imported post
rosemonter wrote:
Okay, say you're walking along and someone decides to attempt stealing your bag, laptop, bicycle, something of great value. Would it be legal to pull your weapon and load it(but not use), in order to prevent this crime.
Absolutely. For your review, consider reading the following penal code sections:
PC 147: Brandishing permitted in self defense
PC 12031(j)(1): Loaded firearm exception for immediate threat to person or property
PC 197(1): Homicide is justifiable in resisting an attempt to commit a felony.
A note on PC 197. The wording doesn't carry the weight it did in the 19th century. The homicide generally needs to be somehow related to preserving life to be justified. You can't shoot somebody for commiting a non violent felony, but under the right circumstances, you can shoot a felon if they present a deadly threat in the commission of the felony, while resisting apprehension or if it is likely that they will harm yourself or others if not immediately stopped. Under no circumstances is the homicide justified if the force used is deemed excessive of what was necessary to stop the threat of violence. Expect the most narrow application of the law to be applied.
And, say that the person doesn't have a weapon. What if a person is verbally assaulting you, approaching you with the intent to physically hurt you, they don't have a weapon. Is it legal to pull your weapon and load it(not use it) to protect yourself?
If they don't have a weapon in hand and they are approaching you in that manner:
1 - Assume they have a weapon
2 - Look for any bulge, print, or potential place of concealment where a weapon could be without being visible and consider any stretch of the imagination that a weapon is present
3 - Consider the aggressor's stature and if a potential disparity of force exists
4 - Consider their potential to gain control of your weapon and use it against you
Finally - whatever the goal, their tactic is to assume you won't draw on an unarmed attacker until it is too late. They intend to harm you. You are on the receiving end of what is called violence of action. Violence of action is extremely effective. Being on the receiving end of it is a horrible place to be. I cannot stress enough the peril you would be in if you were to find yourself in that type of situation. There is a reason that type of situation would be rare and unreasonable to even most criminals.
The same statutes above apply here. Once there is an immediate threat to person or property you can load. Once their is an immediate threat of great bodily harm you can brandish. In most cases that comes to mind, loading and brandishing will be one and the same.
These are the kind of scenario's that I think most people need to know about.
I'm mostly interested in the use of a gun for prevention and protection of or from crime.
I still have more questions...
=]
Final thoughts. In both examples you considered, you specify that you wouldn't use the gun by which I assume you mean shoot. This isn't directed so much at you as it is commentary in general: don't carry anything you wouldn't use. Both cases you suggest are so close to already being justifiable homicides that the difference comes down to the circumstances. If you pull a gun to prevent a theft, be ready for the same lethal response you would give to an attacker pulling a gun on you. If somebody is attacking you personally after seeing a gun on your hip, assume they intend to kill you with your own gun - if they get close enough to wrestle with you, it may be too late.
