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Traveling to NC from VA w/VA-CHP
- Thread starter jadedone4
- Start date
tekshogun
Founder's Club Member
imported post
North Carolina recognizes VA conceal carry permits as does VA recognize NC's permit via reciprocity. Just use common sense and stay out of restaurants that sell AND serve alcohol (the grocery store does not count). Stay off educational property, local government property, look for "no firearm signs" and proceed at your own risk should you choose to enter these places, and if ever approached and questioned by an officer, the first things out of your mouth should be something to the effect of: "Officer, I have a concealed carry permit and I am carrying." When asked present that permit with your ID. And don't drink while carrying!
Other than that, you should be mostly fine.
North Carolina recognizes VA conceal carry permits as does VA recognize NC's permit via reciprocity. Just use common sense and stay out of restaurants that sell AND serve alcohol (the grocery store does not count). Stay off educational property, local government property, look for "no firearm signs" and proceed at your own risk should you choose to enter these places, and if ever approached and questioned by an officer, the first things out of your mouth should be something to the effect of: "Officer, I have a concealed carry permit and I am carrying." When asked present that permit with your ID. And don't drink while carrying!
Other than that, you should be mostly fine.
chiefjason
Regular Member
imported post
No need to reinvent the wheel. Check this site.
http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/northcarolina.pdf
If you plan to OC, just do not OC anywhere you cannot CC. That will keep you out of places that do not allow guns. The couple of exceptions are not worth mentioning for a short trip.
No need to reinvent the wheel. Check this site.
http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/northcarolina.pdf
If you plan to OC, just do not OC anywhere you cannot CC. That will keep you out of places that do not allow guns. The couple of exceptions are not worth mentioning for a short trip.
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
I want to reiterate what "tecshogun" said, so you are getting it loud and clear.
Here in NC, we have a "must advise" law if you are CC. ANY TIME you are addressed by an LEO in an "official manner", the FIRST thing out of your mouth needs to be "I have a valid VA (or whatever state) Concealed Handgun Permit, and I am currently carrying." Then wait for further instruction.
Don't reach for your wallet, or open your coat, or show the LEO your firearm. Don't do ANYTHING, and keep your hands visible, until further instructed. This is ESPECIALLY critical if you are driving a vehicle and are pulled over.
Hand on the wheel... Eyes on the cop... Polite demeanor... Wait for instructions.
Even if you are OCing in your car, you should probably advise, because if you've got your firearm in a holster, an approaching LEO outside your vehicle probably can't see your gun, and under NC statutes, that makes it "concealed"...
I know in VA, you don't have a "must advise" provision in your CC laws, but we do, and you MUST follow it, or you may end up cuffed and face-down in the dirt on the shoulder of the road, or worse...
I was with a friend who is a VA resident and has a CHP, and we got stopped in Falls Church VA on a burned out tail-light one evening. When the cop addressed my friend, the first thing the cop said was, "Good evening, Mr. blahblah. Are you carrying your firearm tonight?". He'd run the plates, and in VA, if you have a CHP, it comes up when they run your registration.
Actually it does that here in NC too, but since you're not a NC resident, I don't know if the CHP info is available on the NC computers. But under NC law, you must advise an officer at the FIRST contact.
Of course, the best way to avoid this is to just not get pulled over...
I want to reiterate what "tecshogun" said, so you are getting it loud and clear.
Here in NC, we have a "must advise" law if you are CC. ANY TIME you are addressed by an LEO in an "official manner", the FIRST thing out of your mouth needs to be "I have a valid VA (or whatever state) Concealed Handgun Permit, and I am currently carrying." Then wait for further instruction.
Don't reach for your wallet, or open your coat, or show the LEO your firearm. Don't do ANYTHING, and keep your hands visible, until further instructed. This is ESPECIALLY critical if you are driving a vehicle and are pulled over.
Hand on the wheel... Eyes on the cop... Polite demeanor... Wait for instructions.
Even if you are OCing in your car, you should probably advise, because if you've got your firearm in a holster, an approaching LEO outside your vehicle probably can't see your gun, and under NC statutes, that makes it "concealed"...
