Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 41

Thread: Cop Pulls Gun on Civilians during a Snowball Fight

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,667

    Post imported post

    Live Free or Die!

  2. #2
    Regular Member Ajetpilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Olalla, Kitsap County, Washington, USA
    Posts
    1,410

    Post imported post

    What an idiot. He pulls his gun because he got hit with a snowball. Unbelievable.

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    2,546

    Post imported post

    You ever been pelted with snowballs that were a bit too solid? I can't fault the guy for thinking someone was attacking him... He shot nobody, which is, in my opinion, a good thing.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Sedro, Washington, USA
    Posts
    533

    Post imported post

    Yes, good that no one was shot. But bad that he pulled the gun at all. I was really surprised to see that it was a plainclothes detective. I thought for sure that it must have been a cop in uniform being hassled by kids or something not tar-tar.

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    187

    Post imported post

    never bring a gun to a snowball fight?



    what a failure.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    , Washington, USA
    Posts
    162

    Post imported post

    I can't look at the video due to internet speed sucks in Iraq. I did read the story of what went on. It sounds like the plain cloths officer did not identify him self due to other officers responding with their guns drawn. So here is my question.

    One of use are participating in this snowball fight. We are OC or CC'ing (unless it is in Seattle where you do not have the right to carry ). We see everything that happened. Are we justified to 1) draw our gun on the person with a gun 2) if he turns towards use are we able to use the force needed to take him down.

    I know we don't have the whole story but with what we have. What would you do.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Eagle River, Alaska, USA
    Posts
    584

    Post imported post

    I'm pretty sure defending yourself against a police officer (pretending to be a person) is quite illegal.

    Wow Tawnos you can't fault the guy? Look, if it was one of us out there CCing we get hit with a snowball and draw our gun but don't fire, we would be arrested on the spot at gun point no matter how hard that snowball was. If we ever want to improve our society we're gonna need to hold police to the same standard as all of us.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Kennewick, Washington, USA
    Posts
    395

    Post imported post

    FunkTrooper wrote:
    I'm pretty sure defending yourself against a police officer (pretending to be a person) is quite illegal.

    Wow Tawnos you can't fault the guy? Look, if it was one of us out there CCing we get hit with a snowball and draw our gun but don't fire, we would be arrested on the spot at gun point no matter how hard that snowball was. If we ever want to improve our society we're gonna need to hold police to the same standard as all of us.
    I completely agree with your second paragraph. We would be arrested in the same senerio. +1 FunkTrooper.

    As for your first paragraph, I'm not sure why defending yourself against a police officer is illegal. If you are indeed defending yourself (as defined by the RCWs), then that suggests that the officer is doing something well outside of the law. A blanket statement like "....defending yourself against a police officer is [] illegal" requires a considerable amount of evidence to substantiate.

  9. #9
    McX
    Guest

    Post imported post


  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Kennewick, Washington, USA
    Posts
    395

    Post imported post

    McX wrote:
    it's obvious why he pulled, they were using hollow point snow balls!
    WHAT!?!? I thought "Cop Killer" snowballs had been banned! There's no other purpose for expanding snowballs than to kill innocent people. Next, you're going to tell me that they had teflon coated "armor piercing" snowballs.

  11. #11
    McX
    Guest

    Post imported post


  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Bellingham, ,
    Posts
    608

  13. #13
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Fallon, Nevada, USA
    Posts
    5,580

    Post imported post

    The "cop" should be charged with at least brandishing or ADW.


    "because I got hit with a snowball!" Sheesh!
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    54

    Post imported post

    Feh.

    I think drawing a gun in response to people throwing snowballs is over the top. Drawing a gun because a rowdy crowd of hooligans is throwing snowballs and seems belligerent enough to escalate might not be.

    If you throw snowballs at cars, you should be prepared for the fact that, sooner or later, one of the cars you hit is going to stop, and a pissed off person is going to emerge with the intent to beat the living crap out of you. And when that person beats the crap out of you, I will not say you deserved the beating, but I also will have no sympathy for you whatsoever. If you don't want a beating, don't throw snowballs at moving vehicles.

    And finally, if you're stupid enough to throw snowballs and chant at a guy who's already drawn his gun, you should expect to get shot. Again, I will not say you deserve it, but if you're such an idiot that you engage in a group snowball fight with a gun wielding cop rather than leave the scene, you're not going to get ANY sympathy from me.

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Fallon, Nevada, USA
    Posts
    5,580

    Post imported post

    From the reports I have read, I have not seen where he identified himself as LE. EVER until confronted by an actual cop. So, he was simply MWAG, but a man who was actually showing, drawing, and brandishing it. And, from at least one person who was there, reportedly acting in "rage."

    http://lacymacauley.wordpress.com/
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

  16. #16
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Kennewick, Washington, USA
    Posts
    395

    Post imported post

    MrGray wrote:
    Feh.

    I think drawing a gun in response to people throwing snowballs is over the top. Drawing a gun because a rowdy crowd of hooligans is throwing snowballs and seems belligerent enough to escalate might not be.

    If you throw snowballs at cars, you should be prepared for the fact that, sooner or later, one of the cars you hit is going to stop, and a pissed off person is going to emerge with the intent to beat the living crap out of you. And when that person beats the crap out of you, I will not say you deserved the beating, but I also will have no sympathy for you whatsoever. If you don't want a beating, don't throw snowballs at moving vehicles.

    And finally, if you're stupid enough to throw snowballs and chant at a guy who's already drawn his gun, you should expect to get shot. Again, I will not say you deserve it, but if you're such an idiot that you engage in a group snowball fight with a gun wielding cop rather than leave the scene, you're not going to get ANY sympathy from me.
    Couldn't agree more. Did they continue to throw snowballs once he had pulled his gun though?

