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hunting question

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wally1120

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Jackson, Michigan, USA
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i was wondering if i am on private property could i carry concealed. i would be out at a friends house that i have known for awile now. and his wife dosent like guns very much. do i need to get permission from the property owner. would i get hit for concealed carry if a dnr officer came out and checked the place out and found out i was carrying concealed. is there such a thing to get a ccw just to go hunting. i wish i knew more about gun laws. i am just wanting to find out before i find out the hard way.
 
SlowDog

SlowDog

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Hi & welcome to the forum! :D You will learn vaulable information on this site.
First off it is called a CPL.
Secondly without a warrant he has no right to come onto private property to question you.
Thirdly. As to the ability to carry concealed on private property you can with the property owners permission. Remember in Michigan it is all about "Private Property Owners Rights First"

Again, welcome and enjoy!:celebrate:celebrate
 
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captnkirk

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What I tell people during hunters safety courses is that if you are hunting private property, specifically someones land other than your own, simply obey their rules, wishes, feelings, etc. They are gracious enough to allow you to hunt their property so be respectful to whatever they wish. This not only shows consideration to them, but could very well secure you a place to hunt in the future.
As for carrying a handgun, this is what the MDNR has to say:

[font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"][size="+1"]Statewide Handgun Regulations[/size][/font] [font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"][size="-1"]The rules listed below may not apply to a person having a concealed pistol license (CPL) or a person specifically exempt by law from a CPL and carrying their handgun in accordance with their license or exemption.[/size][/font]
Click to expand...
  • [font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"][size="-1"][*]
    A person must be at least 18 years of age to hunt with (possess) a handgun.
    Click to expand...
    [*]
    Handguns cannot be borrowed or loaned to another person other than provided for under the CPL.
    Click to expand...
    [*]
    While in the field, handguns must be carried in plain view. Carrying a handgun in a holster in plain view is permitted.
    Click to expand...
    [*]
    You may transport your registered handguns while en route to and from your hunting or target shooting area; however, handguns, including BB guns larger than .177 caliber and all pellet guns must be unloaded and in a closed case designed for the storage of firearms and cannot be readily accessible to any occupant of the vehicle.
    Click to expand...
    [*]
    It is a crime for certain felons to possess firearms, including rifles and shotguns, in Michigan.
    Click to expand...
    [*]
    Nonresidents must have a CPL issued by their home state in their possession in order to legally carry or transport a handgun in Michigan.

    For more information regarding statewide handgun regulations, obtaining a concealed pistol license or Michigan concealed weapons and firearms laws, contact your local police department.
    Click to expand...
    [/size][/font]
[font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"][size="-1"]Hope that helps! Be safe!

Captn---
[/size][/font]
 
C

conservative85

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A person is not CCW under the following
In His House
At His Place of Business
On Land He Owns

If this is not your land, but still is private property you need permission from the owner of the land. I would get a written letter.

Slowdog is also correct, on private land the officer would need Reasonable Articulate Suspicion (R.A.S.) or probable cause (P.C.) in order to obtain a search warrant.
 
SlowDog

SlowDog

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No necessarily. If I rent my land where I live and there's say 100 acres of woods then it is "my land" to hunt as I please yet I have never read a land lease/rental agreement that included hunting. When one leases or rents property they assume legal rights to said land that even the landlord/property owner must abide by.
 
G

ghostrider

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SlowDog wrote:
Hi & welcome to the forum! :D You will learn vaulable information on this site.
First off it is called a CPL.
Secondly without a warrant he has no right to come onto private property to question you.
Thirdly. As to the ability to carry concealed on private property you can with the property owners permission. Remember in Michigan it is all about "Private Property Owners Rights First"

Again, welcome and enjoy!:celebrate:celebrate
Click to expand...
You need to cite this. I believe you are incorrect on that last point.

750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.

Sec. 227.

(1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk, stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of any length, or any other dangerous weapon, except a hunting knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about his or her person, or whether concealed or otherwise in any vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business or on other land possessed by the person.
Click to expand...
(2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.
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The land owner does not have the authority to grant permission to a non-licensed person.

Without a valid CPL, Glock Lover may not legally cc on that property.
 
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CoonDog

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Glock Lover, just to summarize, if you don't have a CPL, you can only legally CC at your home, business, or other land that you own. Under MI law, there is no exception for another private property owner to give you permission to CC on his/her property.
 