I know in VA, you don't have a "must advise" provision in your CC laws, but we do, and you MUST follow it, or you may end up cuffed and face-down in the dirt on the shoulder of the road, or worse...
I was with a friend who is a VA resident and has a CHP, and we got stopped in Falls Church VA on a burned out tail-light one evening. When the cop addressed my friend, the first thing the cop said was, "Good evening, Mr. blahblah. Are you carrying your firearm tonight?". He'd run the plates, and in VA, if you have a CHP, it comes up when they run your registration.
Actually it does that here in NC too, but since you're not a NC resident, I don't know if the CHP info is available on the NC computers. But under NC law, you must advise an officer at the FIRST contact.
Of course, the best way to avoid this is to just not get pulled over...
Mike
Site Co-Founder
imported post
Dreamer wrote:
Dreamer wrote:
That's only if you are carrying concealed, right? if you open carry, then no need to worry about this.
Mike
Site Co-Founder
imported post
Dreamer wrote:
Dreamer wrote:
No, he needs to check VCIN - DMV records do not contain CHP info.
tekshogun
Founder's Club Member
imported post
Mike wrote:
Mike wrote:
That is a good question but I don't it is very clear.
Mike
Site Co-Founder
imported post
tekshogun wrote:
tekshogun wrote:
What does the NC state say? I cannot imagine a permit holder must advise re open carry but a normal permitless open carrier would not.
tekshogun
Founder's Club Member
imported post
Mike wrote:
Mike wrote:
But this person is not permitless. We're told, whether you are carrying concealed or not, if you have a permit, you must inform. At least, that is the information that was taught to me by the professionals teaching the classes. That is why it didn't seem very clear to me if you are ONLY open carrying, but you do have a concealed permit, do you hvae to inform the officer of the permit?
Mike
Site Co-Founder
imported post
tekshogun wrote:
tekshogun wrote:
Please cite to the relevat NC statute so we can see the text of the statute.
Redwolf
Regular Member
imported post
I believe this has been covered before. No your not informing of a permit but that you have a weapon. that being said if your OCing then the officer would know you have one. In a car he would never see it so you should tell him. and no don't lead off with officer I have a gun.
I believe this has been covered before. No your not informing of a permit but that you have a weapon. that being said if your OCing then the officer would know you have one. In a car he would never see it so you should tell him. and no don't lead off with officer I have a gun.
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
Mike wrote:
So yeah, the DMV records do mot include CHP info, but in most cases, in practice, when a DMV query is initiated, it automatically runs a VCIN query too, and all that info pops up.
I'm not sure how the police computer system works in NC, but I believe we have a similar system. I was told in my CHP class that we should never forget to advise, becasue the officer would already know after running our tags...
As far as OC, well, there really is no such thing as OC in you're in a car and the gun is anywhere but on the passenger seat. If you are wearing it in a holster, it will be considered as concealed under NC law, because it will not be in "plain view" for an approaching officer.
I have a NC CHP. Most of the time, I OC in a Serpa on the right side. If I'm driving, and have a seatbelt on, you definitely can't see my .45 if approaching from the rear driver's side. So I'll always advise.
And no matter what the law is in your home state, if you have a concealed permit, and you get stopped and are carrying, you MUST advise in NC. Even if you're ostensibly carrying open...
And this goes for ANY time an LEO addresses you in an "official manner". Traffic violation stop, accident, even a "roadblock" or "sobriety check". Since you'll be down here near the holidays, you need to remember that.
Again, I reiterate, if you don't do anything that would get you stopped, you never have to worry about this.
But in NC, if you have a permit, and are carrying, whether OC or CC, you MUST ADVISE. The "must advise" statute isn't dependent on possession of a firearm, it's contingent on you having a permit to carry concealed...
Mike wrote:
Technically this is true. But in practice it's not really what goes on. VA state trooper's computers and many local LEO computer systems AUTOMATICALLY run a VCIN check when a person's DMV files are queries by an officer inthe field, and this would automatically show that the driver had a VA CHP...
So yeah, the DMV records do mot include CHP info, but in most cases, in practice, when a DMV query is initiated, it automatically runs a VCIN query too, and all that info pops up.
