MARTIAL LAW IS COMING

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yelohamr wrote:

SNIP If you want to roll over and let them take what you have to protect yourself with. What's the point of having them?

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That is the wonderful thing about rights, Yelohamr. They do not require justification, explanation, or a discussion about the point of having them. As the Founders signed, "...truths...self-evident."

But, just for fun, lets follow the discussion just a moment. I am in no way acknowledging that rights need discussion in order to be valid. I am merely illustrating a broader/deeper view.

The setting: the Jews in the Warsaw ghetto. The date: April 19, 1943. The situation: German troops move in to start deporting the the inhabitants. This was the scene of the uprising where a few hardy Jews who had kept or obtained guns kept the Germans from taking control until mid-May.

The Jews had permitted themselves to disarmed by the Nazi's starting with the gun control law in (1933?) and eventual actual gun confiscations.

So, under an uncharitable view, even if Allied air transport had somehow dropped some more guns in for the Jews, they would not have deserved the guns? They would not have deserved to be able to defend themselves?

Same for any weapons they could steal from the Germans, including battlefield pick-ups. Just because aJew surrendered his gun during the earlierconfiscations, he cannotnowsteal one from the Germans to defend himself, or receive one from a German killed by a compatriot? "Sorry, Issac. You turned yours in. You have no right todefend yourself, anymore. You don't deserve it."

Of course not. They deserved every chance they got to stay alive and fight back.

Even if they only discovered theirerror after the guns were confiscated, they still had the right of self-defense.

Self-evident truths. Unalienable rights.

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In case you forgot, the topic of this thread is aboutmartial law andwhat would you do when they come to take your guns. If you want to surrender, thats your choice. I won't.

I don't expect anyone to airlift any guns or ammo to me. I have enough now.

You may have missed my point. When they (whoever they are) come to take your guns and you give in to them without a fight, you don't deserve to keep them.

Being a gun owner is one thing. Having the will and ability to use one for its intended purpose is another. I can and have and am willing to do it again if the need arises. I won't give mine up, they will have to be taken, one way or another.

To me this subject is closed. You know what I'll do.

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yelohamr wrote:

In case you forgot, the topic of this thread is aboutmartial law andwhat would you do when they come to take your guns. If you want to surrender, thats your choice. I won't.

I don't expect anyone to airlift any guns or ammo to me. I have enough now.

You may have missed my point. When they (whoever they are) come to take your guns and you give in to them without a fight, you don't deserve to keep them.

Being a gun owner is one thing. Having the will and ability to use one for its intended purpose is another. I can and have and am willing to do it again if the need arises. I won't give mine up, they will have to be taken, one way or another.

To me this subject is closed. You know what I'll do.

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Alright. If the subject is closed for you, I can't make you read my posts. But, it is not closed for me.

This next is for others who may be teetering or agreeing with Yelohamr.

My main point here is that rights are always valid, they always exist, they are unalienable (can't be separated from the person). And we would do well to be very, very careful about letting ourselves fall into thinking that they are lost to someone for one reason or another.

Regarding the text I highlighted in red, I disagree with Yelohamr. Of course, a person deserves to keep his guns. Otherwise, it would not be wrong for the government to seize them. "See, sarge. As long as he gives them up under threat of arrest, it makes it morally correct for us to take them from him."

Not only does he deserve to keep them, he deserves to get them back.

The point is not the details of the discussion. The point is how easily we can err and start stripping our fellow human beings of rights just because we are bitter that they don't perform they way we want them to.

Rights are rights are rights are rights.

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leoffensive wrote:

fight for your right!! TO PARTAY!

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Wow man...my head started to involuntarily shake up and down radically! :dude:

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yelohamr wrote:

In case you forgot, the topic of this thread is aboutmartial law andwhat would you do when they come to take your guns. If you want to surrender, thats your choice. I won't.

I don't expect anyone to airlift any guns or ammo to me. I have enough now.

You may have missed my point. When they (whoever they are) come to take your guns and you give in to them without a fight, you don't deserve to keep them.

