• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Stopped by the police tonight

A

autosurgeon

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
3,831
Location
Lawrence, Michigan, United States
imported post

Venator wrote:
autosurgeon wrote:
Look he could have done many things... However they are pulling 300 to 100 0 pounds of weed off that stretch of road a week and an older car lou exhaust with a flickering light.. well... while maybe not ideal I get it.
Click to expand...
Don't get me started on the failed drug war;). Another excusefor taxation.
Click to expand...
Oh I don't agree with it either... And many of the officers I know don't either but it is their job... and as long as it is the law they have to enforce it.
 
Venator

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

autosurgeon wrote:
Venator wrote:
autosurgeon wrote:
Look he could have done many things... However they are pulling 300 to 100 0 pounds of weed off that stretch of road a week and an older car lou exhaust with a flickering light.. well... while maybe not ideal I get it.
Click to expand...
Don't get me started on the failed drug war;). Another excusefor taxation.
Click to expand...
Oh I don't agree with it either... And many of the officers I know don't either but it is their job... and as long as it is the law they have to enforce it.
Click to expand...

No they don't, an unjust law is unjust and they have a moral obligation to refuse to enforce it. Are you saying just because it's a LAW they have to enforce it? I'm not just talking about drugs here, I'm making a statement in general about any unjust law. Like enforcing segregation. It was the law. It was enforced, but it was unjust. Any one of the thousands of officers had a choice in enforcing those laws.

Police have power and discretion and choices always!

Sounds familiar, "I was just following orders"
 
A

autosurgeon

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
3,831
Location
Lawrence, Michigan, United States
imported post

So your boss tells you to go on a drug sting and you are a cop and you going to say nope I don't agree with drug stings... Good luck keeping the job.

I know what is coming next... well you are better off without the job then... but when you have a family to support and in this job market ....
 
pmcqueen37

pmcqueen37

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
246
Location
Dearborn Heights, Michigan, USA
imported post

I read a good quote in a book Drug War Addiction by Sheriff Bill Masters.

7. Drug Wars and Gun Wars "Conservatives who care about the right to bear arms should also care about repealing drug prohibition. Besides the fact that prohibition drives the violence that's behind the sentiment to ban guns, drug prohibition and gun prohibition are rooted in the exact same social philosophy. Instead of regulating violent behavior, prohibitionists want to regulate inanimate objects. Historically, gun control is intimately linked to drug prohibition, as when alcohol prohibition led to the gangster violence, which became a pretext for passage of the 1934 National Firearms Act, the first federal gun legislation to apply to the general population. Liberals who are sensitive to the injustices of drug prohibition should also be wary of gun restrictions."
 
Venator

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

autosurgeon wrote:
So your boss tells you to go on a drug sting and you are a cop and you going to say nope I don't agree with drug stings... Good luck keeping the job.

I know what is coming next... well you are better off without the job then... but when you have a family to support and in this job market ....
Click to expand...
I don't have to say what you think I will,I already did in my post. We all make choices as did the Nazi soldiers. Oh damn I made a Nazi reference, shame on me.
 
KBCraig

KBCraig

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
4,886
Location
Granite State of Mind
imported post

Venator wrote:
autosurgeon wrote:
long as it is the law they have to enforce it.
Click to expand...

No they don't, an unjust law is unjust and they have a moral obligation to refuse to enforce it. Are you saying just because it's a LAW they have to enforce it?
Click to expand...
For instance, writing a ticket for defective equipment instead of a verbal warning to get it fixed? ;)
 
A

autosurgeon

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
3,831
Location
Lawrence, Michigan, United States
imported post

Let me explain this another way... Police profile it is what they are trained to do... I am driving an older car 92 lumina with a loud exhaust. The police have been picking up drug dealers and transporters in that very era of cars... and so very likely he was already profiling me and the bulb just gave him the excuse to pull me over and check me out...

Do I like it... not really as it takes up my time... do I understand it yes to an extent. Who knows this cop may beleive in the War on Drugs... I don't know... but what I do know is I have never been stopped for any reason that the police did not ask for license and registration.
 