I'm not sure how the police computer system works in NC, but I believe we have a similar system. I was told in my CHP class that we should never forget to advise, becasue the officer would already know after running our tags...
As far as OC, well, there really is no such thing as OC in you're in a car and the gun is anywhere but on the passenger seat. If you are wearing it in a holster, it will be considered as concealed under NC law, because it will not be in "plain view" for an approaching officer.
I have a NC CHP. Most of the time, I OC in a Serpa on the right side. If I'm driving, and have a seatbelt on, you definitely can't see my .45 if approaching from the rear driver's side. So I'll always advise.
And no matter what the law is in your home state, if you have a concealed permit, and you get stopped and are carrying, you MUST advise in NC. Even if you're ostensibly carrying open...
And this goes for ANY time an LEO addresses you in an "official manner". Traffic violation stop, accident, even a "roadblock" or "sobriety check". Since you'll be down here near the holidays, you need to remember that.
Again, I reiterate, if you don't do anything that would get you stopped, you never have to worry about this.
But in NC, if you have a permit, and are carrying, whether OC or CC, you MUST ADVISE. The "must advise" statute isn't dependent on possession of a firearm, it's contingent on you having a permit to carry concealed...
mrjam2jab
Regular Member
chiefjason
Regular Member
imported post
mrjam, your reading is probably correct. In practice it is recommended to inform regardless of armed or not. That was one of the few questions that got dodged in my class. I think he knew the answer and did not want to tell an entire class they did not need to inform if unarmed. Personally, I just tell them and hand over the cards. YMMV. I've never gotten a second glance at a checkpoint, just have a nice day Mr. XXXXX
I just posted this on another thread as well. With the local city system, once you run the tag, the vehicle info comes up. There is a button to check the info for the person the vehicle is registered to. Once this screen is open you see the CCP info. I would assume that most cops open that one up. So if the vehicle is registered in your name and you have a CCP, then the officer can quickly access that info from their vehicle. As interconnected as the databases have become, I would think they could do it for out of state vehicles as well. Though I don't know for sure.
mrjam, your reading is probably correct. In practice it is recommended to inform regardless of armed or not. That was one of the few questions that got dodged in my class. I think he knew the answer and did not want to tell an entire class they did not need to inform if unarmed. Personally, I just tell them and hand over the cards. YMMV. I've never gotten a second glance at a checkpoint, just have a nice day Mr. XXXXX
I just posted this on another thread as well. With the local city system, once you run the tag, the vehicle info comes up. There is a button to check the info for the person the vehicle is registered to. Once this screen is open you see the CCP info. I would assume that most cops open that one up. So if the vehicle is registered in your name and you have a CCP, then the officer can quickly access that info from their vehicle. As interconnected as the databases have become, I would think they could do it for out of state vehicles as well. Though I don't know for sure.
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
mrjam2jab,
My point wasn't so much that if you're OC, and have a CHP you need to disclose, but rather that if you are OC in a holster and sitting in a car, then by the way the vehicular OC laws are worded, it is concealed, and therefore, even though you are OCing when you get out of the car, while you are in the car, it is technically concealed, because the officer can't see it in plain sight, and therefore you have to disclose if you have a permit.
If you don't have a permit, it shouldn't be on your hip--it should be on the seat in plain view. And even if you don't have a permit and it's in plain view, (and you don't LEGALLY have to disclose), it's probably a good idea to let an officer know you have a gun in the car...
Just another instance where having a CHP makes life a LOT easier...
mrjam2jab,
My point wasn't so much that if you're OC, and have a CHP you need to disclose, but rather that if you are OC in a holster and sitting in a car, then by the way the vehicular OC laws are worded, it is concealed, and therefore, even though you are OCing when you get out of the car, while you are in the car, it is technically concealed, because the officer can't see it in plain sight, and therefore you have to disclose if you have a permit.
If you don't have a permit, it shouldn't be on your hip--it should be on the seat in plain view. And even if you don't have a permit and it's in plain view, (and you don't LEGALLY have to disclose), it's probably a good idea to let an officer know you have a gun in the car...
Just another instance where having a CHP makes life a LOT easier...
