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Interesting story!
- Thread starter wolfeinstein
- Start date
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
One interesting aspect of this story is that these 150 full-body scanners that the TSA is rushing to install in airports all over the USA were ordered LAST YEAR from a company called Rapiscan, under Michael Chertoff, the former Director of the TSA. These scanners are NOT being put in place as a reaction to the "Underwear Bomber"--they have been planned on since OCTOBER 2009.
Oh, and the images on the screen that the TSA people look at DO NOT have little black bars over the naughty bits like they show on TV. At the end of this post is an image from an official press release on an industry website. Look cloesly, and then ask yourself, do you want some TSA JBT oogling your wife or teen-age (or younger!) daughter as they pass through these machines?
Chertoff now is a PAID REPRESENTATIVE for Rapiscan, and has been hitting the media circuit since the "Christmas Day Bombing Incident", pushing the implementation of Full Body Scanners at ALL airports.
Can you say "conflict of interest" anyone?
And these scanners are capable of such detailed resolution, that under English law, the images they would produce and store of minors are considered to be "child pornography" under British law. So what are the Brits doing? They are changing their Child Porn laws to give airport security companies special exemption...
Sick...
One interesting aspect of this story is that these 150 full-body scanners that the TSA is rushing to install in airports all over the USA were ordered LAST YEAR from a company called Rapiscan, under Michael Chertoff, the former Director of the TSA. These scanners are NOT being put in place as a reaction to the "Underwear Bomber"--they have been planned on since OCTOBER 2009.
Oh, and the images on the screen that the TSA people look at DO NOT have little black bars over the naughty bits like they show on TV. At the end of this post is an image from an official press release on an industry website. Look cloesly, and then ask yourself, do you want some TSA JBT oogling your wife or teen-age (or younger!) daughter as they pass through these machines?
Chertoff now is a PAID REPRESENTATIVE for Rapiscan, and has been hitting the media circuit since the "Christmas Day Bombing Incident", pushing the implementation of Full Body Scanners at ALL airports.
Can you say "conflict of interest" anyone?
And these scanners are capable of such detailed resolution, that under English law, the images they would produce and store of minors are considered to be "child pornography" under British law. So what are the Brits doing? They are changing their Child Porn laws to give airport security companies special exemption...
Sick...
Lawmaker
Regular Member
imported post
Wow the images seen on TV seemed to be limited by a bra. Man I guess that you are right. Soon after these roll out we are going to see pictures of celebs from the scanners coming out from the paparazzi.
Wow the images seen on TV seemed to be limited by a bra. Man I guess that you are right. Soon after these roll out we are going to see pictures of celebs from the scanners coming out from the paparazzi.
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
When they are instructed on the use and callibration of these scanners, one of the "benchmarks" they use for biomentric identification of males is the shape, side, and curvature of the penis.
We are talking about an image that has the same detail as an MRI here folks, only it only displays the surface of the skin. It's higher-resolution than 1080p high-def television...
Do you want some TSA rent-a-cop looking at your little children's "private parts"?
Do you still want to take the kids to Disneyworld for vacation?
Consider Amtrack...
We need to remember our history here folks. Any time a government REQUIRES it's citizens to submit to invasive searches--including fully-nude examination (which is what this is!) it has NOTHING to do with security and safety. This is merely another method of dehumanization, degradation, and creating a submissive mentality among the public.
And we ALSO need to remember history as to where this sort of treatment of law-abiding citizens ultimately leads, historically. In the last 100 years, EVERY time a government REQUIRED large groups of people to strip at the request of a man in a uniform, it's ALWAYS when they are marching people to the edge of a mass grave...
When they are instructed on the use and callibration of these scanners, one of the "benchmarks" they use for biomentric identification of males is the shape, side, and curvature of the penis.
We are talking about an image that has the same detail as an MRI here folks, only it only displays the surface of the skin. It's higher-resolution than 1080p high-def television...
Do you want some TSA rent-a-cop looking at your little children's "private parts"?
Do you still want to take the kids to Disneyworld for vacation?
Consider Amtrack...
We need to remember our history here folks. Any time a government REQUIRES it's citizens to submit to invasive searches--including fully-nude examination (which is what this is!) it has NOTHING to do with security and safety. This is merely another method of dehumanization, degradation, and creating a submissive mentality among the public.