Bailenforcer

Bailenforcer

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2009
Messages
1,077
Location
City
imported post

sevenplusone wrote:
For the record, in Michigan, when an officer runs your plate he does not get back CPL information unless he has a program designed to also run the registered owner which most do not. It's technically a separate transaction in the LEIN program. Usually the officer will run the plate and then run the registered owner before pulling over the car. Your plate info provides no information about the registered owner (warrants, driving status i.e. suspended/revoked/etc, or CPL info) other than the fact that they own the vehicle. It's perfectly legal to own a vehicle and not have a license and vice versa...which is why they must also have reasonable suspicion to pull you over such as a taillight being out or a traffic violation.

It's also very common that if an officer pulls over somebody who does not seem to belong to the vehicle...i.e. last names don't match, the story is shaky as to "well, it's, ummm....my....ummm...boyfriend's friend's car............" to have dispatch call the registered owner and ask who is supposed to have their vehicle currently. It's just a check to make sure they aren't dealing with a stolen.


I am not sure where you are getting your information from, but I will explain a few things.

1. I listen to 4 counties on my Police scanners and they are on 24/7. When they ask for a 28&29 (run lien) the dispatcher comes back FIRST with the CPL information, then the license and plate information, followed by all clear on wants and Warrants. Now when They have warrants that comes first with the CPL status is any.

2. I ran this by two Police officers I have know for more than 35 years. They said they also get as standard practice the CPL status when the run anyone.

3.When I moved here and the local sheriff a hard core anti gun idiot tried to circumvent the CPL process many times. I used to have what was called a "General CCW". Now I have the almost useless CPL, which gives me less rights.
Now I get my CPL and the next day I get pulled over and the MSP officer tells me he thought my head light was out. Three hours later I was pulled over by a city cop in another town and he claimed my brake lights didn't work, and when we looked they worked just fine. I suffere 14 BULLSH** pull overs in less than 10 days, and never was issued a ticket. Before than I was pulled over once 12 years ago and one more time about 10 years before that. get my point here? They all knew I had a CPL before I was pulled over and they targeted me. Upon discussing thsi with a couple of other CPL holders up here they told me the same stories. Here's the clincher. One of the MSP officers jumped the gun so to speak and as he walked up before I had a chance to say a word he asked where my gun was... How would he know I was a CPL holder? We never met before.

So whomever told you that the Police don't get the CPL info, are telling you garbage. There might be some Departments who have not got their systems updated, but most do.

Oh and your plate does in fact provide the registered owner info, this is why when you listen to them radio in a plate while still moving the owner info in fact is broadcasted. I have heard this done thousands of times.

While I wrote this a plate was ran with no owner name given or Drivers license info and she gave the owners name.

In ending none of them were rude nor confrontational they were in fact polite, but they were in fact fishing to see if I gave up the CPL warning to them.

Before when we had the CCW we were NOT required to identify we had a CCW or weapon. Back then the officers never knew.
Click to expand...
 
Venator

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

autosurgeon wrote:
Let me explain this another way... Police profile it is what they are trained to do... I am driving an older car 92 lumina with a loud exhaust. The police have been picking up drug dealers and transporters in that very era of cars... and so very likely he was already profiling me and the bulb just gave him the excuse to pull me over and check me out...

Do I like it... not really as it takes up my time... do I understand it yes to an extent. Who knows this cop may beleive in the War on Drugs... I don't know... but what I do know is I have never been stopped for any reason that the police did not ask for license and registration.
Click to expand...
If that'sone's belief then good forthem , but bad for society at large. We must question authority. To not do soencourages compliance and becomes aprotocol that people accept and then come to expect.

Last year I made an illegal left turn (No left turn sign), I did not see the sign and was not familiar with the area. Within half a block I pulled into a store parking lot. out of nowherea LEO taps on my window and asked if I had realisedI had made an illegal turn. I said no, he told me to be more careful and left. No ID request,no running my name, It was so fast I didn't even disclose my firearm. So they do have great discretion. Like I stated before they have choices.
 
