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Thread: Finally taking that trip.

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    Hey guys, I mentioned back in the day I was going to be making a trip to Williamsburg. Well after some serious complications in schedules and vacations at work, its finally all lined up.

    Any suggestions other than avoiding the parkway while carrying? Ive been there for years, but this will be my first trip carrying. I know a few good restaurants to go to and some shopping needs to get done.

    But questions:
    1. Any problems if I were to OC in one of the taverns? I was hoping one night the misses and I could sneak a dinner in if it wasnt too crowded and Chownings or Kings Arms.
    2. I was hoping to go to the outlets on the way out of town, I cant remember the names of them unfortunately. Has anyone had any experiences out this way?
    3. Any suggestions of things to go do or see? This is my first time down in the winter of the fifteen years Ive been there. I have no idea what to expect since Grand Illuminations was about two weeks ago?

    Thanks in advance for the help/love/advice/anythingyoucaretooffer
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
    CC/OC Sig Sauer 229 - trijicon night sights

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    Hey guys, I mentioned back in the day I was going to be making a trip to Williamsburg. Well after some serious complications in schedules and vacations at work, its finally all lined up.

    Any suggestions other than avoiding the parkway while carrying? Ive been there for years, but this will be my first trip carrying. I know a few good restaurants to go to and some shopping needs to get done.

    But questions:
    1. Any problems if I were to OC in one of the taverns? I was hoping one night the misses and I could sneak a dinner in if it wasnt too crowded and Chownings or Kings Arms.
    2. I was hoping to go to the outlets on the way out of town, I cant remember the names of them unfortunately. Has anyone had any experiences out this way?
    3. Any suggestions of things to go do or see? This is my first time down in the winter of the fifteen years Ive been there. I have no idea what to expect since Grand Illuminations was about two weeks ago?

    Thanks in advance for the help/love/advice/anythingyoucaretooffer
    Grand Illumination was Last Sunday,

    You won't have any problems at the Taverns. My wife and I go every year for our anniversary.

    I OC regularly at the Malls. Security may look at you funny but they do anyway. Never been approached by one.

    If you go to the pottery you might want to CC past the Gate Troll. I don't or course but I would if I had a permit.

    Don't know any restaurants other than the taverns. It's hard for me to find anything diabetic friendly.

    Must see are the Gunsmith and Blacksmith.
    The Book Bindery and furniture aker are good also.

    There is a new restored coffee shop in the restored area that just opened in Nov.

    If you have kids, the toy maker just out of the restored section and Massies Camera.

    Have fun.





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    Visited Williamsburg in October and OC'd at a few taverns. Absolutely no issues.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Nothing but good experiences in Williamsburg including in the restored area.

    It is fun watching the visitors from the twilight zones though.

    Enjoy and let us here how it goes.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    a note from a previous Williamsburg post:

    Summer of 2002

    The girlfriend, (now wifey) and I decided we wanted to have a long weekend away from the hustle and bustle of NOVA and relax. Being a colonial history buff I wanted to travel down to Historic Williamsburg and give her a guided tour as she had never been. Being as it was going to be a bit of a drive for us, and as I had recently been “indoctrinated” into the whole OC experience, I wanted to see if this would be a location I could open carry at. An extensive look at their website did not net me any information as to permitted or restricted, so I decided to try my luck and ask once I got down there.

    On Saturday morning we left our hotel room and with Glock secured to my holster and on my belt, we drove to Colonial Williamsburg. We headed into town and first came to the blacksmith’s shop. The smithy was busy pounding away at a piece of iron and chatting with only 2 other tourists who seemed to only have a passing interest in his work. I walked over to him and asked him for a moment of his time, which he was only too happy to give me. In a low voice I said I was legally carrying a firearm but wasn’t sure of Williamsburg’s policy and could he tell me if it was allowed or forbidden. In a tone twice as loud as I had, he answered me. I’ll try to recall his response as best as I can:

    “That good sir is one of the important questions now being asked by the brave men of the Continental congress. Should we as free men and women be allowed to carry arms and armament to protect the very vestment of the good lord, namely that of life and liberty. Do we have the right to protect our lands and lives against a tyrant and his army which care not for our safety and our children, but only for coins to be placed in his coffers. Nay good sir, stay your pistol upon your person and be ready to answer the call to fight not only for freedom and liberty, but for our homes and for principal”


    Needless to say, I was smiling from ear to ear. I would have excepted a simple “it’s allowed” but the smithy went all out to answer a question and to weave it into a historical context. It was to date the SECOND best response I had ever had. The FIRST best came an hour after the experience with the smithy.

