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Thread: Lautenberg's "P.R.O.T.E.C.T" Act (S.2820)

  1. #1
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    http://www.examiner.com/x-2581-St-Louis-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m12d2-Senator-Frank-Lautenbergs-continued-assault-on-gun-ownership

    "Yesterday (12-01-2009), United States Senator Frank Lautenberg (D-NJ) announced the introduction of (cue cheesy acronym) the "PROTECT Act." "PROTECT" stands for "Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions."

    Sen. Frank R. Lautenberg (D-NJ) today introduced the PROTECT Act, legislation to preserve records of gun sales for longer periods of time to aid law enforcement officials in preventing gun crimes and terrorist acts. Under current law, the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) must destroy these records in most cases within 24 hours of allowing a gun sale to proceed.

    Interesting, isn't it, that Lautenberg's own press release describes the proposed legislation's purpose as being "to preserve records of gun sales for longer periods of time . . . "--but the title of the bill refers only to "terrorist and criminal transactions"? That's pretty clear testimony to what Sen. Lautenberg thinks of gun buyers. Granted, "PROGS (Preserving Records of Gun Sales)" isn't nearly as catchy an acronym, but that's probably not a criterion to which much importance should be attached.

    So how, specifically, would Sen. Lautenberg's proposed legislation "PROTECT" us?

    Sen. Lautenberg’s legislation, the Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions (PROTECT) Act of 2009, would:

    * require the FBI to retain for 10 years all records related to a NICS transaction involving a valid match to federal terrorist watch list records; and


    * repeal the requirement that other background check records be destroyed after 24 hours, and instead require that the records of all non-terrorist transactions be maintained for 180 days.

    Remember, the "federal terrorist watch list records" are riddled with errors, generated with precious little (if any) concern about due process, and that the appropriateness of one's presence on the list is not easily challenged, because of the lack of transparency.

    As to the second point, the National "Instant" Criminal Background Check System (NICS) allows the FBI 3 days to find a reason to infringe on that which shall not be infringed--before the current 24 hour record destruction requirement countdown begins. If the most powerful, sophisticated law enforcement agency in the world can't find a reason to disqualify a purchase within 4 days, giving them 6 months to scrutinize the purchase, in order to invent a reason to declare it illegitimate does not appeal to me. If the FBI's inability to get the job done is to be used as justification to turn the U.S. into a surveillance society, let's just change the name of the country to Oceania.

    The "PROTECT Act" is far from Sen. Lautenberg's first attack on gun owners--just this year he has introduced a bill to outlaw private gun sales, and another to allow the Attorney General to unilaterally block a gun purchase based on the prospective purchaser's presence on the terrorist "watch list."

    This is just one more example of the use of the public's fear of "terrorism" to goad us into surrendering more of our freedom to the government. Sometimes it's said that the terrorists "hate us because we are free." Perhaps--but does anyone really believe that "they" will stop hating us, if we surrender enough freedom?

    Does anyone believe it would be worth it?"

    This is an extremely good time for a reminder to our lawmakers and this is the FAX I'm fixing to send:

    =================================

    REMINDER: S.1317 (Denying Firearms and Explosives to Dangerous Terrorists Act of 2009 (Introduced in Senate) ) and

    ďƒ*S.2820 (Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions Act of 2009)

    Both bills - introduced by Sen. Frank Lautenberg of N.J. - are TOTALLY UN-ACCEPTABLE to American gun owner’s.

    BOTH bills have no other real purpose than to infringe upon the 2nd Amendment rights of legitimate, law-abiding American citizens.

    S.1317 is blatantly UN-Constitutional due to the fact that it gives this (or any future) Attorney General the ability – simply on his/her own “say-so” – to deny anyone the ability to purchase a weapon, based only on the pathetically-weak “appropriately suspected”/”reasonable belief” so-called “standard”. This “standard is a JOKE and does NOT measure up to the 4th Amendments’ “probable cause” clause nor the 5th Amendments’ “nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law” clause. It also flies directly in the face of the 2nd Amendments’ “shall not be infringed” clause.

