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Thread: Sterling Heights Police Department

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    Hey everyone. Born and raised at 7 and Dequinder. I moved to Sterling Heights as a teenager, with my parents. I went to middle school and high school there and lived there a year after that. Getting to the point- I've been pulled over and subsequently searched by the SHPD more than a couple times. I've been ticketed and questioned. I've filed complaints at the Dodge Park building and have gotten no where.

    I moved to Colorado and have been OC since. I OC every single day. My parents live in Sterling Heights and so do most of my relatives. I have to visit them sometime. It's been a couple years already. I can't escape this overwhelming feeling of having a horror story to tell when I OC for the first time there. It's as though it's When, not If, I'm going to have an issue. What can you guys tell me as far as the SHPD? I've used the search function and read what I could. Sorry to rant, but I'm looking for some support. Hopefully even some closure should I have a terrible run in with an officer.
    SHPD has a really bad reputation. They always have.

    Thoughts? Thanks.

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    cscitney87 wrote:
    Hey everyone.* Born and raised at 7 and Dequinder.* I moved to Sterling Heights as a teenager, with my parents.* I went to middle school and high school there and lived there a year after that.* Getting to the point- I've been pulled over and subsequently searched by the SHPD more than a couple times.* I've been ticketed and questioned.* I've filed complaints at the Dodge Park building and have gotten no where.

    I moved to Colorado and have been OC since.* I OC every single day.* My parents live in Sterling Heights and so do most of my relatives.* I have to visit them sometime.* It's been a couple years already.* I can't escape this overwhelming feeling of having a horror story to tell when I OC for the first time there.* It's as though it's When, not If, I'm going to have an issue.* What can you guys tell me as far as the SHPD?* I've used the search function and read what I could.* Sorry to rant, but I'm looking for some support.* Hopefully even some closure should I have a terrible run in with an officer.
    SHPD has a really bad reputation.* They always have.

    Thoughts?* Thanks.
    I grew up on the west side of town (Farmington Hills) so I can't say I'm that familiar with Sterling Heights PD. I did have many friends in SH and Warren areas growing up and can't say we ever had any encounters with the police. I now live in Warren and have yet to have a bad encounter with the Warren PD though I'm aware of 2 nasty encounters our members had here. Can you please give us some details of your encounter with the police in SH I'm curious as to what took place? All I know is SH cant be worse then the Warren PD but you never know.

    Mike

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    Regular Member sprinklerguy28's Avatar
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    Last week Ihad lunch at Dodge Park Coney Island,15 Mile and Dodge Park. Being a regular lunch stop for SHPD there were 2 officers sitting next to me at the counter. They both noticed I was OCing. Nothing was saidexcept for casual greetings and them telling me to have a good day when I left.

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    I've hurd good and bad things about SHPD. They like to pick on the young and easly-scared, like most departments but slightly worse. They mostly pull 16-25yo over and say things like, "where going to search your car, okay", but don't wait for the answer. Now I'm sure that it is only individual officers. Giving props to the SHPD, they are considered to be one of the safest citys in the state, and I believe top rated for metro Detroit.

    Nothing compairs to Warren for the bad though. I have yet to meet a decent Warren LEO. I'm sure their is at least one out their, just haven't ran accross him/her. I live 6 houses from Warren...



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    They mostly pull 16-25yo over and say things like, "where going to search your car, okay", but don't wait for the answer.

    That's exactly what it is and was. I graduated from SHHS class of 05. They pulled me over twice and searched without finding anything. First time it happened it was 2004 and I had met a friend at the 711 at 14 and Ryan to exchange audio CDs. The store clerk called SHPD saying we were conducting a drug deal in the parking lot. I was pulled over into Nelson Park (15 mile road). The officer searched my car without my consent and had SUV k-9 come when he found nothing. The k-9 found nothing and I was told Thank you for the coop. Years later I was pulled over for "loud stereo" when no stereo was playing at all. Colorado plates. I was stepping out of my vehicle, as requested by the officer, and I shut the door behind me. The windows were up and the door locked. The officer FREAKED on that and called the dogs right away. He thought he had busted a drug dealer because my automobile was secured. Long story short, this cop took the keys out of my pocket, searched my car without permission. He found nothing and had the k-9 search it too. I filed complaints without avail. Never went to court- but my parents sure were pissed at the time.

