armed robbery, would you interfere?

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At the end of the video, one of the robbers gets a few shots off and obviously shoots one of the clerks.

If I'm in a store while this is happening, there's probably a good chance I'm going to die anyway. I might as well try and preserve my life the best I can. There's no way that one could not argue self defense here. Obviously everyone in the building is in extreme fear of their life, to run AWAY from an attacker when they have a gun pulled on you is only going to positively guarantee that you get shot in the back.

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Hell with it PEPPER THERE AS$es, I guess that is why I now have a SPRAY N PRAY. The Good People need to duck, And the Bad Guys need to align there heads with my front sight.

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SpringerXDacp wrote:

Not that it really matters but I don't think HankT is from Virginia. And, methinks HankT is not a he. Again, not that it really matters....just sayn'.

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Re: Hank T's location, do you have any information to the contrary? Or any affirmative information regarding his location? Perhaps you suspect he is a federal agent? If so, keep in mind that many folks who work in DC actually live in Virginia, that the Pentagon is located in Arlington, Virginia, and also that CIA headquarters at Langley is in Virginia.

On a previous occasion when HankT was trolling the MI forum, he was called out by several members after challenging Kimberguy on why he would OC an AK-47. Hank T then claimed that users Tomahawk and Grapeshot would vouch for him. Note that Tomahawk and Grapeshot are both from Virginia. When I questioned him on this, he disappeared from the thread.

http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/31061-1.html

http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=31061&forum_id=30&jump_to=524101#p524101


Sorry for being OT, as this could use it's own thread, but I love a good puzzle.

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CD, starting a H-T thread would only give (it) the attention (it) wants.springerdave.

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One very important factor to remember in all of this. Those of us who carry - either open or concealed - carry with the intent of defending our own persons and family members. Going outside that boundary, even for a good and legitimate reason, is very dangerous legally in our culture today.

This is a tactically bad situation, even for a trained officer. Several have already touched on this thought. Others have also suggested that this may not have happened with other customers in the room, and it probably would not have occurred.

Though we carry a deadly weapon, we have to remember to avoid the hero complex and focus on the reluctance to use our guns unless absolutely necessary to defend ourselves or our families. Anything beyond that will result in more trauma - legally, financially, and emotionally.

What would have been better in this situation is for the employees to have a visible gun holstered on their person (and the ability to use it). It wouldn't hurt also to have an 870 with buck shot hanging on the wall or in the office available for use.

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One other thought: as Ghostrider stated the locked door changes a lot of things. It's still a bad tactical situation, but if action is necessary, take action and die like a man on your feet with gun blazing instead of like a slave on your knees.

Still, the potential legal nightmare would be the thing that determined my course of action. Unlike LEO's I don't have the luxury of shooting preemptively. But, like every good law, the shooting laws hinder the good guy and help the bad guy.

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emptypockets wrote:

One other thought: as Ghostrider stated the locked door changes a lot of things. It's still a bad tactical situation, but if action is necessary, take action and die like a man on your feet with gun blazing instead of like a slave on your knees.

Still, the potential legal nightmare would be the thing that determined my course of action. Unlike LEO's I don't have the luxury of shooting preemptively. But, like every good law, the shooting laws hinder the good guy and help the bad guy.

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As soon as the BG produced the gun I can lawfully "stop the threat". If the BG will threaten the clerks' lives, mine is most certainly threatened also. I don't need the gun pointed at me to figure that out.

Those that are concerned about the possible legal ramifications should reconsider carrying a weapon.

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is seems the BGs wait till there sure they will have no extra forces to deal with during the crime. lotsa time spent watching the door, casing the joint for the best time to strike!

i think that just "being there" would have queered the heist for them, whether OC or CC, they probably would have waited outside untill all customers had left the store.

now if i had been standing there, by the door, and those 3 apparent thug looking BGs came in anyway, i would have left the store before the door had even had a chance to close!

call for help, be a witness, live to fight another day.

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1245A Defender wrote:

now if i had been standing there, by the door, and those 3 apparent thug looking BGs came in anyway, i would have left the store before the door had even had a chance to close!

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I agree. I was in Wal-Mart yesterday when I saw some thug looking guy. I high tailed it out of there leaving my cart full of goods behind. I went to the Meijers instead. But when I got there I saw a thug looking guy there too. So I ran away and went to the Big Lot's nearby. I hadn't even got out of my car when I saw a tough looking woman going inside. I headed home as fast as I could and locked all the doors as soon as i got there. I'm not going out anymore because there are too many bad looking people around.