And we ALSO need to remember history as to where this sort of treatment of law-abiding citizens ultimately leads, historically. In the last 100 years, EVERY time a government REQUIRED large groups of people to strip at the request of a man in a uniform, it's ALWAYS when they are marching people to the edge of a mass grave...
zigziggityzoo
Campaign Veteran
imported post
Lawmaker wrote:
The images above are fake.
The scanners will not have things like hair show up on them, period. Hair disappears just like cloth does (ie: one's clothing).
The person scanned would appear to be bald and hairless everywhere. The image also does not contain ANY color data whatsoever. The image would appear similar to an X-Ray - Monochrome inverted.
The images above are stylized fakes, poorly done at that. Would take a skilled photoshopper about 5 minutes to make.
Lawmaker wrote:
The images above are fake.
The scanners will not have things like hair show up on them, period. Hair disappears just like cloth does (ie: one's clothing).
The person scanned would appear to be bald and hairless everywhere. The image also does not contain ANY color data whatsoever. The image would appear similar to an X-Ray - Monochrome inverted.
The images above are stylized fakes, poorly done at that. Would take a skilled photoshopper about 5 minutes to make.
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
So, putting a picture in reverse, and taking all the body hair off it somehow makes it less invasive?
Explain THAT rationale...
So, putting a picture in reverse, and taking all the body hair off it somehow makes it less invasive?
Explain THAT rationale...
Lawmaker
Regular Member
imported post
Ok I am going to go Hollywood on everyone. Do you remember Total Recall? Do you remember the part where Arnold is going through the airport and has to walk through a corridor where it is like an x-ray and shows only bones and metal objects? I would hope for something like that. Quick, easy and non invasive.
Ok I am going to go Hollywood on everyone. Do you remember Total Recall? Do you remember the part where Arnold is going through the airport and has to walk through a corridor where it is like an x-ray and shows only bones and metal objects? I would hope for something like that. Quick, easy and non invasive.
tekshogun
Founder's Club Member
imported post
Lawmaker wrote:
I mentioned having that in one of the threads in the general or news forum after the Christmas Day attempted terrorist attack. The skeleton could simply be a mock representation of the human form and the machine must be able to look for explosives and weapons. For airports, I can't exactly call this a bad thing as they are such easy targets, even today. I flew out of Miami several months ago and saw some very normal people being randomly picked to go into the X-Ray machines but I never was.
I won't call it scary, I look at it as an accepted risk, I'm more likely to die a horribly slow death on a highway before I do in a plane. But if there was absolute NO security, I'd take fewer risks flying on planes. To hell with that.
Lawmaker wrote:
I mentioned having that in one of the threads in the general or news forum after the Christmas Day attempted terrorist attack. The skeleton could simply be a mock representation of the human form and the machine must be able to look for explosives and weapons. For airports, I can't exactly call this a bad thing as they are such easy targets, even today. I flew out of Miami several months ago and saw some very normal people being randomly picked to go into the X-Ray machines but I never was.
I won't call it scary, I look at it as an accepted risk, I'm more likely to die a horribly slow death on a highway before I do in a plane. But if there was absolute NO security, I'd take fewer risks flying on planes. To hell with that.
chiefjason
Regular Member
imported post
tekshogun /
. I flew out of Miami several months ago and saw some very normal people being randomly picked to go into the X-Ray machines but I never was.
[/quote]
And that's the problem, we are wasting time on people that should be left alone. If you don't want to profile by race, etc they should at least learn what signs to look for and narrow the field more. We are looking for the one in a million not the every fifth person. That one will give off tells if you know what to look for, ask the Israelis. Then put them through the scanner. We're so busy trying not to be offensive to a few, but we are perfectly fine offending everyone. Makes perfect sense! :banghead:
tekshogun /
. I flew out of Miami several months ago and saw some very normal people being randomly picked to go into the X-Ray machines but I never was.
