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Thread: Armed and civilized: Protesters rally against Obama policies

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    http://www.lcsun-news.com/las_cruces-news/ci_14113973




    ALAMOGORDO - A Tea Party protest Saturday that many people feared would morph into a Wild West shootout turned out to be a problem-free event.
    About 350 people from throughout New Mexico, mostly Republican supporters and a handful of self-proclaimed Democrats, crowded the intersection of 10th Street and White Sands Boulevard - the busiest intersection in Alamogordo - to protest against the Obama administration and its policies.
    There were plenty of handguns and rifles on display, but no violence and no reports of arrests.
    The event was staged by the Otero Tea Party Patriots and the newly formed Second Amendment Task Force. Though the main focus of Tea Party supporters was to protest the administration, the Alamogordo 2ATF conducted a simultaneous open-carry event.
    "They were a bit loud, but they were polite," said Don Omey, coordinator of the Otero Tea Party Patriots, of Alamogordo 2ATF members. "They didn't get on anyone's case. I was proud of the way they conducted themselves - and I was glad to have the turnout. That's what we need to turn some minds around."
    Protesters from all parts of the state either carried holstered guns or rifles slung over their shoulder at the event.
    "I don't like what the Democrats are doing to our country," said Jim Kizer of Alamogordo, who carried a .444 Marlin and a holstered .41 Smith & Wesson Magnum. "I'm a Korean vet and I grew up in Alaska during World War II. I've fought Communists all my life, and now our government is being taken over by them. That's why I'm here."

    Kizer said his weapons were not loaded.
    "I'm not trying to start a war," he said. "I just want to make a point."
    Denise Lang was positioned in front of Founders Park, located diagonally from the Alamogordo Airborne Memorial. Lang, a Democrat, said the gun display was not necessary.
    "I see it as being juvenile and adolescent," she said. "I'm very much a pro-gun rights person. I come from a military family. My late husband was a gunsmith, but I think gun use is okay in an appropriate time and place. Wearing guns to a protest, to me, is extremely juvenile."
    Lang said she also wanted to support the health-care reform bill that passed the U.S. Senate on Christmas Eve.
    "When I worked at the cancer treatment center in Alamogordo, I saw private health care turn down treatment for people who had pre-existing conditions," she said. "I think the health-care industry is providing us with bad health care."
    Alamogordo Department of Public Safety and New Mexico State Police saturated the protest area with officers.
    Police vehicles passed through the intersection at no less than five-minute intervals during the two-hour event.
    Orie Adcock and his wife, Juli, both of Roswell, came with identical scoped AR-15s slung over their shoulder.
    "I heard about it through the grapevine and decided to come over to see what it's all about," Orie Adcock said. "We also wanted to express our First Amendment rights, as well as our Second Amendment rights."
    Las Crucen Jerry Claunch said he made the one-hour trip to Alamogordo with about 10 other Do a Ana County tea partiers to show support for Otero County's contingency, as well as to express his right to bear arms in public.
    "I'm here to help keep our country from being socialized by 'Zero-bama,'" he said. "He's running us into the ground; he's ruining our economy. I see what's going on. My flag is tattered and I don't like it."
    Tony Betterton of Alamogordo had a completely different take. Obama and the Democrats, he said, inherited a mess left behind by Republicans.
    "Fox News has turned their mind to mush," he said, pointing to the protesters. "I understand their anger, but maybe they ought to be taking their anger out on the insurance companies. How come they're not out in front of the lobbyists' offices in Washington? How come they're not out in front of major health-care industries? Those people, they've become lackeys - and they don't even know it.
    "You know, I'm a disabled vet," he added. "Not all vets are right-wing nuts."

    Michael Johnson is managing editor of the Alamogordo Daily News, a member of the Texas-New Mexico Newspapers Partnership, and can be reached at mjohnson@alamogordonews.com.
    Wow, who'd a thunk it, an actually Rifle OC event that went perfectly fine, however, I don't plan on carrying unloaded.

    Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

    Clyde

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    Why do you people insist on politicizing a normal activity?

    Have you learned nothing from the Panthers and the Mulford Act?

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    Why do you people insist on politicizing a normal activity?

