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Thread: Trijicon is an awesome company...

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    http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/us-mil...ory?id=9575794


    freaking ridiculous... get a grip people! how sad the mentality has become today...

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    ABC after 9 years just had to go poking their nose where it didn't need to be.

    God! Wait til they figure out Hanes is sending "Infidel" Undershirts over there.

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    I love your title and subtitle!

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    Regular Member killchain's Avatar
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    Hey... if they want to give me a Bible and an ACOG, I'll go along with it.

    Generally the military buys something because it WORKS.

    Go figure. I had no idea this even existed until the lamestream media decided to give more reasons for insurgents to hate us... and I was issued an ACOG. -_-
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." -John Stuart Mill

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    This is not intended to start a religious debate -appreciate anyone's right to speak but not attack:

    My personal opinion: More humans have been killed in the name of God, or whatever He/She is called around the world, since the dawn of time, than for any other reason. And we all say our God is a peace loving God.

    There is a reason our great country, founded in part on religious freedom, makes a distinction between the government/military and religion and prohibits the preference of one religion over another. I can't help but think that some want a religious conflict (well you know some think they are right and anyone who does not agree is wrong and worse etc) and this does not help.

    Putting religious notes on government weapons is wrong.

    By the way - don't bring up the righteousness of the fight against the Taliban - we armed them.I don't support them but extremism in any form/government or religionusually goes against freedom.

    Well I've done it now. Pardon me while I find cover behind my 1st Amendment and reload my 2nd.



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    Campaign Veteran Bookman's Avatar
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    Hendo wrote:
    This is not intended to start a religious debate -appreciate anyone's right to speak but not attack:

    My personal opinion: More humans have been killed in the name of God, or whatever He/She is called around the world, since the dawn of time, than for any other reason. And we all say our God is a peace loving God.

    There is a reason our great country, founded in part on religious freedom, makes a distinction between the government/military and religion and prohibits the preference of one religion over another. I can't help but think that some want a religious conflict (well you know some think they are right and anyone who does not agree is wrong and worse etc) and this does not help.

    Putting religious notes on government weapons is wrong.

    By the way - don't bring up the righteousness of the fight against the Taliban - we armed them.I don't support them but extremism in any form/government or religionusually goes against freedom.

    Well I've done it now. Pardon me while I find cover behind my 1st Amendment and reload my 2nd.

    The 1st Amendment prevents the church from running the government and the government from running the church. Nothing more.
    "All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke


    "I like people who stand on the Constitution... unless they're using it to wipe their feet." - Jon E Hutcherson

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    Bookman wrote:
    The 1st Amendment prevents the church from running the government and the government from running the church. Nothing more.
    While that was the intent, I am afraid it has become quite perverted over the years....

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    What is this hatred for the Bible...It is the only reason this country was and still is as prosperous as it is.It seems no one wants any for of morality or standards anymore.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Hmmm, I have some SKS's that were created to defend communism, does that make me a communist? Nope I just like the way they shoot and they were cheap.

    (just a random thought)
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    They are SVG .I had many fired at me in Vietnam and can assure you they are indeed a good weapon.

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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    I garauntee that if one of these guys that are complaining about these scopes, would be praying to god thata sniper is using one to save them, if the alquida had them ready to lop their head off.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    DEROS72 wrote:
    What is this hatred for the Bible...It is the only reason this country was and still is as prosperous as it is.It seems no one wants any for of morality or standards anymore.
    HAH! Biblical "morality" isn't anything I'd trust with the lives of my children.

    Prosperity has absolutely nothing to do with religious standards and morals. It's exactly this kind of argument that gets people (like me) so inflamed over others' religious zeal.

    Now, I've bought several gun accessories with religious references. I've been inclined to return all of them.

    Fortunately, there's absolutely nothing any of you moralists can do to stop my rejection of your false "morality", and the subsequent "lowering of standards" and "lost productivity" that will result in small part from my actions.

    I also don't think government ought to be promulgating any religious message whatsoever. Let's be frank; none of you would be so ecstatic if it were the koran being quoted.

    With all that said, I find it hard to consider a coded message few understand to be an effective form of religious proselytization.

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    In this thread: people who claim to care about liberty attacking the liberty of others, as well as making claims to the lack of morality of those who don't believe in gods, making preposterous statements regarding the nature of the first amendment, and generally being dumb.