    NO Attorney General of the United States must ever be given the power to supercede the Constitution!

    S.2820 would be based on in-accurate databases that have NOT been corrected and which are, indeed, nearly impossible to correct since they are all covered by “national security” and/or “state secrets” blankets to conceal their shortcomings and in-accuracies.

    The SAME objections apply to H.R. 2401 (No Fly, No Buy Act of 2009) or any similar Senate legislation along those lines.

    A vote for, support of or co-sponsoring of ANY of these bills on your part is TOTALLY UN-ACCEPTABLE and will be responded to actively come your next re-election attempt. Likewise, your approval of any of these WILL be broadcast around the Internet and in our local papers and radio broadcasts.

    (Signed)
    ======================================

    Feel free to use that one or one of your own. You can find your Senator(s) contact info here:

    http://www.senate.gov/general/contac...nators_cfm.cfm

    Sure - all three bills are "in committee" - but how fast do you think they could fly out and get voted on if the "conditions" were right? Don't take a chance - contact them. Especially if your Senator is one of the ones who co-sponsored it.

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    spy1 wrote:
    http://www.examiner.com/x-2581-St-Louis-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m12d2-Senator-Frank-Lautenbergs-continued-assault-on-gun-ownership

    "Yesterday (12-01-2009), United States Senator Frank Lautenberg (D-NJ) announced the introduction of (cue cheesy acronym) the "PROTECT Act." "PROTECT" stands for "Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions."

    Sen. Frank R. Lautenberg (D-NJ) today introduced the PROTECT Act, legislation to preserve records of gun sales for longer periods of time to aid law enforcement officials in preventing gun crimes and terrorist acts. Under current law, the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) must destroy these records in most cases within 24 hours of allowing a gun sale to proceed.

    Interesting, isn't it, that Lautenberg's own press release describes the proposed legislation's purpose as being "to preserve records of gun sales for longer periods of time . . . "--but the title of the bill refers only to "terrorist and criminal transactions"? That's pretty clear testimony to what Sen. Lautenberg thinks of gun buyers. Granted, "PROGS (Preserving Records of Gun Sales)" isn't nearly as catchy an acronym, but that's probably not a criterion to which much importance should be attached.

    So how, specifically, would Sen. Lautenberg's proposed legislation "PROTECT" us?

    Sen. Lautenberg’s legislation, the Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions (PROTECT) Act of 2009, would:

    * require the FBI to retain for 10 years all records related to a NICS transaction involving a valid match to federal terrorist watch list records; and


    * repeal the requirement that other background check records be destroyed after 24 hours, and instead require that the records of all non-terrorist transactions be maintained for 180 days.

    Remember, the "federal terrorist watch list records" are riddled with errors, generated with precious little (if any) concern about due process, and that the appropriateness of one's presence on the list is not easily challenged, because of the lack of transparency.

    As to the second point, the National "Instant" Criminal Background Check System (NICS) allows the FBI 3 days to find a reason to infringe on that which shall not be infringed--before the current 24 hour record destruction requirement countdown begins. If the most powerful, sophisticated law enforcement agency in the world can't find a reason to disqualify a purchase within 4 days, giving them 6 months to scrutinize the purchase, in order to invent a reason to declare it illegitimate does not appeal to me. If the FBI's inability to get the job done is to be used as justification to turn the U.S. into a surveillance society, let's just change the name of the country to Oceania.

    The "PROTECT Act" is far from Sen. Lautenberg's first attack on gun owners--just this year he has introduced a bill to outlaw private gun sales, and another to allow the Attorney General to unilaterally block a gun purchase based on the prospective purchaser's presence on the terrorist "watch list."