    Have you learned nothing from the Panthers and the Mulford Act?
    Yeah, we've learned something.

    Next time they try to smack us down, we have to fight back and not just lay down and take it. :X

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    You really need to read up on the Black Panther, why they existed in the first place.

    http://www.pbs.org/hueypnewton/actio...itolmarch.html

    The Mulford act was already going to be passed, and Reagan signed it, they were there protestingpassingof the bill. Shame we didn't do something similar when he signed the MG ban bill in '86 huh, or when Ahnnnuuuld signed AB962 recently?

    http://www.keepandbeararms.com/NewsA...sp?cmd=SHOWTOP

    Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

    Clyde

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    I am constantly amazed at the folks (sheep) who are scared by the actions of RESPONSIBLE citizens who are simply pointing out the faults in our government while utilizing their natural right to self defense and free speech.

    I have not visited my sisters house in over a year because a family member there took offense at my OC and TOLD me (not asked) to secure the weapon in my car or lock it in a closet because his small children might pull my gun! I told him that if I thought for a second a 3 yr old could pull my .45 out of a retention holster and hold it up long enough to shoot the family dog, I would not have even shown up. This coming from a family of hunters, so this goes towards not being trusted to carry responsibly, not just the presence of the weapon..

    Talk about annoying..

    I think I need some coffee...

    Rev. Jim

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    The Panthers were (and still are) a bunch of crooks and communists dressed up as a political rights organization. Anyone who thinks we should emulate them needs to think twice.

    http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/g...asp?grpid=7375

    They weren't smart very smart either: when the legislature was debating the Mulford Act, they showed up with arms and threatened the members of government, thus proving Mulford correct and guaranteeing the act's passage.

    Now, open carry is great. Political rallies are great. However, the two shouldn't be mixed. You expressive individualist types are ruining OC in the eyes of non-gun owners by associating it with Tea Partiers and guys running around with BDUs and AK pattern pistols slung across their backs.

    I did something for the first time in my life yesterday. I sent letters to my representatives asking for a gun control law to specifically ban open carry at political events and the open carry of guns not in belt holsters. I'm sick of you guys trying to politicize a normal activity and deliberately scare people who would otherwise be sympathetic (or neutral) to open carry.

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    The Panthers were (and still are) a bunch of crooks and communists dressed up as a political rights organization. Anyone who thinks we should emulate them needs to think twice.

    http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/g...asp?grpid=7375

    They weren't smart very smart either: when the legislature was debating the Mulford Act, they showed up with arms and threatened the members of government, thus proving Mulford correct and guaranteeing the act's passage.

    Now, open carry is great. Political rallies are great. However, the two shouldn't be mixed. You expressive individualist types are ruining OC in the eyes of non-gun owners by associating it with Tea Partiers and guys running around with BDUs and AK pattern pistols slung across their backs.

    I did something for the first time in my life yesterday. I sent letters to my representatives asking for a gun control law to specifically ban open carry at political events and the open carry of guns not in belt holsters. I'm sick of you guys trying to politicize a normal activity and deliberately scare people who would otherwise be sympathetic (or neutral) to open carry.
    So I'm assuming you're a Democrat and voted for Obama right? Maybe we should just call you Zumbo instead?

    Clyde

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    JBURGII wrote:
    I am constantly amazed at the folks (sheep) who are scared by the actions of RESPONSIBLE citizens who are simply pointing out the faults in our government while utilizing their natural right to self defense and free speech.

    I have not visited my sisters house in over a year because a family member there took offense at my OC and TOLD me (not asked) to secure the weapon in my car or lock it in a closet because his small children might pull my gun! I told him that if I thought for a second a 3 yr old could pull my .45 out of a retention holster and hold it up long enough to shoot the family dog, I would not have even shown up. This coming from a family of hunters, so this goes towards not being trusted to carry responsibly, not just the presence of the weapon..

    Talk about annoying..

    I think I need some coffee...