    Glad to hear about the OC in SH. I really appreciate the input. I'll be carrying, regardless, so I needed to know what I was getting into on the issue.

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    Regular Member pmcqueen37's Avatar
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    You should location into your profile
    live every day like its your last cause one day you will be right

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    You may want to do some research on this subject, the way I understand it as "SOME ONE WHO IS FROM OUT OF STATE" you can not cc-oc or even hunt with a handgun in Michigan, this has been discussed at migunowner.com - I've been known to be wrong but if I where you I would look into further.

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    Rasher wrote:
    You may want to do some research on this subject, the way I understand it as "SOME ONE WHO IS FROM OUT OF STATE" you can not cc-oc or even hunt with a handgun in Michigan, this has been discussed at migunowner.com - I've been known to be wrong but if I where you I would look into further.
    They can if they have a CPL from any state or they have a licence permit to possess the handgun that was issued by their state.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Regular Member lil_freak_66's Avatar
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    Rasher wrote:
    You may want to do some research on this subject, the way I understand it as "SOME ONE WHO IS FROM OUT OF STATE" you can not cc-oc or even hunt with a handgun in Michigan, this has been discussed at migunowner.com - I've been known to be wrong but if I where you I would look into further.
    michigan honors any out of state carry permits.

    and by my understanding if you have said permit then you can oc or cc at your discretion,some exceptions apply.
    not a lawyer, dont take anything i say as legal advice.


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    lil_freak_66 wrote:
    Rasher wrote:
    You may want to do some research on this subject, the way I understand it as "SOME ONE WHO IS FROM OUT OF STATE" you can not cc-oc or even hunt with a handgun in Michigan, this has been discussed at migunowner.com - I've been known to be wrong but if I where you I would look into further.
    michigan honors any out of state carry permits.

    and by my understanding if you have said permit then you can oc or cc at your discretion,some exceptions apply.
    Venator is talking about licenses to carry a concealed pistol from a state where the person does not reside.

    For example, a person who lives in Florida that has a license to carry a concealed pistol from Utah, can OC here in Michigan where Federal, State and Local laws allow.

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    Sorry you all very correct on the cc issue, with a cpl from his homa state -brain fart on my part I knew that, had my son in my ear and soon as I hit send I knew what I did, the whole 3 things at once thing. But I'am I wrong if I say if he does not have a permit(I was going on that assumption,as he never said he had one) he can not even oc in MI.

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    I was raised in SH and lived and know the area very well, I have never personally had a problem with the police department in regards to OC or any other reason. In my experience they have been great.



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    Rasher wrote:
    Sorry you all very correct on the cc issue, with a cpl from his homa state -brain fart on my part I knew that, had my son in my ear and soon as I hit send I knew what I did, the whole 3 things at once thing. But I'am I wrong if I say if he does not have a permit(I was going on that assumption,as he never said he had one) he can not even oc in MI.

    If he has a CPL from his home state, he can CC or OC in Michigan with some restrictions. Applicable laws: MCL 750.234d & MCL 28.425o

    If he has a CPL from a state where he does not reside, he can OC in Michigan with some restrictions. Applicable Law: MCL 28.432

    If he does not have a CPL from any state, he can OC in Michigan with some restrictions if he had to obtain a permit to purchase, a FOID, etc, to purchase the handgun. Applicable Law: MCL 28.422


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    Thank you guys for some very sobering information. It's appreciated.

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    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    Rasher wrote:
    Sorry you all very correct on the cc issue, with a cpl from his homa state -brain fart on my part I knew that, had my son in my ear and soon as I hit send I knew what I did, the whole 3 things at once thing. But I'am I wrong if I say if he does not have a permit(I was going on that assumption,as he never said he had one) he can not even oc in MI.