Being a gun owner is one thing. Having the will and ability to use one for its intended purpose is another. I can and have and am willing to do it again if the need arises. I won't give mine up, they will have to be taken, one way or another.

To me this subject is closed. You know what I'll do.

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I don't want my statements to be misconstrued. I am not in favor of surrendering, nor would I...ever. But I don't see the point of dying today when I could live on to fight tomorrow. In the face of superior fire power, and likelybeing caught off guard, again lie like the devil himself.

But when they get the drop on you, you can kamikaze if you want, but there might be a better way. If my back is to the wall and the firing squad is lining up, there's no way in hell I'm just standing there.

Don't surrender, don't give up your guns. Have a plan. That's what I think this thread is about. Doesanybodycare to sharea plan, or an idea for a plan, or just hope they don't come for them. Yeah, that worked out real well in New Orleans, didn't it.

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yelohamr wrote:

When the time comes and you don't use them, you deserve to lose them.

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Hi, I've been lurking for a bit but had to comment here. I'm in agreement with yelohamr.
Everybody has to have that line in the sand & confiscation is mine. I refuse to live like a slave on my knees. I'd rather defend myself & my rights because when the people are disarmed, historically things only get worse from there.
Have you guys seen the movie "Innocents Betrayed"? It will make even anti-gunners aware of how valuable the 2nd amendment is.

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We are talking about guns here, the 2 A is about the right to keep and bear arms

for your safety and to protect a free state ( That being nessecary)

Have we forgotten that ?

Do you really think they will let you go when they take your guns ? "Or will they say O.K. thanks, now you can get on the bus ? Yes to your new relocation area for your safety. We are evacuating this area, for safety reasons.

Terrorist groups, and Rebels, roming the area.

Something to really think about.

Yes a plan is in good order, time to prepair is now !

If one gives up his guns, he is really "Saying I want to be your slave".

Think about the brother who fought for your freedom, and gave their lives, are you going to let them down also?

"Never" "Never" give up your guns, no matter what the odds are !

Get a Heart Man ! Robin47

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I would like to start by thanking everyone for their great Ideas on this subject and I dont mean tocause mass histeria or scare anyone. In my opinion Ithink everyone should, our rights or hanging by a small thread.I know that this siteshould be focused onOC but how long can we excercise these rights before they are taken away regardless of what laws are put into place to prevent that, just like our constitution these lawswouldbe broken by our government whenthere is aperfect crisis involved. With that said we should havea plan but plans are made to fail so what then? thats when you should have plan Bif planB doesnt work plan Cand so on with this in mind you will have a better chance of survival. We know evil is lurking all around us we must have faithbecauselike everyone else here I strongly believein the 2n amendment and it isour dutyto defend it. I have a family and I will give my life to proctect them. So come try to take my guns and familyand I will proudly welcome you with mylead.the link below is what could occur in civil unrest it gets worst if throw in hunger and more races.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wkf5mZwgKAA

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I know a man who is prepared for any sort of societal collapse. He has off-grid power, water, and fairly secluded location. He already has food planted and enough livestock grazing his land to last a long while (maybe indefinitely). He also has enough firearms, ammo, reloading supplies, etc to hold off any sort of bandits as may try to raid his supplies, and his location is secluded enough that any such group won't even know he's there. It's also mighty beautiful country there abouts.

If the SHTF before I make it out of CA, I know exactly where I'm heading. Unless SF gets nuked, me and mine will be all right. (If SF gets nuked the entire Central Valley is screwed, since we're downwind.)

A few years ago I probably would have scoffed at the idea... but after seeing how the government responds to a disaster such as Hurricane Katrina, I'm much less trusting. And while Katrina was a major disaster, I'm certain far worse could happen.

Prepare for the worst, and hope for the best.

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Where we stand today is lack of people knowing their neighbors, and being able

to gathering for a cause.

"Bigtoe" is right, we should read the history on www.alarmandmuster.com

Its on the main page under "The seed that was sown" click on "Alarm & Muster"

It comes up in PDF.

They LOC'ed daily, for protection agains't hostiles, and a hostile King George, England.

Our structure of Solverign States, each being Independant, ruling themselfs in how this country stays free.

A top-Down control, is dictatorship.