    Rev. Jim
    Although I couldn't care less about open carry of a rifle, and actually find it kind of silly, it's because of reactions like this that I support all kinds of open carry. One thing I can tell you from being a former resident of the Empire State is that if people are not shown the legal carry of firearms, they will forget it actually exist, and they will start believing the bull biscuits spewed by the media. Mainly the lie that only criminals carry guns.
    I have spoken with numerous old timers in New York who have told me the perception, as well as the laws have progressively gotten worse over time. God forbid a neighbor sees you bring a rifle from your car into your house. You will probably have the police at your place within the hour.

    Before I veer too far off topic, I'll finish off by just saying this. Open carry is legal. Let us not allow the government to intrude into our rights more so than it already does.

    Keep carrying and be safe
    -Steve
    If ever you find yourself in a situation where you can't be safe, be violent!

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    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    So I'm assuming you're a Democrat and voted for Obama right?

    Clyde
    Nope. I supported Ron Paul during the election. I (reluctantly) voted for McCain to try and prevent the international embarassment that is in the White House right now. I generally support the Tea Parties and even attended one here in Tucson. Read my posts about illegal immigration in the other thread you started. I'm no pinko.

    However, almost all of my coworkers, acquaintances, and family are on the left. They were pretty much neutral on guns until the nuts started popping out of the woodwork showing up with ARs/AKs at political protests. It's a gigantic turnoff to a lot of people and that article you posted shows it.

    Part of OCDO's mission is to renormalize open carry and to educate the masses -- to show that gun owners are normal people who just happen to be armed. You (and people like you) are effectively working for the other side.

    What Clayton Cramer said on the subject is worth repeating here:

    "f you want to win political battles, you don’t offend unnecessarily. If you want to express yourself, and don’t mind losing, then go ahead, open carry even when you don’t need to; it’s more important to express yourself than to win political struggles."

    If gun owners can't regulate themeselves, then the state will have to do it for them. And I'd rather see one type of open carry banned than open carry banned entirely.

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    So I'm assuming you're a Democrat and voted for Obama right?

    Clyde
    Nope. I supported Ron Paul during the election. I (reluctantly) voted for McCain to try and prevent the international embarassment that is in the White House right now. I generally support the Tea Parties and even attended one here in Tucson. Read my posts about illegal immigration in the other thread you started. I'm no pinko.

    However, almost all of my coworkers, acquaintances, and family are on the left. They were pretty much neutral on guns until the nuts started popping out of the woodwork showing up with ARs/AKs at political protests. It's a gigantic turnoff to a lot of people and that article you posted shows it.

    Part of OCDO's mission is to renormalize open carry and to educate the masses -- to show that gun owners are normal people who just happen to be armed. You (and people like you) are effectively working for the other side.

    What Clayton Cramer said on the subject is worth repeating here:

    "f you want to win political battles, you don’t offend unnecessarily. If you want to express yourself, and don’t mind losing, then go ahead, open carry even when you don’t need to; it’s more important to express yourself than to win political struggles."

    If gun owners can't regulate themeselves, then the state will have to do it for them. And I'd rather see one type of open carry banned than open carry banned entirely.
    Cutting off your nose to spite your face yes?

    Did you read the part in the 2nd Amendment where it said, "shall not be infringed", or are you going off the same interpretation as Sotomayor?

    Tuscon is a "lefty" city, or haven't you figured that out yet, it's whyIncompetano/NapolaReno gotelected asgovernor and set us back a few years fiscally andConstitutionally. You've already been brainwashed.

    Clyde

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    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    Cutting off your nose to spite your face yes?

    Did you read the part in the 2nd Amendment where it said, "shall not be infringed", or are you going off the same interpretation as Sotomayor?

    Tuscon is a "lefty" city, or haven't you figured that out yet, it's whyIncompetano/NapolaReno gotelected asgovernor and set us back a few years fiscally andConstitutionally. You've already been brainwashed."

    Clyde
    Brainwashed? Hardly. But I can see the writing on the wall.

    What is happening to Tucson (and parts of the Valley) is the destiny of the rest of the state.

    Arizona will flip to blue in the future, it's inevitable given how many Californians and rust belters are moving here (along with the illegal aliens, but that's another post.) Most of them are not moving here because of the lax gun laws, so they're taking their personal opinions on guns with them here.