[/quote]
And that's the problem, we are wasting time on people that should be left alone. If you don't want to profile by race, etc they should at least learn what signs to look for and narrow the field more. We are looking for the one in a million not the every fifth person. That one will give off tells if you know what to look for, ask the Israelis. Then put them through the scanner. We're so busy trying not to be offensive to a few, but we are perfectly fine offending everyone. Makes perfect sense! :banghead:
tekshogun
Founder's Club Member
imported post
chiefjason wrote:
I hear ya, but profiling, is still a problem. As a matter of fact, they already profile based on certain criteria. It is a numbers game, race, amount of baggage, known affiliations, religion, criminal history, watch lists, etc, etc. The Israelis still get attacked, and far more than the United States ever has, and not just in their colonies but smack in the middle of their country, in Tel Aviv with people carrying guns around ready for action. The terrorist monster will shift on a system that relies on any kind of profiling. They should incorporate as much as possible as far as profiling goes to prevent the ATTEMPT but before the point of attack or entry onto/into the area of attack such as the airport), there needs to be a catch all solution as the last line of defense. Failure to do so maintains or increases the risk of exploitation leading to failure. The attack on the airline Christmas day was done by black muslim, yes, tomorrow it could be a white muslim or a muslim from the Phillipines or Indonesia, Chechnya, or right here in the United States from someone like John Walker Lindh. These people aren't stupid, they will adapt and attempt to overcome, we must head them off at all points.
chiefjason wrote:
I hear ya, but profiling, is still a problem. As a matter of fact, they already profile based on certain criteria. It is a numbers game, race, amount of baggage, known affiliations, religion, criminal history, watch lists, etc, etc. The Israelis still get attacked, and far more than the United States ever has, and not just in their colonies but smack in the middle of their country, in Tel Aviv with people carrying guns around ready for action. The terrorist monster will shift on a system that relies on any kind of profiling. They should incorporate as much as possible as far as profiling goes to prevent the ATTEMPT but before the point of attack or entry onto/into the area of attack such as the airport), there needs to be a catch all solution as the last line of defense. Failure to do so maintains or increases the risk of exploitation leading to failure. The attack on the airline Christmas day was done by black muslim, yes, tomorrow it could be a white muslim or a muslim from the Phillipines or Indonesia, Chechnya, or right here in the United States from someone like John Walker Lindh. These people aren't stupid, they will adapt and attempt to overcome, we must head them off at all points.
chiefjason
Regular Member
imported post
But the Israelis don't rely on nearly the technology we do. They keep it pretty simple. They train the folks at the airport in what to look for. They ask questions. They look you in the eye and gauge your response. If a red flag goes of you get pulled to the side. If not you go on. I'm not talking about car bombings, etc just the planes. They are not loosing many of them. I came across an article on another board recently. It's down now, I'll try to copy it here. It was quite interesting.
But the Israelis don't rely on nearly the technology we do. They keep it pretty simple. They train the folks at the airport in what to look for. They ask questions. They look you in the eye and gauge your response. If a red flag goes of you get pulled to the side. If not you go on. I'm not talking about car bombings, etc just the planes. They are not loosing many of them. I came across an article on another board recently. It's down now, I'll try to copy it here. It was quite interesting.
Lawmaker
Regular Member
imported post
I am asian and look kinda of far-east, middle-east and have been mistaken for hispanic. I also work for an IT company and carry a huge amount of electronics, wires, cables, etc in my carry on. I always get a crack out of me walking through watching them pat down the 80 year old guy in a walker.
I am asian and look kinda of far-east, middle-east and have been mistaken for hispanic. I also work for an IT company and carry a huge amount of electronics, wires, cables, etc in my carry on. I always get a crack out of me walking through watching them pat down the 80 year old guy in a walker.
glockaholic
Regular Member
imported post
Agreed, the images posted previously are fake. But Google for the real images and they are just as disturbing, even without hair. Personally, I'll be driving rather than subject myself to that kind of invasive scan.
Interesting series of videos on the TSA...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n7keSr5OrI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jT3ulR3RXc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhX-4iPYOmg
Agreed, the images posted previously are fake. But Google for the real images and they are just as disturbing, even without hair. Personally, I'll be driving rather than subject myself to that kind of invasive scan.
Interesting series of videos on the TSA...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n7keSr5OrI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jT3ulR3RXc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhX-4iPYOmg
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
Glock,
You are right. I got those images from a major news site (MSNBC), and assumed they were legit...
