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Thread: AP reports: Man with AK-47-style gun in park not helpful to gun rights agenda

  1. #1
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    http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...MPLATE=DEFAULT

    SNIP
    Dec 24, 8:47 AM EST

    Man with AK-47-style gun in park detained, let go

    By TRAVIS LOLLER
    Associated Press Writer

    NASHVILLE, Tenn. (AP) -- A man carrying an AK-47-style semiautomatic pistol was detained at Radnor Lake State Park on Sunday after startled hikers complained to park rangers.

    Ellen Thomas told WSMV-TV she was hiking an upper trail when she encountered 37-year-old Leonard Embody wearing a camouflage jacket, military boots and a black skull cap. She called the encounter "scary."

    State Department of Environment and Conservation spokeswoman Tisha Calabrese-Benton said Embody was detained by park rangers because his weapon looked like a rifle.

    After the gun was secured and Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco Firearms and Explosives personnel were called, Embody was released without charges because he has a handgun carry permit.

    Calabrese-Benton said the gun had no stock and the barrel was under 11 inches, however state attorneys are still investigating whether the AK-47-style pistol, with a 30-round magazine, is legal to carry as a handgun.

    The state legislature passed a law earlier this year allowing people with handgun permits to carry their weapons in parks.

    John Pierce is a co-founder of OpenCarry.org, a group that seeks to normalize the open carry of "properly holstered handguns" as people go about their lives.

    "On a fundamental level, I don't think he did anything wrong," Pierce said of Embody, "but politically that might not be best thing to do and it's not something we're advocating for."

    Pierce said wearing camouflage also perpetuates an unhelpful stereotype.

    Pierce said he lived in Bristol, Va., for years, right on Tennessee border. He said he has openly carried a holstered, normal-sized handgun in Tennessee numerous times and never had anyone complain about it.




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    I found the audio for the first part of my walk. It includes when I exited my car stating the date up to and including the encounter with the first ranger (at around 28 minutes into it). He clearly asks for and I show him my HCP, handgun carry permit. I clearly explain the firearm is a handgun and the reason why it is a handgun. Heacknowleges thattechnically it is a handgun. I speak with someone who passed by and he lets me go.

    audio

    I didn't listen to all of the audio, but clearly no one is screaming or anything. I don't think I said anything to anyone as I walked the lake trail.



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    MEM, I think all that John is saying (normal-sized) is that he carries a handgun that appears to be, to a reasonable person, a pistol and not a firearm that's questionable to the general public/LE.

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    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    MEM, I think all that John is saying (normal-sized) is that he carries a handgun that appears to be, to a reasonable person, a pistol and not a firearm that's questionable to the general public/LE.
    And more to the point, questionable under the law - Tennessee has onerous carry restrictions compared to most states - and long carry is illegal apparently in many places such as this park, hence the problem.

    The Tennessee legislature has been trying to move forward and liberalize laws - and localities can still ban all gun carry in local parks - its incidents encourage loclities to ban gun carry in parks.

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    Mike wrote:
    John Pierce is a co-founder of OpenCarry.org, a group that seeks to normalize the open carry of "properly holstered handguns" as people go about their lives.
    That's great, and Iconsider myself part of themovement, as an advocate of ALLFORMS of the right to keep and bear arms.


    Mike wrote:
    "On a fundamental level, I don't think he did anything wrong," Pierce said
    Excellent!

    Mike wrote:
    "but politically that might not be best thing to do and it's not something we're advocating for."
    Now, whyadd all that? Now you have to explain why politically it's not the best thing to do. Becausesuch a statement is asuninformative and useless asthe gun owners and concealed carriers I see every day saying, without detailed explanation,open carry isn't the best thing to do politically. Saying such things to the general public, in fact, hurts gun rightsbecause it's just another generic statement floating around out there without critical foundation.

    Mike wrote:
    Pierce said wearing camouflage also perpetuates an unhelpful stereotype.
    When making statements for publication, shouldn't we stick to points which are relevant? What has the pattern of his clothing to do with anything? Sure, anti-gun folks may make an issue of it, but what does it help to give it any more false validation than for gun people to ALSO bring it up? It's a non-issue which should not receive any commentary whatsoever from us. Those whokeep such stereotypes alivecertainly shouldn't get MORE help with us referring to it too!
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    kwikrnu wrote:
    I found the audio for the first part of my walk. It includes when I exited my car stating the date up to and including the encounter with the first ranger (at around 28 minutes into it). He clearly asks for and I show him my HCP, handgun carry permit. I clearly explain the firearm is a handgun and the reason why it is a handgun. Heacknowleges thattechnically it is a handgun. I speak with someone who passed by and he lets me go.

    audio

    I didn't listen to all of the audio, but clearly no one is screaming or anything. I don't think I said anything to anyone as I walked the lake trail.



