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Michigan AG: Open carry allowed on Michigan campuses, classrooms, and dorms

vt007ken

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Question: Does anyone have a link to this opinion or was it an informal opinion?

--

"According to a recent ruling from Michigan Attorney General Mike Cox and the Michigan State Police, licensed concealed carry permit holders may openly carry a firearm into a pistol exclusion zones including dormitories and classrooms."

http://ypsinews.com/index.php/200912-emu-debates-concealed-guns-on-campus/

Anyone know if this is true?

Anyone want to petition Cuccinelli to make this true in VA?

-----
Ken Stanton
VP and Founder, SCCC at VT
 

nova

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There is currently no law prohibiting ANYONE, permitted or not, from open carrying in classrooms or dorms in VA.

That said, we need to get a law passed that prohibits universities from prohibiting students/staff/faculty from carrying firearms they can legally do so anywhere else on/in public property/buildings.

I hear SCCC @ VT is going to try to have a bill introduced this go around?
 

vt007ken

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nova wrote:
There is currently no law prohibiting ANYONE, permitted or not, from open carrying in classrooms or dorms in VA.

That said, we need to get a law passed that prohibits universities from prohibiting students/staff/faculty from carrying firearms they can legally do so anywhere else on/in public property/buildings.

I hear SCCC @ VT is going to try to have a bill introduced this go around?

There will be a bill introduced, and we will be supporting it, yes.

Also, on the legality issue - there is no law prohibiting concealed or open carry on campus in VA. The institutions that ban guns on campus can only punish violators by expulsion. However, there is a AG opinion (05-078) that says colleges CAN make rules to govern concealed carry.

I wonder if we could confirm that open carry is not able to be restricted?
 

hunter45

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I wish the SCCC group at Mason would get started up again. I just registered for classes for my first semester at GMU this morning.
 

nova

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vt007ken wrote:
nova wrote:
There is currently no law prohibiting ANYONE, permitted or not, from open carrying in classrooms or dorms in VA.

That said, we need to get a law passed that prohibits universities from prohibiting students/staff/faculty from carrying firearms they can legally do so anywhere else on/in public property/buildings.

I hear SCCC @ VT is going to try to have a bill introduced this go around?

There will be a bill introduced, and we will be supporting it, yes.

Also, on the legality issue - there is no law prohibiting concealed or open carry on campus in VA. The institutions that ban guns on campus can only punish violators by expulsion. However, there is a AG opinion (05-078) that says colleges CAN make rules to govern concealed carry.

I wonder if we could confirm that open carry is not able to be restricted?
I'm sure our new AG will have a differing opinion on the matter :cool:

As for if colleges can restrict OC on campus, the Fairfax Co. Circuit Court stated that OC is a protected right and is allowed generally on campus (referring to GMU which has their regulation in Virginia Admin. Code).

hunter45 wrote:
I wish the SCCC group at Mason would get started up again. I just registered for classes for my first semester at GMU this morning.
Spring '10? Sweet:)
I'd love to see SCCC get revived at GMU.
 

hunter45

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nova wrote:
(referring to GMU which has their regulation in Virginia Admin. Code).

hunter45 wrote:
I wish the SCCC group at Mason would get started up again. I just registered for classes for my first semester at GMU this morning.
Spring '10? Sweet:)
I'd love to see SCCC get revived at GMU.

Yep! I would love to help with getting it started up again, but I don't want to have to be the campus leader, I'm too lazy to run an organization. :p

Our President at JMU is graduating in May and no one is volunteering to take his place (there's only about 10 of us that actually show up to the meetings). So I think our group here may be in danger of becoming inactive, too.
 

Grapeshot

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hunter45 wrote:
nova wrote:
(referring to GMU which has their regulation in Virginia Admin. Code).

hunter45 wrote:
I wish the SCCC group at Mason would get started up again. I just registered for classes for my first semester at GMU this morning.
Spring '10? Sweet:)
I'd love to see SCCC get revived at GMU.

Yep! I would love to help with getting it started up again, but I don't want to have to be the campus leader, I'm too lazy to run an organization. :p

Our President at JMU is graduating in May and no one is volunteering to take his place (there's only about 10 of us that actually show up to the meetings). So I think our group here may be in danger of becoming inactive, too.
Operate the chapter by committee - share the responsibilities. Stay involved.

Yata hey
 

pourshot

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From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found. I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code. A code you said you would follow by enrolling....



Silly stuff...:banghead:
 

vt007ken

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pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found.  I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code.  A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.
 

essayons

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vt007ken wrote:
pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found.  I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code.  A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.

Virginia Administrative Code is NOT law.
 

vt007ken

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essayons wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found.  I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code.  A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.

Virginia Administrative Code is NOT law.