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1245A Defender wrote:

is seems the BGs wait till there sure they will have no extra forces to deal with during the crime. lotsa time spent watching the door, casing the joint for the best time to strike!

i think that just "being there" would have queered the heist for them, whether OC or CC, they probably would have waited outside untill all customers had left the store.

...

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I agree with this. People who are up to no good often times wait for the advantage. The don't attack when the opposition is strong. Rarely does one individual attack a group of several. The often wait until dark.

Would they have done it with people in the store? Who knows. It's even possible that the last guy in was signaled when the last legit customer left the store, and then locked it himself upon entry.

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CV67PAT wrote:

I agree. I was in Wal-Mart yesterday when I saw some thug looking guy. I high tailed it out of there leaving my cart full of goods behind. I went to the Meijers instead. But when I got there I saw a thug looking guy there too. So I ran away and went to the Big Lot's nearby. I hadn't even got out of my car when I saw a tough looking woman going inside. I headed home as fast as I could and locked all the doors as soon as i got there. I'm not going out anymore because there are too many bad looking people around.

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maybe you can get your groceries delivered:what:

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CV67PAT wrote:

1245A Defender wrote:

now if i had been standing there, by the door, and those 3 apparent thug looking BGs came in anyway, i would have left the store before the door had even had a chance to close!

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I agree. I was in Wal-Mart yesterday when I saw some thug looking guy. I high tailed it out of there leaving my cart full of goods behind. I went to the Meijers instead. But when I got there I saw a thug looking guy there too. So I ran away and went to the Big Lot's nearby. I hadn't even got out of my car when I saw a tough looking woman going inside. I headed home as fast as I could and locked all the doors as soon as i got there. I'm not going out anymore because there are too many bad looking people around.

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He he. I thought the same thing when I saw the post. Mind you I didn't take the post that way. I figured that Defender was posting such prose on a board for people who carry guns in a responsible manner, then he probably figured he could just generalize rather than provide detailed practices that are commonly understood among the forum members. I certainly didn't think he meant it in a, "Chicken Little, the sky is falling..! Go hide under the covers." way.

Still, as one who often is known for viewing audible, verbal communication in a quite literal way, I did get a chuckle out of the way it was worded.

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1245A Defender wrote:

CV67PAT wrote:

I agree. I was in Wal-Mart yesterday when I saw some thug looking guy. I high tailed it out of there leaving my cart full of goods behind. I went to the Meijers instead. But when I got there I saw a thug looking guy there too. So I ran away and went to the Big Lot's nearby. I hadn't even got out of my car when I saw a tough looking woman going inside. I headed home as fast as I could and locked all the doors as soon as i got there. I'm not going out anymore because there are too many bad looking people around.

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maybe you can get your groceries delivered:what:

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I tried that. But, the kid delivering them looked suspicious, he had a ball cap on backwards, and I was too afraid to answer the door.

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CV67PAT wrote:

emptypockets wrote: Those that are concerned about the possible legal ramifications should reconsider carrying a weapon.

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I disagree. My first priority is to protect my family for a lifetime, not necessarily an innocent victim of a robbery. I can't really protect them when I'm dead or sitting in prison next to Bubba.

Then again, none of us know what we would really do in a situation like this. Some of us who say "I'll drop the bad guy and go around until they're all down" just might be the one standing in a puddle of his own urine. The guy that says "I'll run" might be the one who takes them down. You never know.

Talk is just talk until called to action.

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emptypockets wrote:

CV67PAT wrote:

emptypockets wrote: Those that are concerned about the possible legal ramifications should reconsider carrying a weapon.

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I disagree. My first priority is to protect my family for a lifetime, not necessarily an innocent victim of a robbery. I can't really protect them when I'm dead or sitting in prison next to Bubba.

Then again, none of us know what we would really do in a situation like this. Some of us who say "I'll drop the bad guy and go around until they're all down" just might be the one standing in a puddle of his own urine. The guy that says "I'll run" might be the one who takes them down. You never know.

Talk is just talk until called to action.

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Exactamundo!

Truthfully, the only people who can say with any amount of certainty are those who have already lived through such a situation, and even they can not for certain say how they would react should it happen again. Sure, they can think they would react the same as last time, and probably are in a better position to make that assumption, but that doesn't mean they will.

The best any one can do is train for the worst and hope for the best.