    And if they see guys in BDUs and AK/ARs walking around, the first thing they are going to think is "There oughta be a law!" And instead of deliberately targeting long guns, they'll go after all guns. Goodbye open carry, maybe CC as well.

    You can quote "shall not be infringed" until you're blue in the face, but you seem to love the idea of scaring people and intimidating them more than anything else. The only other places in the world where people carry around long guns while wearing boots and camo near political protests are dictatorships. I know that is what we are trying to prevent, but the visual image is in people's minds nonetheless. People don't like it.

    Heller has already established that the government can apply 'reasonable restrictions' to firearms short of a total ban. McDonald v. Chicago will probably say the same thing. Blame Scalia if you want for the interpretation, but that's the reality of the situation.

    The question is "what is reasonable?" To some people, California's regulations are perfectly reasonable. To others, they are an infringement. People's opinions on the matter are formed by what they hear from the media. And most of what they hear isn't good. So we have to be on our best behavior.

    Gun control law isn't produced in a vacuum, but comes as a result of negative press. The NFA, GCA, Brady Bill, etc. are no exceptions.

    The Mulford Act was specifically to prevent the Panthers from running around with guns.

    Cramer, again:

    "The bill under consideration–to ban open carry of loaded firearms in cities–was at that point controversial, and not certain of passage. But the Black Panthers decided to exercise their 2nd amendment rights–and the bill was passed immediately, and with an “urgency provision” so that it took effect immediately. Please: consider the possibility that the Black Panthers are not exactly the best model of how to win friends and influence people."

    In other words, if we don't regulate our own behavior, then the state will do it for us.

    If that means we have to have a law against some forms of OC to keep all our other rights, so be it. But if people like you would just calm down and think about what damage you are doing, that will not be necessary.

    What say you, 'professor'?

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    You're projecting a stereotype of the people you "think" will attend with rifles. You've already made up your mind, and I wonder if this isn't the same argument they're having on Calguns to tell people to quit UOC in CA. Same argument, different place.

    Tuscon has been infected with the CA, OR, MA, IL, MD, DC liberal bug, and maybe, just maybe, seeing people running around with rifles will scare them enough to not come here. Wow, that's a thought.

    Clyde



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    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    You're projecting a stereotype of the people you "think" will attend with rifles. You've already made up your mind, and I wonder if this isn't the same argument they're having on Calguns to tell people to quit UOC in CA. Same argument, different place.

    Tuscon has been infected with the CA, OR, MA, IL, MD, DC liberal bug, and maybe, just maybe, seeing people running around with rifles will scare them enough to not come here. Wow, that's a thought.

    Clyde

    I don't have to project. I just have to read the papers. Or OCDO.

    As far as I know, the people at CalGuns are waiting for 2A incorporation to UOC handguns again in their day to day lives. I want people to stop carrying long guns, especially at political protests. Different argument entirely.

    Yes, I know. Tucson is liberal. So what? It's my hometown and many people from outside the state have made it their place to live as well -- it's warm and it's cheaper than the Valley. After buying a house, finding a job, putting the kids in school -- people are not likely to uproot themselves simply because there are people with rifles running around. The first thing they would want to do change the law.

    Given the choice between a complete ban on OC, or a ban on political/long gun carry, I know what I will choose. And we will have to choose when the state flips from R to D.

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    The Panthers were (and still are) a bunch of crooks and communists dressed up as a political rights organization. Anyone who thinks we should emulate them needs to think twice.

    http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/g...asp?grpid=7375

    They weren't smart very smart either: when the legislature was debating the Mulford Act, they showed up with arms and threatened the members of government, thus proving Mulford correct and guaranteeing the act's passage.

    Now, open carry is great. Political rallies are great. However, the two shouldn't be mixed. You expressive individualist types are ruining OC in the eyes of non-gun owners by associating it with Tea Partiers and guys running around with BDUs and AK pattern pistols slung across their backs.

    I did something for the first time in my life yesterday. I sent letters to my representatives asking for a gun control law to specifically ban open carry at political events and the open carry of guns not in belt holsters. I'm sick of you guys trying to politicize a normal activity and deliberately scare people who would otherwise be sympathetic (or neutral) to open carry.