    If he has a CPL from his home state, he can CC or OC in Michigan with some restrictions. Applicable laws: MCL 750.234d & MCL 28.425o

    If he has a CPL from a state where he does not reside, he can OC in Michigan with some restrictions. Applicable Law: MCL 28.432

    If he does not have a CPL from any state, he can OC in Michigan with some restrictions if he had to obtain a permit to purchase, a FOID, etc, to purchase the handgun. Applicable Law: MCL 28.422
    These cites may help, but it's confusing.

    "28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure; forging application; implementation during business hours.

    Sec. 2.

    (1) Except as otherwise provided in this section, a person shall not purchase, carry, possess, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol as prescribed in this section.

    One exception to this requirement to obtain this MI permit generally called a purchase permit is:

    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:

    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.

    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).

    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.

    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency in this state."

    The way I personally read this is. If you happen to live in a state like NJ that requires a permit to purchase or a statelike IL that requires a FOID to purchase, posses, and transport, than you can OC on foot in MI with such permit or FOID with a lawful purpose as defined later.

    Now if you live in a state like WI that does not have any permits than you need to look at this law.

    "28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; citation as “Janet Kukuk act”.

    Sec. 12.

    (1) Section 2 does not apply to any of the following:

    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state."

    This law gives a person a full exemption to the previous law. Notice that it does not state anything about residency. It only requires that a person be a U.S. citizen with a CC permit from any state.

    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    The above laws read- Forget the CCW part. I know you said that if the state doesn't have a permit that I need to have a CCW.

    My argument would be this:

    There is no license to purchase a firearm in Colorado. There is also no license to possess or carry a firearm (OC) in Colorado.

    That being said- Should my Colorado ID should legally be enough to stand grounds as my "license from Colorado to carry/possess/purchase" a firearm? In other words- Michigan's law is saying if I can legally purchase and possess a gun in the state I live then I can legally carry said pistol in my possession in Michigan. Right? So just because Colorado doesn't issue a "license to purchase" a gun doesn't mean I have to present a Colorado "gun purchasing" license. In other words- Michigan needs to know that you went through the hoops, loops, and criminal checks before carrying a pistol around- as long as the pistol was legally purchased it should be okay, "license" or not?


    PS. Excuse my logic if it's wrong. I'm a product of Warren Consolidated Schools hahaha :shock:

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    cscitney87 wrote:
    The above laws read- Forget the CCW part. I know you said that if the state doesn't have a permit that I need to have a CCW.

    My argument would be this:

    There is no license to purchase a firearm in Colorado. There is also no license to possess or carry a firearm (OC) in Colorado.

    That being said- Should my Colorado ID should legally be enough to stand grounds as my "license from Colorado to carry/possess/purchase" a firearm? In other words- Michigan's law is saying if I can legally purchase and possess a gun in the state I live then I can legally carry said pistol in my possession in Michigan. Right? So just because Colorado doesn't issue a "license to purchase" a gun doesn't mean I have to present a Colorado "gun purchasing" license. In other words- Michigan needs to know that you went through the hoops, loops, and criminal checks before carrying a pistol around- as long as the pistol was legally purchased it should be okay, "license" or not?


    PS. Excuse my logic if it's wrong. I'm a product of Warren Consolidated Schools hahaha :shock:
    I think you have it right. Michigan is basically in violation of several laws by denying non-residents the right to possess a handgun here.

    They want non-residents to jump through a few hoops in order for you to exercise your 2nd Amd. and the state's constitutional rights.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Regular Member JeffSayers's Avatar
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    Wasn't 28.422 updated / super-ceded by a new law / language when Michigan admitted they register handguns?

    It may be wise to verify the new text of such update / super-secession to make sure they didn't strip away this right. I would think we would have caught it though and made a huge stink... but just in case.

    And for Colorado not issuing a purchase permit; well let's just say you may want to drive AROUND Wayne County on your way in.

    Edit: spelling

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    JeffSayers wrote:
    Wasn't 28.422 updated / super-ceded by a new law / language when Michigan admitted they register handguns?

    It may be wise to verify the new text of such update / super-secession to make sure they didn't strip away this right. I would think we would have caught it though and made a huge stink... but just in case.

    And for Colorado not issuing a purchase permit; well let's just say you may want to drive AROUND Wayne County on your way in.