Mike
Site Co-Founder
imported post
Dreamer wrote:
Dreamer wrote:
Really?Cite to authority.
mrjam2jab
Regular Member
imported post
Well then I must have misunderstood. My citing the statutes was based on your comment:
Which to me sounds like you are saying it doesnt matter if you have a gun, if you have a permit you must advise.
Well then I must have misunderstood. My citing the statutes was based on your comment:
Which to me sounds like you are saying it doesnt matter if you have a gun, if you have a permit you must advise.
JDriver1.8t
Regular Member
imported post
(copied from another thread: I don't take credit for the research)
You must inform the LEO if you have a permit and are CC'ing. See caps.
14‑415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.
(a) Any person who has a concealed handgun permit may carry a concealed handgun unless otherwise specifically prohibited by law. THE PERSON SHALL CARRY THE PERMIT TOGETHER WITH VALID IDENTIFICATION WHENEVER THE PERSON IS CARRYING A CONCEALED HANDGUN, SHALL DISCLOSE TO ANY LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER THAT THE PERSON HOLDS A VALID PERMIT AND IS CARRYING A CONCEALED HANDGUN WHEN APPROACHED OR ADDRESSED BY THE OFFICER, AND SHALL DISPLAY BOTH THE PERMIT AND THE PROPER IDENTIFICATION UPON THE REQUEST OF A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER. In addition to these requirements, a military permittee whose permit has expired during deployment may carry a concealed handgun during the 90 days following the end of deployment and before the permit is renewed provided the permittee also displays proof of deployment to any law enforcement officer.
http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-415.11.html
General GS codes site, if interested.
http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/gascripts/Statutes/StatutesTOC.pl
(copied from another thread: I don't take credit for the research)
You must inform the LEO if you have a permit and are CC'ing. See caps.
14‑415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.
(a) Any person who has a concealed handgun permit may carry a concealed handgun unless otherwise specifically prohibited by law. THE PERSON SHALL CARRY THE PERMIT TOGETHER WITH VALID IDENTIFICATION WHENEVER THE PERSON IS CARRYING A CONCEALED HANDGUN, SHALL DISCLOSE TO ANY LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER THAT THE PERSON HOLDS A VALID PERMIT AND IS CARRYING A CONCEALED HANDGUN WHEN APPROACHED OR ADDRESSED BY THE OFFICER, AND SHALL DISPLAY BOTH THE PERMIT AND THE PROPER IDENTIFICATION UPON THE REQUEST OF A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER. In addition to these requirements, a military permittee whose permit has expired during deployment may carry a concealed handgun during the 90 days following the end of deployment and before the permit is renewed provided the permittee also displays proof of deployment to any law enforcement officer.
http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-415.11.html
General GS codes site, if interested.
http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/gascripts/Statutes/StatutesTOC.pl
Mike
Site Co-Founder
imported post
JDriver1.8t wrote:
JDriver1.8t wrote:
Well, that clears it up - no reason to disclose to officer you have a permit to conceal unless you are carrying concealed; sine one can open carry in vehicles without needing a permit to conceal, there would be no reason to notify if open carrying in a vehcile even if you have a permit to conceal, except perhaps out of an abundance of caution to avoid a dispute over the facts of whether the gun was concealed by say a seatbelt, etc.
chiefjason
Regular Member
imported post
JD, I started to last night, thanks.
THIS IS NOT LAW!! It is a booklet released by the AG. No where in NC law does it tell you how to OC a handgun in a vehicle, as far as I can find. There may be case law that I am unaware of.
Mike, abundance of caution is a great way to put it. Personally, if I have a gun on me OC or CC, I would mention my permit. Simply because most LEO's know what it takes to get one, ie training and background check. YMMV
Take this for what you paid for it. Where vehicles are concerned I have always heard it had to be on the dash or seat to be OC. This site is the first place I have ever heard it mentioned to wear it holstered in the car as OC. I understand the argument, I agree with it too, just saying.