S

sevenplusone

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2009
Messages
397
Location
Kent Co, Michigan, USA
imported post

I'm a dispatcher, LEIN operator, and 911 calltaker. It's what I do for a living and I'm pretty good at it. I use the LEIN system 60hrs a week at my job.

If you actually read what I wrote, I said, the plate gives the registration information which only provides the name of the registered owner. From that you can run the registered owner...which will provide information on the registered owner as far as CPL info, warrants, driving status etc. The plate has no actual information about the registered owner other than the address they provided to Secretary of State. Plate info is strictly related to the Secretary of State and has nothing to do with LEIN. In the actual computer code that the LEIN/SOS/NCIC/MDOC system runs in order to give back the info it's two separate transactions. I never said the police do not get the CPL info, I just said it wasn't tied to the plate...which I assure you, it isn't. Again, as I wrote, the officer probably runs the plate...gets the information about the registered owner and then runs the registered owner before pulling over the car.


I am not sure where you are getting your information from, but I will explain a few things. 1. I listen to 4 counties on my Police scanners and they are on 24/7. When they ask for a 28&29 (run lien) the dispatcher comes back FIRST with the CPL information, then the license and plate information, followed by all clear on wants and Warrants. Now when They have warrants that comes first with the CPL status is any. 2. I ran this by two Police officers I have know for more than 35 years. They said they also get as standard practice the CPL status when the run anyone. 3.When I moved here and the local sheriff a hard core anti gun idiot tried to circumvent the CPL process many times. I used to have what was called a "General CCW". Now I have the almost useless CPL, which gives me less rights. Now I get my CPL and the next day I get pulled over and the MSP officer tells me he thought my head light was out. Three hours later I was pulled over by a city cop in another town and he claimed my brake lights didn't work, and when we looked they worked just fine. I suffere 14 BULLSH** pull overs in less than 10 days, and never was issued a ticket. Before than I was pulled over once 12 years ago and one more time about 10 years before that. get my point here? They all knew I had a CPL before I was pulled over and they targeted me. Upon discussing thsi with a couple of other CPL holders up here they told me the same stories. Here's the clincher. One of the MSP officers jumped the gun so to speak and as he walked up before I had a chance to say a word he asked where my gun was... How would he know I was a CPL holder? We never met before. So whomever told you that the Police don't get the CPL info, are telling you garbage. There might be some Departments who have not got their systems updated, but most do. Oh and your plate does in fact provide the registered owner info, this is why when you listen to them radio in a plate while still moving the owner info in fact is broadcasted. I have heard this done thousands of times. While I wrote this a plate was ran with no owner name given or Drivers license info and she gave the owners name. In ending none of them were rude nor confrontational they were in fact polite, but they were in fact fishing to see if I gave up the CPL warning to them. Before when we had the CCW we were NOT required to identify we had a CCW or weapon. Back then the officers never knew
Click to expand...
 
Yooper

Yooper

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
800
Location
Houghton County, Michigan, USA
imported post

I had to do "road sides" when I lived out west. State Trooper didn't even take my gun away, or ask me to give it to her while I was getting "tested". I was sober by the way, but had almost missed my exit, so I hit the brakes hard and jerk the wheel to make it, @ 2 something in the morning....

Also, again, stopped by a state trooper sgt, out west for speeding. He walked up to the car, asked for the usual, told him I had a loaded handgun in the car (Did have a CCW permit (before they changed to CHL)), which is legal without a permit. He said "Oh, ok, I appreciate you telling me...most don't". I then gave him my DL, Reg, and Ins. He looked at the reg and ins, then gave them back to me. He walked back to his car with my DL, and returned 10 sec later with one of his cards.

Just so happened that there was a truck pulling a camper trailer broke down in front of us about 1/4 mile. Upon returning, he gave me my DL and his card and says, "See that guy up there? If you go help him, I won't write you a ticket" He starts laughing and says "I'm kidding, watch your speed because some of those city guys up ahead won't give you a break". Then I was on my merry way.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top