    Edit: spelling
    Yes. Also posted above in pertinent part by Venator:

    http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(gze...ame=mcl-28-432


    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; citation as “Janet Kukuk act”.

    Sec. 12.

    (1) Section 2 does not apply to any of the following:

    (a) A police or correctional agency of the United States or of this state or any subdivision of this state.

    (b) The United States army, air force, navy, or marine corps.

    (c) An organization authorized by law to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state.

    (d) The national guard, armed forces reserves, or other duly authorized military organization.

    (e) A member of an entity or organization described in subdivisions (a) through (d) for a pistol while engaged in the course of his or her duties with that entity or while going to or returning from those duties.

    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.

    (g) The regular and ordinary transportation of a pistol as merchandise by an authorized agent of a person licensed to manufacture firearms or a licensed dealer.

    (h) Purchasing, owning, carrying, possessing, using, or transporting an antique firearm. As used in this subdivision, "antique firearm" means that term as defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    (i) An individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting a pistol belonging to another individual, if the other individual's possession of the pistol is authorized by law and the individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting the pistol has obtained a license under section 5b to carry a concealed pistol or is exempt from licensure as provided in section 12a.

    (2) The amendatory act that added subsection (1)(h) shall be known and may be cited as the "Janet Kukuk act".

    Notice that (f) does not stipulate a residency requirement.

    If a resident of Colorado obtained a license/permit from a different state to carry a concealed pistol,he or she can OC in Michigan (with restrictions) per this statute, but can not carry in their vehicle (CC).


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    Regular Member JeffSayers's Avatar
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    Yes, possession of a CPL equivalent from Colorado would indeed render cscitney87 in compliance with Michigan law. However, it appears cscitney does not have such a permit.

    ??????????
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    JeffSayers wrote:
    Yes, possession of a CPL equivalent from Colorado would indeed render cscitney87 in compliance with Michigan law. However, it appears cscitney does not have such a permit.

    ??????????
    I was aware he did not have a license, I was mainly responding to your question: "Wasn't 28.422 updated / super-ceded by a new law..." and adding/agreeing what was alreadyposted (28.432)that license/permit from another state would allow him to OC in Michigan.

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    Regular Member JeffSayers's Avatar
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    OK, gotcha Springer we are on the same page.

    My concern though is that th OP does not have a CPL, therefore Janet Kukuk does not grant immunity from 28.422. Also, 28.422 call out that you must HAVE a purchase permit from your home state AND be in POSSESSION of such permit while carrying in MI.

    Given, it is a logical arguement that because home state does not issue purchase permits, a DL from home is an equivalent to a purchase permit from home and therefore in compliance.

    I only caution to see if the verbiage of 28.422 may have changed when registration became effective. Also I caution to avoid Wayne County because our friend Mrs. Worthy-of-nothing would probably love to attack the arguement of DL being Colorado's equivalent of a purchase permit.
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    JeffSayers wrote:
    OK, gotcha Springer we are on the same page.

    My concern though is that th OP does not have a CPL, therefore Janet Kukuk does not grant immunity from 28.422. Also, 28.422 call out that you must HAVE a purchase permit from your home state AND be in POSSESSION of such permit while carrying in MI.

    Given, it is a logical arguement that because home state does not issue purchase permits, a DL from home is an equivalent to a purchase permit from home and therefore in compliance.

    I only caution to see if the verbiage of 28.422 may have changed when registration became effective. Also I caution to avoid Wayne County because our friend Mrs. Worthy-of-nothing would probably love to attack the arguement of DL being Colorado's equivalent of a purchase permit.
    The only update (Amendment) to 28.422 you asked about is:

    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:

    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.

    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).

    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.

    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency in this state.


    Janet Kukuk Act (h) Purchasing, owning, carrying, possessing, using, or transporting an antique firearm. As used in this subdivision, "antique firearm" means that term as defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    This only applies, obviously,if the person has a license to carry, possess, transport, etc. If said license is not required to purchase, etc, a handgun in a state...

    That's when 28.432 (f)comes into play:

    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.

    Apologies for the confusion I brought in from my previous post.

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