    This is just one more example of the use of the public's fear of "terrorism" to goad us into surrendering more of our freedom to the government. Sometimes it's said that the terrorists "hate us because we are free." Perhaps--but does anyone really believe that "they" will stop hating us, if we surrender enough freedom?

    Does anyone believe it would be worth it?"

    This is an extremely good time for a reminder to our lawmakers and this is the FAX I'm fixing to send:

    =================================

    REMINDER: S.1317 (Denying Firearms and Explosives to Dangerous Terrorists Act of 2009 (Introduced in Senate) ) and

    ďƒ*S.2820 (Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions Act of 2009)

    Both bills - introduced by Sen. Frank Lautenberg of N.J. - are TOTALLY UN-ACCEPTABLE to American gun owner’s.

    BOTH bills have no other real purpose than to infringe upon the 2nd Amendment rights of legitimate, law-abiding American citizens.

    S.1317 is blatantly UN-Constitutional due to the fact that it gives this (or any future) Attorney General the ability – simply on his/her own “say-so” – to deny anyone the ability to purchase a weapon, based only on the pathetically-weak “appropriately suspected”/”reasonable belief” so-called “standard”. This “standard is a JOKE and does NOT measure up to the 4th Amendments’ “probable cause” clause nor the 5th Amendments’ “nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law” clause. It also flies directly in the face of the 2nd Amendments’ “shall not be infringed” clause.

    NO Attorney General of the United States must ever be given the power to supercede the Constitution!

    S.2820 would be based on in-accurate databases that have NOT been corrected and which are, indeed, nearly impossible to correct since they are all covered by “national security” and/or “state secrets” blankets to conceal their shortcomings and in-accuracies.

    The SAME objections apply to H.R. 2401 (No Fly, No Buy Act of 2009) or any similar Senate legislation along those lines.

    A vote for, support of or co-sponsoring of ANY of these bills on your part is TOTALLY UN-ACCEPTABLE and will be responded to actively come your next re-election attempt. Likewise, your approval of any of these WILL be broadcast around the Internet and in our local papers and radio broadcasts.

    (Signed)
    ======================================

    Feel free to use that one or one of your own. You can find your Senator(s) contact info here:

    http://www.senate.gov/general/contac...nators_cfm.cfm

    Sure - all three bills are "in committee" - but how fast do you think they could fly out and get voted on if the "conditions" were right? Don't take a chance - contact them. Especially if your Senator is one of the ones who co-sponsored it.
    Lautenberg and those that support him or just standby and do nothing are Commie-Nazis-Fascist-Socialist's that fail to honor their Oath of Office to protect and defend the U.S. Constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic, therefore they are TRAITOR's !

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    IDAHO COWBOY wrote:
    SNIP Lautenberg and those that support him or just standby and do nothing are Commie-Nazis-Fascist-Socialist's that fail to honor their Oath of Office to protect and defend the U.S. Constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic, therefore they are TRAITOR's !
    Really, Cowboy, you shouldn't be so insulting towards Commies, Nazis, and Fascists as to associate them with the gang that thieves and represses us fromDC.

    That DC gang is much worse. No Nazi, Socialist, or Fascist ever had the planetary reach and nasty influence those DC Dirtbagshave.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Regular Member Alexcabbie's Avatar
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    The damned SS cannot even keep a couple of goofballs off the street from crashing a State Dinner when a check of the guest list would have prevented it, yet Lautenberg thinks that the Feds keeping a list and checking it twice will save us from naughties and make everything nice?

    And that cute acronym "PROTECT". I love (NOT) the way the weasels across the Moat title laws with names that denote the very opposite of what they intend, like the "Worker's Free Choice Act" AKA "card check" which would allow Union goons to look over the shoulder of people as they vote for or against a union.

    When I started that thread "Off topic? (threats to the 2A are riding in on Trojan Horses galore) ; this is a fine example of what I meant.