    How does OC of holstered sidearms threaten members of government? We don't take them out and wave them around in threatening manner.

    Why should any of us cease doing something that we do everyday of our lives, just because we attend a political function/ralley? Do we not have the rght to defend ourselves incase someone that doesn't agree with our views instigates violance against us? Didn't you hear about the union thugs that violantly attacked people that opposed Obama's agenda? Such activities didn't occur where OC was present.

    If elected officials feel threatened by the presence of OC or firearms in general, it's probably due to them knowing that they are not living up to their oath to defend the Constitution and are shafting "we the people", and knowing that we know it.

    I've had the oppertunity to shake hands and speekwith our US Rep Marsha Blackburn at a townhall meeting while OCing. She didn't seem threatened at all by my 9mm hanging on my hip. And there wasn't a LEO or other securityanywhere to be seen, that could have protected her if I had hadill intent towards her.

    It seems to me that the only people that are concerned with armed citizens at political functions are Liberal Democrats. Gee, I wonder why?

    Edited to add

    I agree, that we don't want to replicate what the Black Panthers did. I've heard that they didn't have their long guns "slug" when they protested. Having rifles "in hand" does pose a threatening gesture. The Panthers had had a long standing reputation for being militants for the civil rights movement.


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    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    You're projecting a stereotype of the people you "think" will attend with rifles. You've already made up your mind, and I wonder if this isn't the same argument they're having on Calguns to tell people to quit UOC in CA. Same argument, different place.

    Tuscon has been infected with the CA, OR, MA, IL, MD, DC liberal bug, and maybe, just maybe, seeing people running around with rifles will scare them enough to not come here. Wow, that's a thought.

    Clyde

    Boy that would be so so nice if they went back. A while back I was OCing in Sedona. I always OC when in Sedona. One of the F in nuts that works one of the shops said I should conceal because OC might scare the tourist. I told him F the tourist and you to. He was from Wi. I told him any s**t and when he is working his tourist boot Ill stand outside it with the AK lol I'm sick of people thinking they can tell you were you can carry and what you can carry. I carry less what the courts says. I know what the Constitution says.

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    The Panthers were (and still are) a bunch of crooks and communists dressed up as a political rights organization. Anyone who thinks we should emulate them needs to think twice.

    http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/g...asp?grpid=7375

    They weren't smart very smart either: when the legislature was debating the Mulford Act, they showed up with arms and threatened the members of government, thus proving Mulford correct and guaranteeing the act's passage.

    Now, open carry is great. Political rallies are great. However, the two shouldn't be mixed. You expressive individualist types are ruining OC in the eyes of non-gun owners by associating it with Tea Partiers and guys running around with BDUs and AK pattern pistols slung across their backs.

    I did something for the first time in my life yesterday. I sent letters to my representatives asking for a gun control law to specifically ban open carry at political events and the open carry of guns not in belt holsters. I'm sick of you guys trying to politicize a normal activity and deliberately scare people who would otherwise be sympathetic (or neutral) to open carry.
    I have a very hard time believing your a gun owner. One thing I know for sure you sure don't support the 2nd amendment. Must be a Ca. transplant. and we worry about the Southern Border lol

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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    How does OC of holstered sidearms threaten members of government? We don't take them out and wave them around in threatening manner.

    Why should any of us cease doing something that we do everyday of our lives, just because we attend a political function/ralley? Do we not have the rght to defend ourselves incase someone that doesn't agree with our views instigates violance against us? Didn't you hear about the union thugs that violantly attacked people that opposed Obama's agenda? Such activities didn't occur where OC was present.

    If elected officials feel threatened by the presence of OC or firearms in general, it's probably due to them knowing that they are not living up to their oath to defend the Constitution and are shafting "we the people", and knowing that we know it.

    I've had the oppertunity to shake hands and speekwith our US Rep Marsha Blackburn at a townhall meeting while OCing. She didn't seem threatened at all by my 9mm hanging on my hip. And there wasn't a LEO or other securityanywhere to be seen, that could have protected her if I had hadill intent towards her.