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    It's much better to be shot with a "normal looking" handgun than a scary looking one.





    .

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    kwikrnuis the new incarnation of Don Ortega, the guy the singlehandedly motivated a City Council in Colorado to ban open carry, by repeatedly carrying a shotgun into City Council meetings. With "friends" like kwikrnu, legitimate OCers don't need enemies.


    [line]

    http://www.gazette.com/articles/orte...lice-door.html

    ‘Shotgun guy’ cited in squad-car kicking
    Police say man has inexplicable beef with them

    April 28, 2007 1:27 AM

    Don Ortega isn’t afraid to stand up to authority. But kicking its door shut Friday landed him in handcuffs and got him a date in municipal court.

    Ortega, 42, is known around Colorado Springs City Hall as the “shotgun guy” after he carried an empty shotgun to City Council meetings in 2003. Weapons subsequently were banned in city buildings.

    Still, he regularly attends council meetings to complain of police harassment and to criticize traffic enforcement and street maintenance.

    “He likes to exercise his rights and that’s fine, until he breaks the law,” said Colorado Springs police Lt. Steve Tobias.

    Tobias said Ortega crossed that line in April 2005 when he carried his shotgun and wore a knife around his neck and entered cityowned Memorial Hospital to test the ban.

    And police say he crossed it again Friday when he kicked the door of a police cruiser as he rode past it on his bicycle.

    “He was cited for a misdemeanor offense of damaging public property,” Tobias said. “He faces a fine up to $500 and possibly 90 days in jail, if convicted.”

    The door-kicking occurred when Sgt. Mike Cram and officer Slate Blanche were parked in an alley behind Roswell Community Church on Friday morning as they prepared for traffic control at a funeral service that was under way.

    Blanche left his police cruiser to talk to Cram, who was parked behind him in the alley, when Ortega rode past on his bicycle.

    “Both officers heard a loud noise and observed a white male on a bicycle had driven past officer Blanche’s vehicle and kicked the door shut,” according to the police report.

    The officers ordered Ortega to stop and he rode off, forcing Blanche to chase him, the report said.

    Ortega was handcuffed, given a summons and released.

    “I’m not sure if he’s frustrated with police or what,” Tobias said, recalling his own dealings with Ortega 10 years ago when he said Ortega would bring police a list of 30 or so license plates of motorists he wanted ticketed for driving violations.

    “He’s just a very confrontational guy,” Tobias said.

    Ortega, who lives near the church, admits kicking the door but denies doing anything wrong.

    “This police officer parked his vehicle in an alleyway and blocked the entire alleyway,” Ortega said. “I kicked the door with my foot as I was riding by on my bicycle so I wouldn’t crash.

    “I was trying to keep from getting splattered all over the hood of his car.”

    Ortega said he demanded Blanche be ticketed for three violations: being parked illegally in the alley; leaving his door open and blocking the alley; and leaving his vehicle running and unattended.

    “Police are supposed to follow the laws like everyone else,” Ortega said. “He made it abundantly clear he didn’t care he was violating the law and endangering my life.”

    Ortega said the officers mistreated him after learning of his history with the city.

    “After they handcuffed me they were giving me a hard time ‘Oh, you’re the shotgun guy,’” Ortega said. “It’s harassment. They decided they were going to try and intimidate me or something.”

    Ortega said he would fight it at trial, scheduled for May 21.

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    With people who carry guns without your approval of type and color, who needs enemies posing as friends?
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

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    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    Oh christ. Please, for the love of god, if you are going to open carry don't do it dressed like that.

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    DanM wrote:
    Mike wrote:
    John Pierce is a co-founder of OpenCarry.org, a group that seeks to normalize the open carry of "properly holstered handguns" as people go about their lives.
    That's great, and Iconsider myself part of themovement, as an advocate of ALLFORMS of the right to keep and bear arms.


    Mike wrote:
    "On a fundamental level, I don't think he did anything wrong," Pierce said
    Excellent!

    Mike wrote:
    "but politically that might not be best thing to do and it's not something we're advocating for."
    Now, whyadd all that? Now you have to explain why politically it's not the best thing to do. Becausesuch a statement is asuninformative and useless asthe gun owners and concealed carriers I see every day saying, without detailed explanation,open carry isn't the best thing to do politically. Saying such things to the general public, in fact, hurts gun rightsbecause it's just another generic statement floating around out there without critical foundation.

    Mike wrote:
    Pierce said wearing camouflage also perpetuates an unhelpful stereotype.
    When making statements for publication, shouldn't we stick to points which are relevant? What has the pattern of his clothing to do with anything? Sure, anti-gun folks may make an issue of it, but what does it help to give it any more false validation than for gun people to ALSO bring it up? It's a non-issue which should not receive any commentary whatsoever from us. Those whokeep such stereotypes alivecertainly shouldn't get MORE help with us referring to it too!
    I can use the racial comparison again.

    I'm sure a great many people have heard the joke about Jesse Jackson complaining in Sears that all the Washing Machines in the Appliance Department were white. Upon receiving the complaint, a Sales Person opened all of the Machines to show him that the Agitators were all black....

    The same applies here. The author of the above quoted statements has something to gain from agitating his once-brothers.... Many will follow his lead in maligning their own kind, and then alienate, divide, etc.

    The author has become a demagogue. Can he man up and say "wow, I didn't even realize how easy it is to let that happen?" Or will he defend his indefensible statements, instead?

    We all know how Sharpton would handle it....

    It doesn't matter if I call him out. He knows that socialism will always back him up. He is keeping the stereotype alive, while claiming to be an advocate of normalization. I've called it a few times before, but this time it's just too damn blatant.

    He created a new lobby for himself, now, he's trying to turn the corner for the next step...
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    Well the headline was hilarious



    Man with AK-47-style gun in park not helpful to gun rights agenda

    Gun rights agenda eh? what a joke. The gun rights movement is a movement based on a fundemental human right, and sha'll have no specific agenda if this is not recognized. If any of you disagree with this man carrying an AK-47, Barrett 50. or whatever the hell legally I hope you don't consider yourself a gun rights "activist". We shall not police our own as it is our individual fight for a natural human right.

    Hearing things like "don't do that it makes us look bad to the public" makes me understand how we don't have as many rights as we used to. Who gives a **** what the public thinks? There the idiots who passed gun control...... Go ahead and bow down to the sheeple I don't care, cuz I always know I'm always one step ahead.



    Ben





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    eddyys wrote:
    Oh christ. Please, for the love of god, if you are going to open carry don't do it dressed like that.
    Oh Gawd. If you're going to go to KFC while carrying a water mellon under one arm, and a 5 gallon bucket of pickled pig's feet under the other; don't do it while being black...

    Of course it's socially unacceptable... That's the whole damn point.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    kwikrnuis on a mission to get OC banned in Tennessee. I hope that there are some other people in TN that can knock some sense into him, as he's doing nothing but agitating for a counter-response from the legislature to get OC banned in parks.

    kwikrnu, the purpose of a pistol is to protect yourself. By intentionally terrorizing the public you have mis-used your firearm. What you are doing is very stupid and selfish.

    You richly deserve all the criticism you have received here.

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    44Brent wrote:
    kwikrnuis on a mission to get OC banned in Tennessee. I hope that there are some other people in TN that can knock some sense into him, as he's doing nothing but agitating for a counter-response from the legislature to get OC banned in parks.
    Physical violence?

    Bad form 44B.....bad form...

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    ixtow wrote:
    eddyys wrote:
    Oh christ. Please, for the love of god, if you are going to open carry don't do it dressed like that.
    Oh Gawd. If you're going to go to KFC while carrying a water mellon under one arm, and a 5 gallon bucket of pickled pig's feet under the other; don't do it while being black...

    Of course it's socially unacceptable... That's the whole damn point.
    Good point.

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    "Blah blah blah OH NO ITS A AK47 PISTOL, WATCH ME RAGE!"



    How DAAARRRREEEE HE!



    Hilarious...
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    Mike wrote:
    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    MEM, I think all that John is saying (normal-sized) is that he carries a handgun that appears to be, to a reasonable person, a pistol and not a firearm that's questionable to the general public/LE.
    And more to the point, questionable under the law - Tennessee has onerous carry restrictions compared to most states - and long carry is illegal apparently in many places such as this park, hence the problem.

    The Tennessee legislature has been trying to move forward and liberalize laws - and localities can still ban all gun carry in local parks - its incidents encourage loclities to ban gun carry in parks.
    In Metro Nashville/Davidson County, where this incident happened, local parks are already banned. They have been since before the park carry law went into effect. There is no way that Kwik will get handgun carry banned in any park because they already banned it. Luckily, Radnor Lake is a state park. As is the Bicentennial Mall, where he plan on carrying next.

    I'll join him and support his right to legally carry.

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    HankT wrote:
    Physical violence?

    Bad form 44B.....bad form...
    Maybe HankT as a self-advertised "State Researcher" doesn't understand the laws in Tennessee. So, here's a little refresher for the "State Researcher": Tennessee used to ban carry in parks.Then they removed the ban, but allowed municipalities to opt out, and implement their own local ban.

    There is one person who presents a persona of threatening physical violence, and that is kwikrnu. People with peaceful intentions don't dreses up in war gear andcarry an AK rifle posing as a "pistol" in a public park. It takes a retard to do that. Of course, kwikrnu will continue to do this and cry about his "rights" until the local officials decide they have had enough, and then implement their local ban on carry in parks.

    One thing we will never see is an admission from HankT and kwikrnuthat kwikrnu was the direct cause of the ban, just as Don Ortega was never willing to admit that it was his retarded behavior that caused a city council to ban carry within a government building. One thing is certain: HankT and kwikrnu will cry for OpenCarry.org members to protest the very ban that kwikrnu is going to create.

    So, I say this:bad form... bad form... from kwikrnu and HankT for promoting an image of physical violence.

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    WCrawford wrote:
    In Metro Nashville/Davidson County, where this incident happened, local parks are already banned. They have been since before the park carry law went into effect. There is no way that Kwik will get handgun carry banned in any park because they already banned it. Luckily, Radnor Lake is a state park. As is the Bicentennial Mall, where he plan on carrying next.

    I'll join him and support his right to legally carry.

    Just make sure that you also wear your war gear. Just think how much faster you can get the state ban reinstated if the media can get a picture of two nuts dressed up in war gear running around on the loose.

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    44Brent wrote:
    WCrawford wrote:
    In Metro Nashville/Davidson County, where this incident happened, local parks are already banned. They have been since before the park carry law went into effect. There is no way that Kwik will get handgun carry banned in any park because they already banned it. Luckily, Radnor Lake is a state park. As is the Bicentennial Mall, where he plan on carrying next.

    I'll join him and support his right to legally carry.

    Just make sure that you also wear your war gear. Just think how much faster you can get the state ban reinstated if the media can get a picture of two nuts dressed up in war gear running around on the loose.
    Should I just wear my Army issued winter coat or do you want me to wear the entire uniform? I'll just need to remove the "US Army" and unit patches that I never bothered to do when I was discharged. I wonder if the uniform still fits... hmmm...



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    NCjones wrote:
    It's much better to be shot with a "normal looking" handgun than a scary looking one.
    ROFLOL! Now that's a postulate that deserves debate
    cheers - okboomer
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  23. #23
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    44Brent wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    44Brent wrote:
    kwikrnuis on a mission to get OC banned in Tennessee. I hope that there are some other people in TN that can knock some sense into him, as he's doing nothing but agitating for a counter-response from the legislature to get OC banned in parks.
    Physical violence?

    Bad form 44B.....bad form...
    Maybe HankT as a self-advertised "State Researcher" doesn't understand the laws in Tennessee. So, here's a little refresher for the "State Researcher": Tennessee used to ban carry in parks.Then they removed the ban, but allowed municipalities to opt out, and implement their own local ban.

    There is one person who presents a persona of threatening physical violence, and that is kwikrnu. People with peaceful intentions don't dreses up in war gear andcarry an AK rifle posing as a "pistol" in a public park. It takes a retard to do that. Of course, kwikrnu will continue to do this and cry about his "rights" until the local officials decide they have had enough, and then implement their local ban on carry in parks.

    One thing we will never see is an admission from HankT and kwikrnuthat kwikrnu was the direct cause of the ban, just as Don Ortega was never willing to admit that it was his retarded behavior that caused a city council to ban carry within a government building. One thing is certain: HankT and kwikrnu will cry for OpenCarry.org members to protest the very ban that kwikrnu is going to create.

    So, I say this:bad form... bad form... from kwikrnu and HankT for promoting an image of physical violence.
    You're changing the subject, 44B.

    You seem to be threatening physical violence against kwik by saying:

    "I hope that there are some other people in TN that can knock some sense into him..."

    Is that what you intended to do?

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    **** off Hank....it was a figure of speech. I think everyone can see that but you....

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    How quickly the brotherhood crumbles when one of the members does something "Questionable". Pathetic. You folks who are throwing this guy under the bus should be ashamed. Who cares if the guy prefers a ak pistol? I wish I had one! Oh My Gawd! Not only does he have an evil gun, he's wearing CAMO! RUN IT"S A TERRORIST!!!!!!! What a bunch of simps!
    He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent which will reach to himself. -- Thomas Paine (1737--1809), Dissertation on First Principles of Government, 1795

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