I stand corrected. Just to be fair, here are some pics that I KNOW are legit. Not quite as "sexy", but pretty detailed, and COMPLETELY naked none the less.
Next time you fly, ask yourself if you want some TSA rent-a-cop looking at you, your wife, or your children with one of these machines...
Glock,
You are right. I got those images from a major news site (MSNBC), and assumed they were legit...
I stand corrected. Just to be fair, here are some pics that I KNOW are legit. Not quite as "sexy", but pretty detailed, and COMPLETELY naked none the less.
Next time you fly, ask yourself if you want some TSA rent-a-cop looking at you, your wife, or your children with one of these machines...
Dreamer
Regular Member
imported post
chiefjason wrote:
Tsahi Gozani, the CEO of OSI (the parent company of Rapiscan, the company making these scanners) has been sucking at the teat of the airport "security" cash cow for over 2 decades. He spoke in an article for the NY Times in 1987 about "bomb sniffing" devices that were to be installed in airports and Customs facilities back then.
Did they work?
Well, they worked to help make Gozani's company (OSI) grow to have nearly $600,000,000 in revenues by 2008.
The company that Gozani started to make "drug sniffing" machines back in the early 1990's--Ancore--was spun off from SAIC, his previous employer. Later, he started OSI, and then Rapiscan. So his ties (through SAIC) to the military-industrial complex run deep, there is no denying that. But even though Ancore's "drug sniffers" were a monumental failure, his companies continue to get billions in contracts from Customs, TSA, and DHS, and this has been going on for 2 decades.
http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=20020806&slug=detector06
What is most shocking is not the unbridled greed or bald-faced fraud being perpetrated by these companies. What is MOST shocking is that the largest supplier of this technology (Rapiscan/OSI) is owned by a man of Israeli decent--you'd think he would know better than to participate in the construction of a tyrannical surveillance society. Doesn't he remember his OWN history?
The only thing these millimeter-wave naked body scanners will do is train travelers to submit to people wearing uniforms and badges. They will NOT help catch terrorists. They will NOT keep explosives or weapons off of flights. But they WILL funnel billions of dollars into the pockets of the people who make these useless machines, and more importantly, they will continue the programming of the minds of Americans that they MUST submit to any request made by a person with a uniform and a badge.
The TSA is setting some VERY dangerous precedents, and we need to be VERY wary of what the REAL agenda is here folks...
chiefjason wrote:
Yeah, they just send their scientists here to start companies to sell these fake technologies to us for billions of dollars...
Tsahi Gozani, the CEO of OSI (the parent company of Rapiscan, the company making these scanners) has been sucking at the teat of the airport "security" cash cow for over 2 decades. He spoke in an article for the NY Times in 1987 about "bomb sniffing" devices that were to be installed in airports and Customs facilities back then.
Did they work?
Well, they worked to help make Gozani's company (OSI) grow to have nearly $600,000,000 in revenues by 2008.
The company that Gozani started to make "drug sniffing" machines back in the early 1990's--Ancore--was spun off from SAIC, his previous employer. Later, he started OSI, and then Rapiscan. So his ties (through SAIC) to the military-industrial complex run deep, there is no denying that. But even though Ancore's "drug sniffers" were a monumental failure, his companies continue to get billions in contracts from Customs, TSA, and DHS, and this has been going on for 2 decades.
http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=20020806&slug=detector06
What is most shocking is not the unbridled greed or bald-faced fraud being perpetrated by these companies. What is MOST shocking is that the largest supplier of this technology (Rapiscan/OSI) is owned by a man of Israeli decent--you'd think he would know better than to participate in the construction of a tyrannical surveillance society. Doesn't he remember his OWN history?
The only thing these millimeter-wave naked body scanners will do is train travelers to submit to people wearing uniforms and badges. They will NOT help catch terrorists. They will NOT keep explosives or weapons off of flights. But they WILL funnel billions of dollars into the pockets of the people who make these useless machines, and more importantly, they will continue the programming of the minds of Americans that they MUST submit to any request made by a person with a uniform and a badge.
The TSA is setting some VERY dangerous precedents, and we need to be VERY wary of what the REAL agenda is here folks...