  17. #17
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Whatcom County
    Posts
    17,338

    Post imported post

    WahWahWah...."I got hit with a snowball....."

    Chances are if you show up to a snowball fight and try to get into it with them you will get hit with a snowball. He fails....big time and needs to loose his job we have way too many hot headed cops. There are way too many other ways he could have handled the situation.....hmmmmm like identifying who he was...maybe? Why did he wait until other officers showed up to do this?

    He is lucky, that he didn't get shot. And if he did he would have been 100% culpable.


    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    54

    Post imported post

    Dave The Welder wrote:
    [user=34852]Did they continue to throw snowballs once he had pulled his gun though?
    From the cell phone video I watched, yes.

    Given that the guy did not identify as a cop, these bozos faced two possiblities:
    1. The guy is carrying legally, which in DC means he's a LEO. Who is actually stupid enough to throw snowballs at a LEO with gun drawn?

    2. The guy is NOT carrying legally. Anyone who is actually stupid enough to taunt and throw snowballs at an enraged criminal wielding a gun is either more stupid than I could have imagined before today, or completely disconnected from reality.

    I think this is further evidence that the average IQ of a group of people falls and impulse control diminishes as the group size grows. It's probably the case that none of the snowball throwers was stupid enough to throw a snowball at an enraged person with a gun if they were alone. As a group, they took action to *escalate* by taunting him and throwing snowballs. as far as I could see, NONE of them had enough sense to say "Whoa, he's got a $%^&* gun, I am *out of here*."

    Nearly as distressing, a professional LEO let himself get swept up by it.

    This is a persuasive argument for staying the hell out of cities where people congregate unless you're prepared. I don't go into the city without reminding myself that one of the thugs who beat the Tuba Man to death is now out on the street and the other two will be out walking around, presumably filled with remorse but still short on impulse control, in about 3 months.

    Think on that. Three similar punks could beat you or someone you love to death, just for fun, and 1 of them would be back on the street doing it again less than 9 months after the funeral service.

    If that's not a sobering thought, you aren't paying attention.

  19. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    4 hours south of HankT, ,
    Posts
    5,121

    Post imported post

    MrGray wrote:
    I think this is further evidence that the average IQ of a group of people falls and impulse control diminishes as the group size grows. It's probably the case that none of the snowball throwers was stupid enough to throw a snowball at an enraged person with a gun if they were alone. As a group, they took action to *escalate* by taunting him and throwing snowballs. as far as I could see, NONE of them had enough sense to say "Whoa, he's got a $%^&* gun, I am *out of here*."

    Nearly as distressing, a professional LEO let himself get swept up by it.

    I think there is a lack of maturity across the board in modern society. Cops and private citizens alike. This kind of thing has the same roots as people who road rage because of petty things.

  20. #20
    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Bremerton, Washington, United States
    Posts
    884

    Post imported post

    And the lack of accountability rolls right along.

    I have a very apt comparison for police officers but I'm sure everyone here will be outraged. And yes I have friends who are cops and they agree with me but feel their hands are tied because of procedural and cultural reasons.
    "Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world." ~ Musashi

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Eagle River, Alaska, USA
    Posts
    584

    Post imported post

    Dave The Welder wrote:
    FunkTrooper wrote:
    I'm pretty sure defending yourself against a police officer (pretending to be a person) is quite illegal.

    Wow Tawnos you can't fault the guy? Look, if it was one of us out there CCing we get hit with a snowball and draw our gun but don't fire, we would be arrested on the spot at gun point no matter how hard that snowball was. If we ever want to improve our society we're gonna need to hold police to the same standard as all of us.
    I completely agree with your second paragraph. We would be arrested in the same senerio. +1 FunkTrooper.

    As for your first paragraph, I'm not sure why defending yourself against a police officer is illegal. If you are indeed defending yourself (as defined by the RCWs), then that suggests that the officer is doing something well outside of the law. A blanket statement like "....defending yourself against a police officer is [] illegal" requires a considerable amount of evidence to substantiate.
    Your right, I shouldn't have said illegal I should have said stupid If a cop is way out of line to the point I need to discharge my weapon I better hope honorable police investigate, I just think it's unwise to mess with the brotherhood no matter how justifiable.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13

    Post imported post

    FunkTrooper wrote:
    If we ever want to improve our society we're gonna need to hold police to the same standard as all of us.
    I disagree. All cops should be held to a HIGHER standard then the citizens they supposedlyserve and protect.

    Manypatrol the streets afraid of their ownshadows and you only need togive themhalf a reason for the business end of the firearm to be pointed in yourdirection.

    Many PD's are being militarized beyond recognition and for what? You've got to wonder who they consider is the enemy.







  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Eagle River, Alaska, USA
    Posts
    584

    Post imported post

    Well BORG baby steps first.

  24. #24
    Regular Member killchain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Richland, Washington, USA
    Posts
    788

    Post imported post

    Just want to point out the obvious:

    The video didn't show a snowball being thrown, or a gun being drawn. Just some young guys yelling at a cop about it.

    Even though he did admit it.
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." -John Stuart Mill

  25. #25
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,667

    Post imported post

    Correct it didn't. However, this was covered on the Today show this morning with some greater detail. The sowball fight was a viral call and was recorded by many different angles. The MWAG was hit by a snowball and he did go 'ballastic' and he was out of line. The 'police' first denied he removed his handgun from his holster, however, after more video has come forward they have recanted that statement and now are 'investigating'. This offficer should be punished, reprimanded or depending on his record; terminated.

    Or perhaps POTUS should invite him over for a beer?!

    See the MWAG here:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8424836.stm

    Live Free or Die!

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •