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Thread: Firearms prohibited sign on Seattle Link Light Rail?

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    Greetings, and a happy new year!

    (I apologize if this has been posted about before)

    I recently used the Seattle Link Light Rail to travel to the SeaTac airport from my home near Seattle. While I was riding I noticed a sign with a posted list of rules. I wish I had taken a photo to present here; the list bullet said roughly "Firearms and weapons prohibited".

    I can't find an explicit statement of these rules online. A "Safety and Security" page is available at: http://www.soundtransit.org/Riding-S...d-Security.xml

    How can this provision against firearms be lawful under RCW 9.41.290?

    I am going to attempt to contact carol.doering@soundtransit.org who is listed on the contacts page and report back what I learn.

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    Email sent:

    Hello,

    As I was riding on the Seattle Link Light Rail from Seattle to SeaTac
    airport, I noticed a posted sign with rules. One of the rules
    approximately stated "Firearms and weapons prohibited".

    A public entity in the state of Washington is not free to regulate
    firearms. The Revised Code of Washington section 9.41.290, State
    Preemption, states:

    "The state of Washington hereby fully occupies and preempts the entire
    field of firearms regulation within the boundaries of the state,
    including the registration, licensing, possession, purchase, sale,
    acquisition, transfer, discharge, and transportation of firearms, or
    any other element relating to firearms or parts thereof, including
    ammunition and reloader components. Cities, towns, and counties or
    other municipalities may enact only those laws and ordinances relating
    to firearms that are specifically authorized by state law, as in RCW
    9.41.300, and are consistent with this chapter. Such local ordinances
    shall have the same penalty as provided for by state law. Local laws
    and ordinances that are inconsistent with, more restrictive than, or
    exceed the requirements of state law shall not be enacted and are
    preempted and repealed, regardless of the nature of the code, charter,
    or home rule status of such city, town, county, or municipality."
    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9.41.290

    The Revised Code of Washington does not regulate firearms in this
    circumstance, beyond requiring a permit (for carry on vehicles).

    As a public agency created by the state legislature, Sound Transit
    does not have the authority to create legal restrictions beyond those
    provided in the RCW. Accordingly, the Sound Transit Link Light Rail
    prohibition on firearms appears to be in conflict with the state
    preemption clause.

    Can you elaborate on this Link Light Rail rule? How is this
    restriction in compliance with RCW 9.41.290?

    I appreciate your attention to this matter.

  3. #3
    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    Please report suspicious behavior, such as persons taking photos of transit operations and equipment or behaving nervously
    Sound's like the "terrorist" interrogations of photographers in the UK is making it's way over to the USA...

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    swatspyder wrote:
    Please report suspicious behavior, such as persons taking photos of transit operations and equipment or behaving nervously
    Sound's like the "terrorist" interrogations of photographers in the UK is making it's way over to the USA...
    What do you mean making?

    I have a friend who is a railfan, and his biggest threat is being arrested for photographing passing trains. Like, what's the harm?

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    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    grishnav wrote:
    swatspyder wrote:
    Please report suspicious behavior, such as persons taking photos of transit operations and equipment or behaving nervously
    Sound's like the "terrorist" interrogations of photographers in the UK is making it's way over to the USA...
    What do you mean making?

    I have a friend who is a railfan, and his biggest threat is being arrested for photographing passing trains. Like, what's the harm?
    I know NYC has a very big problem with accosting photographers. I guess I'm just surprised and not so surprised...

    lol and guess what, here is a photographer that was told he was loitering while he snapped a photograph at King County Sound Transit.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/viriyin...is_not_a_crime


    http://www.flickr.com/groups/photogr...s_not_a_crime/
    &
    http://carlosmiller.com/

  6. #6
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    Photography is Not a Crime is one of the few blogs of enough quality to make it to my N900's RSS feed.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Loitering is not a crime either.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    xiphoris wrote:
    Greetings, and a happy new year!

    (I apologize if this has been posted about before)

    I recently used the Seattle Link Light Rail to travel to the SeaTac airport from my home near Seattle. While I was riding I noticed a sign with a posted list of rules. I wish I had taken a photo to present here; the list bullet said roughly "Firearms and weapons prohibited".
    Please get a photo of you open carrying with the sign in the background and post here so we can see it.

  9. #9
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    Can you tell me where you spotted the sign? I would like to try to get a picture.

  10. #10
    Regular Member OrangeIsTrouble's Avatar
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    grishnav, they are on the train, inside, above the door near the front/end of the car, and on the platform along with the other information signs. Notice, that they are worded differently. One sign says "illegal weapons and firearms" and the other sign doesn't bother having "illegal" on it.


    Been harassed by the police? Yelled at by the anti-gun neighbors? Mother doesn't approve?

    Then this is the place for you! Click here to get back at them!

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    Campaign Veteran ak56's Avatar
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    Both signs are shown in this thread: Stupid Sound Transit Light Rail Sign


    No right is held more sacred, or is more carefully guarded, by the common law than the right of every individual to the possession and control of his own person, free from all restraint or interference of others, unless by clear and unquestionable authority of law. Union Pacific Rail Co. vs Botsford as quoted in Terry v Ohio.


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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    Poosharker wrote:
    grishnav, they are on the train, inside, above the door near the front/end of the car, and on the platform along with the other information signs. Notice, that they are worded differently. One sign says "illegal weapons and firearms" and the other sign doesn't bother having "illegal" on it.
    So you wont know that you breaking the sound transit law until your already on the train.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Mike wrote:
    xiphoris wrote:
    Greetings, and a happy new year!

    (I apologize if this has been posted about before)

    I recently used the Seattle Link Light Rail to travel to the SeaTac airport from my home near Seattle. While I was riding I noticed a sign with a posted list of rules. I wish I had taken a photo to present here; the list bullet said roughly "Firearms and weapons prohibited".
    Please get a photo of you open carrying with the sign in the background and post here so we can see it.
    I haven't been that far south other wise I would do just that and at the park too.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  14. #14
    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    Poosharker wrote:
    grishnav, they are on the train, inside, above the door near the front/end of the car, and on the platform along with the other information signs. Notice, that they are worded differently. One sign says "illegal weapons and firearms" and the other sign doesn't bother having "illegal" on it.
    Seems to be that as long as they say "Illegal Weapons and firearms Prohibeted" that is ok. OC or CC is legal, so we're all good.None of us carry Illegally.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

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    Regular Member OrangeIsTrouble's Avatar
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    Well now that they don't accept metro passes on light rail no mores, I ain't riding it. They freakin blew off the 126 route which I took from tukwila to south seattle and force you to take the train instead.......bastards.


    Been harassed by the police? Yelled at by the anti-gun neighbors? Mother doesn't approve?

    Then this is the place for you! Click here to get back at them!

  16. #16
    Regular Member SpyderTattoo's Avatar
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    Poosharker wrote:
    So you wont know that you breaking the sound transit law until your already on the train.
    It's not a law,it's a rule they put up there for the uneducated masses. They can't really enforce it.
    Certified Glock Armorer

    "A government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any particular individual citizen..." -- Warren v. District of Columbia, 444 A.2d 1 (D.C. App.181)

    A 1911 that works properly is as rare as a Glock that doesn't.

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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    SpyderTattoo wrote:
    Poosharker wrote:
    So you wont know that you breaking the sound transit law until your already on the train.
    It's not a law,it's a rule they put up there for the uneducated masses. They can't really enforce it.
    I know its just policy, that why I said "sound transit law", companies write policies like they are their own little laws, with their own consequences if you break them.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

  18. #18
    Regular Member OrangeIsTrouble's Avatar
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    I apologize, the word is actually "unlawful", I said "illegal" in an earlier post, but same thing!

    Fresh pictures from today!

    This is from the PLATFORM



    Been harassed by the police? Yelled at by the anti-gun neighbors? Mother doesn't approve?

    Then this is the place for you! Click here to get back at them!

  19. #19
    Regular Member OrangeIsTrouble's Avatar
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    And this is ON THE RAIL CAR


    Been harassed by the police? Yelled at by the anti-gun neighbors? Mother doesn't approve?

    Then this is the place for you! Click here to get back at them!

  20. #20
    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    how far apart are the signs from each other? Why would they have 2 different signs. usually same sign everywhere.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

  21. #21
    Regular Member OrangeIsTrouble's Avatar
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    One is on the platform and one is on the light rail car... one is stationary one is not.


    Been harassed by the police? Yelled at by the anti-gun neighbors? Mother doesn't approve?

    Then this is the place for you! Click here to get back at them!

  22. #22
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    I would assume that "unlawful firearms" would be stolen pistols and firearms in the possession of criminals. You are lawfully carrying a firearm, so it shouldn't be a problem. ;-)

  23. #23
    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    Daath 474 wrote:
    I would assume that "unlawful firearms" would be stolen pistols and firearms in the possession of criminals. You are lawfully carrying a firearm, so it shouldn't be a problem. ;-)
    Only problem is the other sign just says "No Firearms Allowed".
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

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    I'm not a lawyer or nothin, and I would probably contact one to make sure your in the clear but neither of those RCW's have anything pertaining to a firearm.

    "If its not prohibited by statute ITS LEGAL!"- free Washington gun rights pamphlet

    pamphlet
    opencarry.mywowbb.com/attachment.php?id=2014

    RCW 9A.36.031
    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9A.36.031

    RCW 9.91.025
    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9.91.025

    :P

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    Ugh. All explained in the FAQ's. 9.91.025 "Unlawful Bus Conduct" specifically protects the lawful transport of guns or ammo on transit vehicles or on transit property. That means if you are legally carrying, they can't stop you. Of course a CPL is required for loaded carry of a handgun on a vehicle, open or concealed.

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