    It seems to me that the only people that are concerned with armed citizens at political functions are Liberal Democrats. Gee, I wonder why?
    People have been carrying long guns at the protests. That's 90% of my issue with open carry to political events. Slinging a rifle over one's shoulder like some kind of Third World guerilla, or (worse) showing up in camo like a Third World conscript. If it was just OC'd handguns I'd have less of a problem.

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    lostone1413 wrote:
    I have a very hard time believing your a gun owner. One thing I know for sure you sure don't support the 2nd amendment. Must be a Ca. transplant. and we worry about the Southern Border lol
    I was born at St. Joseph's Hospital in Tucson. I've not spent more than two weeks outside of the county in my short life.

    And I'm trying to prevent the Californians from ruining open carry here. Kenpoprofessor is a Californian.

    Quote from his first post:

    "Thank Ahura Mazda I left that wacky CA."

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    lostone1413 wrote:
    I have a very hard time believing your a gun owner. One thing I know for sure you sure don't support the 2nd amendment. Must be a Ca. transplant. and we worry about the Southern Border lol
    I was born at St. Joseph's Hospital in Tucson.
    Did one of the nurses drop you on your head there too?

    So, if a rifle is in a scabbard slung across someones back, you would be fine with that, but if it is carried with just a sling you have a problem?

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    lostone1413 wrote:
    I have a very hard time believing your a gun owner. One thing I know for sure you sure don't support the 2nd amendment. Must be a Ca. transplant. and we worry about the Southern Border lol
    I was born at St. Joseph's Hospital in Tucson. I've not spent more than two weeks outside of the county in my short life.

    And I'm trying to prevent the Californians from ruining open carry here. Kenpoprofessor is a Californian.

    Quote from his first post:

    "Thank Ahura Mazda I left that wacky CA."

    NO, I'M NOT A CALIFORNICATOR, I was put there via the USAF, really didn't have much of a choice after I turned down the first set of orders to Las Vegas, and boy did that choice bite me in the A$$. I'm originally from Texas, and damn proud of that fact even though I didn't have a choice about that either.

    You say your short life, so I'm assuming you're just barely old enough to vote yet you're telling us how we should carry our guns, and then attempt to have legislators restrict our rights even more. You're either Bi Polar or just plain nutz. I've travelled the world and you've never the left the damn county. Seriously WTF?

    ETA, yep, just checked your profile and you're not even old enough to drink yet. And it also says you're a student, that doesn't surprise me either, which iswhy I said you're brainwashed already.

    Clyde


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    Nutczak wrot
    Did one of the nurses drop you on your head there too?

    So, if a rifle is in a scabbard slung across someones back, you would be fine with that, but if it is carried with just a sling you have a problem?
    I'll ignore the first comment you made, nutsack.

    A rifle in a case or scabbard does follow the letter of the law here in Arizona.

    However, carrying long guns to political events, or anywhere really -- isn't going to win friends among non-gun owners.

    Showing up with that much firepower at a political event makes gun owners look like they are looking for a fight, because handguns are primarily defensive weapons, rifles are offensive weapons. Many people are used to seeing long gun racks in vehicles, but a long gun out in the open usually means that a firefight is about to occur. It hasn't yet, but the idea is still there.

    It's bad press. Gun owners are trying to dispel the sterotype as our group as a bunch 'militia' types but bringing out that kind of hardware only proves it. And scaring people unnecessarily will only lead to legislation to limit our rights even more than they already are.

    Again: if we don't regulate our own behavior, someone else will do it for us.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    Tucson, Arizona, USA
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    293

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    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    NO, I'M NOT A CALIFORNICATOR, I was put there via the USAF, really didn't have much of a choice after I turned down the first set of orders to Las Vegas, and boy did that choice bite me in the A$$. I'm originally from Texas, and damn proud of that fact even though I didn't have a choice about that either.

    You say your short life, so I'm assuming you're just barely old enough to vote yet you're telling us how we should carry our guns, and then attempt to have legislators restrict our rights even more. You're either Bi Polar or just plain nutz. I've travelled the world and you've never the left the damn county. Seriously WTF

    Clyde
    How old I am, what I do, or where I've been is not relevant. I'm telling you what the political reality of the situation is in Arizona, from someone who is seeing the demographic changes first-hand. Either we regulate ourselves, or other people will decide to do it for us. If you feel that you must be special and unique and have the center of attention by carrying the biggest gun you can to scare people, fine. Just don't blame anyone else when the leftists are voted in and we all suffer for your mistakes.

