARE YOU THINKING??? :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:

Silliness like this is what sets our cause BACK to caveman days, not forward.

<rant off>

msc

That whole rant breaks down to "Think of the children." The beauty of the idea of freedom is that you have the freedom to look away if something bothers you, so the whole "think of the guy with the bad heart or who will sh*t himself" argument can kiss my ----. As for brandishing, brandishing is when you draw your weapon with the intent to instill fear in an individual or the people around you, which is not my intent when I'm allowing someone to look at my piece. If you're not willing to risk pushing the law to it's limit you're never going to win anything. What do you think all of these OC get togethers are for? To incite the question being asked in public where everyone can see.

And to the guy who says the more you handle a weapon the more you're likely to have an ND, two things. One, no crap, that's like saying "the more you drive the more likely you are to get in a wreck" simply because of the amount of time spent on the road, but I highly doubt we're going to see people spend less time in their vehicles. Two, so far in my military career I've had one ND, and itwas not my fault. Some retard half cocked a machine gun and when I opened the feed tray to clear itthe seer slipped and allowed the bolt to slam forward discharging a round. Other than that I carry and handle a loaded weapon for a year or more that gets slammed around and never have an issue. Most NDs in the military happen because of negligence and ignorance, that's why the Army no longer calls them ADs, they're all NDs. As you all like to say, a gun's a tool, and no matter how long you place it in a chair and let it sit there, it's not going to shoot itself.

The biggest threat to the movement are not the people who are comfortable with handling their weapon, it's those who aren't.

MSC 45ACP · Nov 26, 2009

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22 years military service, 19 of them as a small arms instructor.

Brandishing isn't YOUR intent... it is SOMEONE ELSE'S FEELING threatened because of something you did. In Virginia, the only way to prevent a brandishing charge is to NOT draw your weapon from the holster, OR if you are CCing, don't "show your weapon in a threatening manner"

A guy in Va Beach was charged with brandishing when he was CCing and he pulled his jacket back and "showed" that he was carrying during an arguement with someone else. The other person "FELT" threatened and he was charged. It happens.

I agree it IS silly with the "feelings" of others. I don't write the laws.

in 22 years' serivce, I NEVER had an ND. I saw a couple, but it never happened on any range I was running. ND's happen when people do stupid chit or get complacent.

"half cocked and sear slammed forward"???

You gotta be kidding, me, right? Was the MG broken? That silly story doesn't hold water. Try telling that story to someone that doesn't work on machine guns.

Don't go running your mouth unless you KNOW WTF you're talking about. In this situation, you haven't a clue.

ABNinfantryman · Nov 26, 2009

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MSC 45ACP wrote:

"show your weapon in a threatening manner"

in 22 years' serivce, I NEVER had an ND. I saw a couple, but it never happened on any range I was running. ND's happen when people do stupid chit or get complacent.

"half cocked and sear slammed forward"???

You gotta be kidding, me, right? Was the MG broken? That silly story doesn't hold water. Try telling that story to someone that doesn't work on machine guns.

Don't go running your mouth unless you KNOW WTF you're talking about. In this situation, you haven't a clue.

Really, so you're telling me the sear on a M240B won't wear out from being half-cocked (Which would imply a broken MG would it not?)? That's funny, because that's exactly why we stopped half-cocking the weapon in the first place. Same with the M249. The sear would wear out and the bolt would slip causing a discharge either on it's own or from enough external shock to the weapon, like say bouncing around in a HMMV on a dirt road in the mountains of Afghanistan. EIB, Master Gunner, Armorer, no small arms course worth it's salt still trains soldiers to half cock an open-bolt machine gun and the current FMs specifically forbid it. Being an instructor means squat, every armorer I know (including myself) warns against half-cocking and wearing out the sear. Maybe you're thinking about the M2, now that's a closed bolt MG which doesn't put stress on the sear, can't half cock it though so maybe not.

Back to the topic at hand with that first quote, "show your weapon in a threatening manner." Here's why your guy in an argument in VA Beach doesn't matter to what the initial poster asked, the guy was in an argument with the guy he showed his weapon to! That's an entirely different situation to me talking with another gun owner who asks to see my piece. Here's a theoretical situation for you, if I'm walking around NC with my M4 on my chest, am I brandishing or OC?

METT-TC guy, METT-TC.

MSC 45ACP · Nov 27, 2009

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You're right, I didn't have all the info as you did. Half-cock is an unsafe and silly thing to do. HYou got boned by the guy that did it. Are things so bad over there that your weapons aren't getting the required PMS and maintenance?

You're good to go walking around with your M4. It isn't brandishing until you TOUCH it.

You CAN legally OC a rifle in VA, just like the black guy did out in AZ (?) at the Obumma thing a few months ago. Just don't go unslinging it. THEN its brandishing. I think we're on the same side, Brother. The laws on brandishing don't make sense to those of us that carry weapons for a living because we know they are just tools. If abused, they can be used to hurt people.

No different from a hammer to you and me, just more efficient for the job at hand. the sheep aren't going to go bullshit if you carry a hammer around on a carpenter's belt.
Some of them get antsy when they just SEE a firearm because they don't know any better.
They will probably be a little nervous if someone is carrying the hammer and definitely get upset if someone raises that hammer over their heads or walks around holding it or swinging it.
They will also get upset if your pistol is out of its holster because they don't know know about "cleared weapons" and "safe directions".

Unfortunately, the law is written with the "least common denominator" in mind... Sheeple.
Its all about perception. What responsible gun owners know to be a safe operation can be seen by the sheeple as "something dangerous":banghead:

That's why we only unholster and clear our weapons in private.

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