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    All he will do is add more chains to imprison them with laws that people like lautenburg "think" everybody should kowtow too. UP THEIRS. His being ousted from office has been too long in coming. Complete ---king idiot.

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    The name implies that there are many KNOWN transactions to terrorists and criminals. Now like what has been said, that it either insists that Americans who buy guns are terrorists and criminals, or that it's ok for terrorists and criminals to make purchases from dealers.

    Either way, I'm not exactly feeling safer.
    I aim to misbehave

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    spy1 wrote:
    ...of allowing a gun sale to proceed.
    This isn't bad enough already?

    Allowed to buy a gun? What part of 'Right' involves begging for permission and being 'allowed?' By whom is my God Given Right to be a Tool Using Human being infringed? And why am I being put on a government list for doing it?

    Obviously, we DON'T have a Right to bear arms if we can't buy without getting permission.

    Then they want to keep the list of names? Even though it has already been proven that the weapons used in crime are almost never bought anyway?

    The Brady's SWORE they would NEVER use the NICS system to do this... And here they are doing it. So they put Lautenass up as a front man for it...

    You know, it's a good "NEXT step;" towards wiping out We the People's Right, er, Privilege we have to pay for and beg permission for...
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
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    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    It gets worse. The EPA (in the face of the notorious Emails) today formally declared Carbon Dioxide - the product of human respiration - to be a pollutant.

    This means that technically an unelected bureaucrat has just laid claim to regulate your right to BREATHE. :what: I remember in college readingone of aseries of essays on organized crime that had the descendants of the Capone crime family running the country (how prescient; this essay having beem written circa 1935) and mulling a tax on breathing air.

    The nulke-disarmament crowd has their "doomsday clock" purporting to show how close we are to a nuclear holocaust. I posit my own "Doomsday Clock" showing how close we are to Concord/Lexington II.

    During the Bush Administration we were at about fifteen minutes to Midnight. Obama's inauguration bumped it up to seven of. These latest pronouncements, of which the EPA declaration is the more greivous as it is bureaucratic fiat - have IMO pushed the Clock up to three minutes before midnight; about where the Doomsday Clock (Atomic) was during the height of the Cuban Missile Crisis.

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    Alexcabbie wrote:
    SNIP The EPA (in the face of the notorious Emails) today formally declared Carbon Dioxide - the product of human respiration - to be a pollutant.

    This means that technically an unelected bureaucrat has just laid claim to regulate your right to BREATHE.
    Bwahahahahahahahaha!!

    That means the worst violators are those blow-hards inthechambers to the left and rightof the Capitol dome. I'll take immediate, harsh regulation of their breathing. And give the EPA an extra $40M for staff bonuses!
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  10. #10
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Good thing they make hand baskets out of Stainless Steel, I believe conventional textiles would have combusted at this point.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    I was so glad to hear carbon dioxide was going to be the death of us all, I guess I never knew that we would die from it if we had to breathe it exclusively. I think Biology classes should address this issue. Maybe we should spend billions of tax dollars, mostly in out of country markets, to develop scrubbers that will turn that lethal gas into a useful one - like Oxygen. Or, and this is just a CRAZY thought, we could just quit digging up fields of green plants that would HAVE belonged to farmers and make sure that urban sprawl was to turn it into concrete, steel, and blacktop.

    But then farmers like me, my family and friends who aren't interested in the control of all other people, would just want to be left alone to make a living. And if our living actually IMPROVES the situation instead of harming others, isn't that Win/Win? Well what would a farmer know about the environment anyway? Maybe that if you make a bad enough mistake, it takes years to even accomplish a slight return to normalcy.

    And like guns, the GOVT now requires farm animals like cows to be registered and now I see why. Control. Give a bully a foot and they will take a mile, and all of your rights with them. Plus copious amounts of money.
    I aim to misbehave

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    ixtow wrote:
    Good thing they make hand baskets out of Stainless Steel, I believe conventional textiles would have combusted at this point.
    Har.

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