"D. Transporting Weapons
Given this general prohibition of carrying concealed weapons, individuals must be ever vigilant to ensure their particular situation cannot be construed as concealing a weapon, either on or about them, without being properly authorized to do so with a valid North Carolina, or recognized out-of-state concealed handgun permit. Therefore, the permittee's accessibility to the weapon is of prime importance. It is for these reasons, that when transporting a weapon in a vehicle, even greater care must be exercised to ensure that the weapon is not concealed, and within the ready access to an occupant of the vehicle. North Carolina law does not specifically address how to transport a weapon in an automobile. Therefore, the central question becomes: when is the weapon concealed and readily accessible to an occupant of an automobile? Obviously, a weapon would be concealed and readily accessible, and therefore in violation of North Carolina law, if it were placed in such areas of a vehicle as under the seat of the automobile; in a bag in the back seat; or in some other manner is covered or hidden within the easy reach of an occupant of the vehicle. It is our recommendation that firearms should not be carried in a glove compartment regardless of whether the compartment is locked or not.
While a weapon carried openly in an automobile would not be concealed, there are other problems specific to this method of carrying a weapon. The principal drawback, of course, is in the event of an individual being stopped by a law enforcement official, the officer may not readily know that individual's purpose and intent for carrying a weapon. As such, it is imperative that an individual immediately notify an officer of the presence of any weapon in the automobile, for the officer's and the vehicle's occupants' safety. Another obvious drawback is that a valuable weapon may be in plain view for potential thieves to see. The prohibition to carrying concealed weapons applies not only to handguns and other weapons commonly thought of as being easily hidden, but also to "long guns" as well. Therefore, shotguns and rifles concealed behind the seat of pickup trucks, and elsewhere in other vehicles, could similarly violate North Carolina law."
http://www.ncsheriffs.org/images/2007 NC Firearms Laws Pub.pdf
JD, I started to last night, thanks.
THIS IS NOT LAW!! It is a booklet released by the AG. No where in NC law does it tell you how to OC a handgun in a vehicle, as far as I can find. There may be case law that I am unaware of.
Mike, abundance of caution is a great way to put it. Personally, if I have a gun on me OC or CC, I would mention my permit. Simply because most LEO's know what it takes to get one, ie training and background check. YMMV
Take this for what you paid for it. Where vehicles are concerned I have always heard it had to be on the dash or seat to be OC. This site is the first place I have ever heard it mentioned to wear it holstered in the car as OC. I understand the argument, I agree with it too, just saying.
"D. Transporting Weapons
Given this general prohibition of carrying concealed weapons, individuals must be ever vigilant to ensure their particular situation cannot be construed as concealing a weapon, either on or about them, without being properly authorized to do so with a valid North Carolina, or recognized out-of-state concealed handgun permit. Therefore, the permittee's accessibility to the weapon is of prime importance. It is for these reasons, that when transporting a weapon in a vehicle, even greater care must be exercised to ensure that the weapon is not concealed, and within the ready access to an occupant of the vehicle. North Carolina law does not specifically address how to transport a weapon in an automobile. Therefore, the central question becomes: when is the weapon concealed and readily accessible to an occupant of an automobile? Obviously, a weapon would be concealed and readily accessible, and therefore in violation of North Carolina law, if it were placed in such areas of a vehicle as under the seat of the automobile; in a bag in the back seat; or in some other manner is covered or hidden within the easy reach of an occupant of the vehicle. It is our recommendation that firearms should not be carried in a glove compartment regardless of whether the compartment is locked or not.
While a weapon carried openly in an automobile would not be concealed, there are other problems specific to this method of carrying a weapon. The principal drawback, of course, is in the event of an individual being stopped by a law enforcement official, the officer may not readily know that individual's purpose and intent for carrying a weapon. As such, it is imperative that an individual immediately notify an officer of the presence of any weapon in the automobile, for the officer's and the vehicle's occupants' safety. Another obvious drawback is that a valuable weapon may be in plain view for potential thieves to see. The prohibition to carrying concealed weapons applies not only to handguns and other weapons commonly thought of as being easily hidden, but also to "long guns" as well. Therefore, shotguns and rifles concealed behind the seat of pickup trucks, and elsewhere in other vehicles, could similarly violate North Carolina law."
http://www.ncsheriffs.org/images/2007 NC Firearms Laws Pub.pdf