  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Phoenix AZ, ,
    Posts
    163

    Post imported post

    like_the_roman wrote:
    kenpoprofessor wrote:
    NO, I'M NOT A CALIFORNICATOR, I was put there via the USAF, really didn't have much of a choice after I turned down the first set of orders to Las Vegas, and boy did that choice bite me in the A$$. I'm originally from Texas, and damn proud of that fact even though I didn't have a choice about that either.

    You say your short life, so I'm assuming you're just barely old enough to vote yet you're telling us how we should carry our guns, and then attempt to have legislators restrict our rights even more. You're either Bi Polar or just plain nutz. I've travelled the world and you've never the left the damn county. Seriously WTF?

    Clyde
    How old I am or where I've been is not relevant. I'm telling you what the political reality of the situation is in Arizona, from someone who is seeing the demographic changes first-hand. Either we regulate ourselves, or other people will decide to do it for us. If you feel that you must be special and unique and have the center of attention by carrying the biggest gun you can to scare people, go for it. Just don't blame anyone when the Ds are voted in and we all suffer for it.
    You're old enough to vote and register for the draft, but that certainly doesn't give you the life experience you're trying to portray. You're a young little whippersnapper trying to excel in the adult world and you're failing. You're barely out of diapers trying to tell people how they should exercise their rights when you've only had them for 2 friggin' years.

    Clyde

  24. #24
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    Tucson, Arizona, USA
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    kenpoprofessor wrote:

    You're old enough to vote and register for the draft, but that certainly doesn't give you the life experience you're trying to portray. You're a young little whippersnapper trying to excel in the adult world and you're failing. You're barely out of diapers trying to tell people how they should exercise their rights when you've only had them for 2 friggin' years.

    Clyde
    My life experience is not relevant. The data is (it's a shame you belittle being educated, because that's what allows people to research facts and use rational thought to win arguments instead of calling names). Anyway:

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE...p;pageId=56876

    The places that are the most reliably Democratic are losing residents to the sand states and deep south, which were reliably Republican. That means that the demographics are going to slowly shift in their favor, and those shifts have political consequences. Arizona will flip within your (and especially my) lifetime: those people who are economic refugees aren't going to change their political opinions just because they moved.

    Either regulate your own behavior, or they will decide to do it for you. You have only yourself to blame if it happens.

  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Phoenix AZ, ,
    Posts
    163

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    like_the_roman wrote:
    kenpoprofessor wrote:

    You're old enough to vote and register for the draft, but that certainly doesn't give you the life experience you're trying to portray. You're a young little whippersnapper trying to excel in the adult world and you're failing. You're barely out of diapers trying to tell people how they should exercise their rights when you've only had them for 2 friggin' years.

    Clyde
    My life experience is not relevant. The data is (it's a shame you belittle being educated, because that's what allows people to research facts and use rational thought to win arguments instead of calling names). Anyway:

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE...p;pageId=56876

    The places that are the most reliably Democratic are losing residents to the sand states and deep south, which were reliably Republican. That means that the demographics are going to slowly shift in their favor, and those shifts have political consequences. Arizona will flip within your (and especially my) lifetime: those people who are economic refugees aren't going to change their political opinions just because they moved.

    Either regulate your own behavior, or they will decide to do it for you. You have only yourself to blame if it happens.
    You see, you're happy with "regulation" because you have never lived at a time when it wasn't. You're not even capable of seeing things the same way when you haven't lived through the times. If you've never been to the beach, how are you going to tell me about it other than what you've heard, read, or seen? You can't describe the smell, sounds, tastes, or whether the water is cold or warm.

    I never once belittled "education", and you're the only one who brought it up. Guess you should take some reading comprehension classes while you're going to school, it might help you interpret the actual meaning of someone's writing beause clearly, you're not "getting it".

    Clyde

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