    We were walking down the main street, looking at various arts and crafts being offered (her idea) and enjoying the scenery. I got a glance or two with the Glock 17 on my waist, but mostly we were ignored. Ahead we saw a squad of British soldiers marching up the street and being led by a Major who was dressed to the nines. As they got close, one of the conscripts in the middle pointed over to me and proclaimed loudly “Sir! That colonial is armed, shall we detain?” The Major stopped the squad and looked at me. Again, I’ll try and recall his response as best I can. While slowly walking towards me, he announced:

    “No Mister Danvers, while his majesty has proclaimed that any possession of pistol or musket is forbade and forbidden, these rabble pose no serious threat to either King nor Crown. For these colonist to believe they could ever stand up to the might of his Majesty’s fine fighting men would be madness and that of sheer folly. No. . .we will allow this one to keep his pistol.” The Major then leaned in very close to me, so that only I could hear him and whispered to me “For now.”

    He then walked back to the front of the squad and marched them along back down the street.

    We’ve gone back since then, but never got quite the same response as we did the first time.
    Carry On.

    Ed

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Those responses have become classics in the tales told 'round the campfire and shall be laid up in the archives of my lodge.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Will do! Ill take my laptop with me in case I need it. Or better yet, maybe just my iPod so I can jack random wifi without having to drag a cord around since my HP battery sucks a monkey ball.

    Hopefully some pictures to go with it.
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
    CC/OC Sig Sauer 229 - trijicon night sights

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    Oh boy fellas, it hit the fan tonight. So the misses and I have been cruising all over Williamsburg the past two days OC with no problems or even second glances from anyone. However it went totally south tonight. I went into Chownings and sat down strong side out. I exchanged pleasantries with the couple at the table with us. Suddenly the waiter is int ear and telling me my firearm cannot be in the tavern and that they could lose their abc license. I asked if it was from the proprieter of the property or Virginia law that stated that. He only responded with his brother owns a firearm. I told him i would like my bill to settle for my tea, the only thing I had been able to receive. The manager walked over and said the same thing about reenactors having to leave their arms outside the tavern same as I should. So once I settled the manager said security wanted to speak to me. I waited and discussed the oc law pertaining to on premise consumption. The guard shook my hand and asked for my permit. I informed him I was oc the whole time and did not need one. He turned and told the manager that as long as I didn't drink I was fine to carry. I politely told him that is still legal but I wouldn't anyway. They asked me to come back in and I told them
    I would kindly take my business elsewhere. The manger and the security were both very professional but the waiter seemed very unintelligent and pompous.

    Any thoughts in this?
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
    CC/OC Sig Sauer 229 - trijicon night sights

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    Oh boy fellas, it hit the fan tonight. So the misses and I have been cruising all over Williamsburg the past two days OC with no problems or even second glances from anyone. However it went totally south tonight. I went into Chownings and sat down strong side out. I exchanged pleasantries with the couple at the table with us. Suddenly the waiter is int ear and telling me my firearm cannot be in the tavern and that they could lose their abc license. I asked if it was from the proprieter of the property or Virginia law that stated that. He only responded with his brother owns a firearm. I told him i would like my bill to settle for my tea, the only thing I had been able to receive. The manager walked over and said the same thing about reenactors having to leave their arms outside the tavern same as I should. So once I settled the manager said security wanted to speak to me. I waited and discussed the oc law pertaining to on premise consumption. The guard shook my hand and asked for my permit. I informed him I was oc the whole time and did not need one. He turned and told the manager that as long as I didn't drink I was fine to carry. I politely told him that is still legal but I wouldn't anyway. They asked me to come back in and I told them
    I would kindly take my business elsewhere. The manger and the security were both very professional but the waiter seemed very unintelligent and pompous.

    Any thoughts in this?
    Maybe I'm getting more tolerant in my old (Which is doubtful) but it doesn't sound like it hit the fan to me. It sounds like you educated a business owner about the law and he understood. Am I missing something?

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    Well... It might have not exactly hit it, but it isn't exactly what I was expecting. I was hoping for some of that good ol virginia hospitality :P

    However, I feel the waiter made it worse by adding his two cents
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
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    Regular Member ChinChin's Avatar
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    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    Well... It might have not exactly hit it, but it isn't exactly what I was expecting. I was hoping for some of that good ol virginia hospitality :P

    However, I feel the waiter made it worse by adding his two cents
    Sounds to me as if this waiter was an alarmist and based his knowledge on "his brother" and hearsay.

    I wouldn't let this one incident (non-incident honestly) hamper your experience. You conducted yourself well, remained cool and acted with civility as opposed to jumping up and down and making a scene (like the antis do.)

    I wouldn't be surprised if the waiter is not from around there and is a college transplant from the New England region.

    Ya dun good Night, don't sweat it.
    The problem with the internet is nobody can really tell when you’re serious and when you’re being sarcastic. –Abraham Lincoln

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Nah, I'd agree nothing hit the fan.