This is about "We The People", who run the Government through our elected people.

Martial Law, is also a threat to our Legislators and their power and their jobs also.

We should make them aware of that also in letters. Telling them we need to get back to the rule of Law which is the Constitution both Federal and State.

Get to know freedom loving people and likeminded freedom lovers !

Robin47

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That's the thing with this country and the second amendment. It's the last line of defense to ensure that we are all sovereign bodies, free to do what we will, without fear of reprisal. If somebody comes for your guns and your plan is to wait to fight another day, you might be quite upset when you are ordered away from your family or whatever they want to do with you. Before you had a weapon capable of inflicting damage from range. Now you have your fists.

It's entirely possible that somebody could confiscate your weapons and leave you be. Then you could wait to organize and fight another day. But are you going to trust the same person that is knowingly violating the supreme law of the land? I couldn't.

Deferring a fight to another day is a losing plan in my opinion. If you die a martyr and kill five thugs in the process, so much the better. How many people are going to continue reporting to gun confiscation duty when it is guaranteed that five of them will die? Personally I'd rather find a different job.

A big part of preventing government intrusion on gun rights is the sense of having a united front. If every gun owner says, "Come and take them" to gun confiscators, then no confiscations will take place. If some small percentage of gun owners would rather die than give up their arms, then gun confiscation can proceed ahead full steam. The media will portray those people as mentally unsound, or a fringe element of society, or an extremist. If the media has to report daily on hundreds of extremists who are being killed in their homes, then they cease being extremists. Popular opinion cannot side with those who are viewed as aggressors, and freedom shall prevail once again.

So put me in yelohamr's camp. I'll be killing confiscators if I have to tear their throats out with my teeth.

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It's good to see that everyone won't bend over and grab their ankles.

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Well i have a 12-ga with bunch of less lethal bean bag and rubber rounds, built up two 6.8 AR's have almost 1000 rounds of ammo loaded myself, i have 3 "Bug Out" kits thanks to Cheaper Than Dirt with some of my own added items plus bought 2 extra cases of MRE's from military surplus plus 2 military flak vest with SAPI plates and a bunch of extra gear(mags, drop leg holsters, dump pouch, Tac vests all that good stuff) plus 3 good buddies that have done similar that live within 1 to 2 miles of my place

We already discussed this idea right after "Katrina" also have friends up north who moved out of bay area long time ago past redding near "cotton wood" way out in the boonies and one buddy has family in Oregon and Nevada if had to also have family in Tennessee and Arkansas if we can get that far??

I also hope nothing like this would ever happen because there are a lot of people out there with no protection and are not ready or prepared for this. I feel they would be herded like cattle, but on the other hand there are more armed and unarmed citizens than we have police and military

i think some or most of these people would rise up against marshal law but i cant be sure. I just know i have talked to a couple of other people and brought this subject up in a group discussion, they looked at me a little weird like i was crazy for talking bout this but it really got them thinking, i had a lot of people tell me they would most likely rise up than live under marshal law but like i say "talk the talk walk the walk" you never know till your in that situation?

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Speaking of martial law, does anyone remember the rumors in 1999 of the Clinton Administration preparing for martial law in the event of Y2K disasters? One of the rumors was, it would be a way for Clinton to remain as POTUS after two terms, along with suspension of most of our rights.

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I'm with yelohamr. Come and get them and see what you get.

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Marshaul is libertarian and I wouldn't mind most of his laws (or lack thereof being libertarian).

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

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sudden valley gunner wrote:

Marshaul is libertarian and I wouldn't mind most of his laws (or lack thereof being libertarian). 

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

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Yeah, I mean, it really wouldn't be that bad at all.

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yelohamr wrote:

Speaking of martial law, does anyone remember the rumors in 1999 of the Clinton Administration preparing for martial law in the event of Y2K disasters? One of the rumors was, it would be a way for Clinton to remain as POTUS after two terms, along with suspension of most of our rights.

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I know a guy who thought Bush (jr) was going to do the same thing, that there would be some sort of terrorist attack "allowed" to happen as an excuse to declare a state of emergency and suspend elections.