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conservative85

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SlowDog wrote:
No necessarily. If I rent my land where I live and there's say 100 acres of woods then it is "my land" to hunt as I please yet I have never read a land lease/rental agreement that included hunting. When one leases or rents property they assume legal rights to said land that even the landlord/property owner must abide by.
Click to expand...
True your right. Therefore he can cc on it if he signs an agreement, but coon has a point he may not be able to cc on his friends land even with written permission.

The only way I would try to argue Coons point is that if P.P. over rules any, and all state laws on possession, then the owner still may be able to grant said permission...I'd wanna be sure before I did it thou.. thanks Coondog
 
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conservative85

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Fishous wrote:
SlowDog wrote:
...
Secondly without a warrant he has no right to come onto private property to question you. ...
Click to expand...
I don't think DNR officers need a warrant.
Click to expand...
Contrary to popular MYTH, DNR same as Law Enforcement, and any other Govt dept. or Officials must have PC to get a warrant. The 4th Amendment of the United States Constitution makes it very clear. :cool:

There have been some cases where they have been allowed to enter Property outside of the fenced part of your land, but still to question you or to search your Person/s they'd need a warrant.
 
Z

zigziggityzoo

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conservative85 wrote:
If this is not your land, but still is private property you need permission from the owner of the land. I would get a written letter.
Click to expand...

Conservative85, there's no way to get permission to CC on private property you don't own, other than getting a CPL. The owner cannot grant you that ability.
 
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conservative85

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zigziggityzoo wrote:
conservative85 wrote:
If this is not your land, but still is private property you need permission from the owner of the land. I would get a written letter.
Click to expand...

Conservative85, there's no way to get permission to CC on private property you don't own, other than getting a CPL. The owner cannot grant you that abi
Click to expand...
(Polite calm voice) Sure there is, Lease/rent, and Maybe with permission by Land Owner.
Until I see a law that specifically states a land owner may not grant permission, for a friend to possess a hand gun OC or CC on his land then I will not relinquish my point of argument. . It's Like the OC argument...there is no law saying you may, there is just no law saying you can't. There is no law saying a Land Owner may grant a person cc permission, there is just no law saying he can't, thou a case can be made for a law in support of this argument, and that is PP.

I'm not trying to play guessing games like some other posters, I have laid it out clear.
I am open to debate with A.G. opinions, Acts, and law references.

It's on the front of the MOC brochure...PP rules over ride all laws on possession (It doesn't say OC or CC) :)
 
Z

zigziggityzoo

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conservative85 wrote:
zigziggityzoo wrote:
conservative85 wrote:
If this is not your land, but still is private property you need permission from the owner of the land. I would get a written letter.
Click to expand...

Conservative85, there's no way to get permission to CC on private property you don't own, other than getting a CPL. The owner cannot grant you that abi
Click to expand...
(Polite calm voice) Sure there is, Lease/rent, and Maybe with permission by Land Owner.
  Until I see a law that specifically states a land owner may not grant permission, for a friend to possess a hand gun OC  or CC on his land then I will not relinquish my point of argument. . It's Like the OC argument...there is no law saying you may, there is just no law saying you can't.  There is no law saying a Land Owner may grant a person cc permission, there is just no law saying he can't, thou a case can be made for a law in support of this argument, and that is PP.

I'm not trying to play guessing games like some other posters, I have laid it out clear.
I am open to debate with A.G. opinions, Acts, and law references.

It's on the front of the MOC brochure...PP rules over ride all laws on possession (It doesn't say OC or CC) :)
Click to expand...

Except there IS A LAW that says Concealed Carry is illegal. http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-750-227

(2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.
Click to expand...

Those are the exceptions.
 
SlowDog

SlowDog

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OK...instead of written permission pay 5 bucks to your friend<wink wink> and sign a lease for the land. Now you have "ownership" and can do as you wish.
 
G

ghostrider

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Michigan firearms law. You can't CC on the property when someone gives you permission to hunt there, but if you sign a piece of paper taking some form of ownership (lease), then you can CC without a license. Makes about as much sense as CC being illegal where OC is legal. Or being allowed to carry a knife over three-inches, as long as you don't intend to use it unlawfully against another person.
 
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