    Ill informed/educated wait staff and by now likely a better educated manager.

    Did you ask if you could sit back down and enjoy their hospitality? I would have, after showing them a VCDL info card. Might have even received some comp.

    Still all in all, I'd say a good trip with at least 99% positive.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Alright, so you guys help make it a lot better. At the moment it was incredibly frustrating knowing what should happen an what did happen. Now do you think a letter to the Williamsburg foundation should be sent letting them know of the situation or no? I honestly feel that an area central to te revolution should have some slightly better staff? I would keep the letter in a positive note, like y'all said it wasn't that bad, but they should be educated?

    But grape, I didn't wanna go back in there after the the misunderstanding. I thought about it, but the waiter made
    me not want to. I haven't had too many negative experiences bur each one is one greatly felt. Maybe some more experiences will help me get more accustomed...

    Anyway, I head out tomorrow afternoon, so I'll catch everyone in the morning. Thanks for the quick feedback guys
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
    CC/OC Sig Sauer 229 - trijicon night sights

  14. #14
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Rejection makes the heart grow stronger - or sumpton like that.

    Sorry your meal plans were spoiled.

    A nice letter to the mgt. might be beneficial for future patrons.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    Any thoughts in this?
    Not that I am "any" authority on this.. BUT... Sometimes having a stack of OpenCarry Cards, mine or VCDL's are the perfect thing to "prove" to to another what the laws are without either one of you trying to cite them. I have plenty.. send me a PM with your address and I will send ya some.
    Carry On.

    Ed

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    ed wrote:
    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    Any thoughts in this?
    Not that I am "any" authority on this.. BUT... Sometimes having a stack of OpenCarry Cards, mine or VCDL's are the perfect thing to "prove" to to another what the laws are without either one of you trying to cite them. I have plenty.. send me a PM with your address and I will send ya some.
    + 1infinity to Ed's comment and +infinityxinfinity to the usefulness of both/either card in educating the ignorant and the confused. The Richmond OC events often generate comments/questions from onlookers/bystanders and the ability to leave printed reference information in their hands is often a viewpoint changer.

    A big THANKS to Ed for the original OC info card and the grant to use his design to anyone who wants to print up their own version so as not to be called Ed by mistake.

    stay safe.

    skidmark
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    peter nap wrote
    Maybe I'm getting more tolerant in my old (Which is doubtful) but it doesn't sound like it hit the fan to me. It sounds like you educated a business owner about the law and he understood. Am I missing something?
    Agreed.

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    I went into Chownings and sat down strong side out. I exchanged pleasantries with the couple at the table with us. Suddenly the waiter is int ear and telling me my firearm cannot be in the tavern and that they could lose their abc license.

    Any thoughts in this?
    Yes, here's a thought:

    How about we designate Chownings as the next venue for an OC dinner for people in the Eastern VA/Northern NC area sometime early in 2010...

    I'd LOVE to see the look on that waiter's face when a dozen or so OC'ers show up with reservations, with their families in tow, ask if he's working, and if he is, then they cancel their reservation and go somewhere else. Well, they leave AFTER they explain to his manager that they didn't appreciate how that waiter treated their friend from OCDO, and that they don't feel comfortable eating someplace where the staff is openly anti-Constitution.

    And then after their meal somewhere else, they all bring back copies of their receipts to the manager at Chownings...

    LOL!:celebrate:celebrate:celebrate

    Vote with your feet AND your wallets folks...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  19. #19
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Dreamer wrote:
    NightmareSHANIQUA wrote:
    I went into Chownings and sat down strong side out. I exchanged pleasantries with the couple at the table with us. Suddenly the waiter is int ear and telling me my firearm cannot be in the tavern and that they could lose their abc license.

    Any thoughts in this?
    Yes, here's a thought:

    How about we designate Chownings as the next venue for an OC dinner for people in the Eastern VA/Northern NC area sometime early in 2010...

    I'd LOVE to see the look on that waiter's face when a dozen or so OC'ers show up with reservations, with their families in tow, ask if he's working, and if he is, then they cancel their reservation and go somewhere else. Well, they leave AFTER they explain to his manager that they didn't appreciate how that waiter treated their friend from OCDO, and that they don't feel comfortable eating someplace where the staff is openly anti-Constitution.

    And then after their meal somewhere else, they all bring back copies of their receipts to the manager at Chownings...

    LOL!:celebrate:celebrate:celebrate

    Vote with your feet AND your wallets folks...
    I would find it offensive to deliberately set up a business like that and think it would reflect ill on us as a community. If you want to eat somewhere else, that's fine - even send your receipts to them.

    As for me, I will go by Chownings the next time I am in Williamsburg and simply sit down for a meal. What do you bet I have no problem?