Substantiate your claim - it is enforced as law, making it illegal to carry on GMU and VCU campuses.
 

nova

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vt007ken wrote:
essayons wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found. I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code. A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.

Virginia Administrative Code is NOT law.

Substantiate your claim - it is enforced as law, making it illegal to carry on GMU and VCU campuses.


I must clarify something here. It is not illegal to carry on GMU's campus. The VAC regulation specifically says academic buildings, administrative office buildings, student residence buildings, dining facilities, or while attending sporting, entertainment or educational events.

Here's the general table of contents of the VAC regarding GMU:
http://leg1.state.va.us/000/reg/TOC08035.HTM

Here's the specific VAC regulation regarding weapons on campus:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC35-60-20

definitions:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC35-60-10
 

nova

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nova wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
essayons wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found. I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code. A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.

Virginia Administrative Code is NOT law.

Substantiate your claim - it is enforced as law, making it illegal to carry on GMU and VCU campuses.


I must clarify something here. It is not illegal to carry on GMU's campus. The VAC regulation specifically says academic buildings, administrative office buildings, student residence buildings, dining facilities, or while attending sporting, entertainment or educational events.

When a member here went to court both the representative of GMU and the judge from Fairfax County Circuit Court said that nothing prohibited anyone from open carrying a firearm on GMU's campus.

Here's the general table of contents of the VAC regarding GMU:
http://leg1.state.va.us/000/reg/TOC08035.HTM

Here's the specific VAC regulation regarding weapons on campus:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC35-60-20

definitions:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC35-60-10
 

NightmareSHANIQUA

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Youve got three people interested in SCCC on GMU's Fairfax campus. I do agree that with all the time and activity it requires, its hard to run something like that and maintain a normal life :p

But Grapeshot did make a point, run it by committee. If it was several people contributing, then it lightens the load on everyone, but it just as effective.
 

hunter45

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NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
Youve got three people interested in SCCC on GMU's Fairfax campus. I do agree that with all the time and activity it requires, its hard to run something like that and maintain a normal life :p

But Grapeshot did make a point, run it by committee. If it was several people contributing, then it lightens the load on everyone, but it just as effective.

Well maybe we can work on getting something started. Are you a member of the GMU SCCC Facebook group? It has 153 members. I'll see if I can get in touch with one of the admins and get them to sent out a mass e-mail to the group to see what interest there is in getting the group active again.
 

essayons

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vt007ken wrote:
essayons wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found.  I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code.  A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.

Virginia Administrative Code is NOT law.

Substantiate your claim - it is enforced as law, making it illegal to carry on GMU and VCU campuses.

We have rehashed this many times on this site, do a search for "campus carry" or "VCU carry"

Virginia Administrative Code is not law, that is self-evident. Laws are contained in the Code of Virginia.

You have claimed that VAC is enforced as law on GMU and VCU. Please cite an example of this. Prohibition of students or faculty do not count, they fall under the university's regulatory powers.

I have not seen or heard of any case in which a citizen was arrested for carrying on campus.
 

SaltH2OHokie

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Well assuming one was a student and "bound" by the student agreement (punishable by expulsion), when does said student become a member of the public? As soon as he gets his degree? As soon as the last exam is taken? Just curious...(graduating in 12 days).
 

vt007ken

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essayons wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
essayons wrote:
vt007ken wrote:
pourshot wrote:
From the VCDL Places where carry is prohibited card...

VCU - 8 VAC-90-10-50 http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+8VAC90-10-30

and

GMU - 8 VAC-35-60-20 (no on-line link found.  I think this was added as a cautionary note)

and lastly...

Students of almost ALL universities as they have a prohibition against it in student code.  A code you said you would follow by enrolling....

I'm not sure what this was a reply to.

Anyway, you need to separate the first 2 from the last one - the first two are law, the last one is policy. AG 05-078 shows that school's own policies can only affect someone's enrollment/employment with the school, nothing more.

Virginia Administrative Code is NOT law.

Substantiate your claim - it is enforced as law, making it illegal to carry on GMU and VCU campuses.

We have rehashed this many times on this site, do a search for "campus carry" or "VCU carry"

Virginia Administrative Code is not law, that is self-evident. Laws are contained in the Code of Virginia.

You have claimed that VAC is enforced as law on GMU and VCU. Please cite an example of this. Prohibition of students or faculty do not count, they fall under the university's regulatory powers.

I have not seen or heard of any case in which a citizen was arrested for carrying on campus.

Without an arrest, I can't answer your request, so it really doesn't make any sense to ask for that. We have discussed this many times with experts in this area, including VCDL when they were here for our Defense Education Week. I'm not a lawyer, I'm arguing from the point of investigation and research.

I'll look into the other threads; I admittedly don't get on here a lot.
 
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