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  20. #20
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    Dreamer wrote:
    Yes, here's a thought:

    How about we designate Chownings as the next venue for an OC dinner for people in the Eastern VA/Northern NC area sometime early in 2010...

    I'd LOVE to see the look on that waiter's face when a dozen or so OC'ers show up with reservations, with their families in tow, ask if he's working, and if he is, then they cancel their reservation and go somewhere else. Well, they leave AFTER they explain to his manager that they didn't appreciate how that waiter treated their friend from OCDO, and that they don't feel comfortable eating someplace where the staff is openly anti-Constitution.

    And then after their meal somewhere else, they all bring back copies of their receipts to the manager at Chownings...

    LOL!:celebrate:celebrate:celebrate

    Vote with your feet AND your wallets folks...
    Yeah, I'm going to go on record saying that's a horrible idea. Education is key, and once educated:

    He turned and told the manager that as long as I didn't drink I was fine to carry. I politely told him that is still legal but I wouldn't anyway. They asked me to come back in and I told them I would kindly take my business elsewhere. The manger and the security were both very professional but the waiter seemed very unintelligent and pompous.
    Honestly, this is probably the BEST outcome you could get out of an interaction with citizens and business owners.

    Take a pill.

  21. #21
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    VaLiberty wrote:
    I'm going to go on record saying that's a horrible idea.
    I am on record as 100% in agreement with you.
    Carry On.

    Ed

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    Regular Member 45acpForMe's Avatar
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    VaLiberty wrote:
    Dreamer wrote:
    He turned and told the manager that as long as I didn't drink I was fine to carry. I politely told him that is still legal but I wouldn't anyway. They asked me to come back in and I told them I would kindly take my business elsewhere. The manger and the security were both very professional but the waiter seemed very unintelligent and pompous.
    Honestly, this is probably the BEST outcome you could get out of an interaction with citizens and business owners.

    Take a pill.
    The gun-carrier should have sat down and had a meal and put up with the waiter or asked for a different waiter. By staying, it reenforces that you have a RIGHT to be there and in the mode (OC-ing) you were legally in.

    By leaving it reinforces the issue that gun carriers can be bullied either to give up our rights or to get out without service.

    Staying would have said alot more than leaving.

    Now if they did stay, they had two choices, 1) give the waiter a 1-cent tip for his arrogance, or 2) give the waiter a large tip reinforcing that gun owners are normal people and even more generous than the regular population.

    I haven't had a waiter treat me like sh__and all the waiters and waitresses that notice I am carrying get a larger than normal tip.

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    45acpForMe wrote:
    VaLiberty wrote:
    Dreamer wrote:
    He turned and told the manager that as long as I didn't drink I was fine to carry. I politely told him that is still legal but I wouldn't anyway. They asked me to come back in and I told them I would kindly take my business elsewhere. The manger and the security were both very professional but the waiter seemed very unintelligent and pompous.
    Honestly, this is probably the BEST outcome you could get out of an interaction with citizens and business owners.

    Take a pill.
    The gun-carrier should have sat down and had a meal and put up with the waiter or asked for a different waiter. By staying, it reenforces that you have a RIGHT to be there and in the mode (OC-ing) you were legally in.

    By leaving it reinforces the issue that gun carriers can be bullied either to give up our rights or to get out without service.

    Staying would have said alot more than leaving.

    Now if they did stay, they had two choices, 1) give the waiter a 1-cent tip for his arrogance, or 2) give the waiter a large tip reinforcing that gun owners are normal people and even more generous than the regular population.

    I haven't had a waiter treat me like sh__and all the waiters and waitresses that notice I am carrying get a larger than normal tip.
    While it says a lot by staying, what more does it say by leaving? Clearly if someone disrespects you in anyway (name, gesture, etc) wouldnt you be more likely not to associate with that person, despite a half assed apology?

    Im sorry, but Im gonna stick with my gut on that one. Going to another place to eat that doesnt give me trouble about my second amendment right to bear arms is way more of a positive than going back in after that. I think them losing the profit they would have made off me and the misses would hurt a lot more than having to admit they were wrong. I totally support the WF, but that tavern has a sore spot right now.

    Call me proud, call me aarogant, but it was my choice to go somewhere else. I respect everyones opinions, but I wouldnt get too carried away. This is the first negative encounter I have had happen to me personally, so yes, it might be a little drastic to some of you seasoned operators.

    But carrying while going to restaurants gets you special service, either by compliment or the silent acknowledgement and them taking care of you.



    OC dinner there would be fun though. Like a HUGE gathering.
    OC - Kimber Custom II - trijicon night sights, beveled mag well, and Wilson combat mags
    CC/OC Sig Sauer 229 - trijicon night sights

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