    I work at Microsoft. One of the things that means is that I cannot legally put "easter eggs" in any of our products. One of the reasons this policy came about is because many government offices have policies preventing them from using software with such hidden features.

    Similarly, when fighting against terrorist organizations, the government has done everything it can to ensure this is viewed as a political conflict, and not a religious one. As such, including clearly Christian Bible references onto weapons violates that directive. It's an "easter egg" that causes political tension due to the inevitable religious comparison with the Crusades, and if you're too dense to see why that could be a problem, perhaps you should read a bit more about the ongoing causes of recruitment.

    As for the other claims: they lack substance and meaning, but are still insulting to those of us who don't believe in a mystical sky wizard. If you think the founding fathers were Christian and intended this to be a Christian nation, explain the Treaty of Tripoli Article 11, where one of the founding fathers (Adams) states in no uncertain terms the basis of these United States.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    Well I knew this one would not "go quietly into the night".

    Deros - no hatred. Just keep the government/military industrial complex out of the my god is better than your god business. Does not help and causes harm. Probably a lost cause.

    If I want to worship a pear tree - so be it. If I want to carry my XD for protection - so be it. If you want to pick pears - leave my pear tree alone and if you dislike guns - don't carry one.

    Mutual respect for our differences not condemnation. We all have a piece of the truth.

    Also the Establishment Clause of the 1st Amendment speaks toprohibiting thepreference of religion.

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    DEROS72 wrote:
    What is this hatred for the Bible...It is the only reason this country was and still is as prosperous as it is.It seems no one wants any for of morality or standards anymore.
    The #1 reason for war on the planet is religion.

    Religion was invented by man to control man, the bible is part of the problem.

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    Tawnos wrote:
    ....If you think the founding fathers were Christian and intended this to be a Christian nation, explain the Treaty of Tripoli Article 11, where one of the founding fathers (Adams) states in no uncertain terms the basis of these United States.
    Yeah, and how did that bit of capitulation to privateers work out for us? Not too well, as I recall. I realize that wasn't your point, though.

    Not that I agree, but stick with the easter egg argument; it's far better than the Treaty of Tripoli angle.

    Besides, who does this really hurt? Us? Meh... Only because we say it does. As SVG said, just because the SKS was created initially to defend communists, does not make the owner, 60 years later, a communist. We're not exactly handing these out like tracts, door-to-door. I can see it now...

    "Mr. Mohammed? Yes, have you received Jesus Christ as your personal savior? No? Okay, can I leave this 4x32 rifle scope with you in case you change your mind?"

    Lol!

    I see Trijicon has already agreed to remove all references & provide kits to remove existing ones....
    http://bit.ly/6Y253z

    Petraeus is in favor of this move, and he's The Man in my book, so I'll gladly defer to his prudence on this one.

    [edit was to fix bit.ly link]
    Support these forums, please donate if you are able to OpenCarry.Org!

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    jinj wrote:
    DEROS72 wrote:
    What is this hatred for the Bible...It is the only reason this country was and still is as prosperous as it is.It seems no one wants any for of morality or standards anymore.
    The #1 reason for war on the planet is religion.

    Religion was invented by man to control man, the bible is part of the problem.
    You know I actually had someone tell me that the Army shouldn't have chaplains..Insane.As I have mentioned in the past all three of my daughters went to christian schools and the youngest homeschooled so she isn't exposed to the garbage in public schools.2 of my older girls are extremely successful in management in different companies.They are very dicerning in who they have work for them and it seems to work because they make a but load of money nad bonusus.Enough to support dad someday lol. The only group I see still trying to kill everyone is the muslims.Don't mention tim mcveigh to me I don't care he was a loon.I was extrememly picky in who was around me in the companies i managed and we were pretty successful.I look at the life style these people have in these third world toilets that are predominately muslim and compare that to the judeo christian way of life here ,.Huge difference.

    We need to divert from Haite as they are being hammered in the LA area.American.We should be shipping aid there before some of these folks are forced to live in their cabins or vacation homes.



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    This is funny.

    Got a few people here that thinks this is ridiculous. I fall into that group.

    There are a few more freaking out about religious labels on stuff. which is kind of funny when you think about it.

    Screaming about religious freedom and at the same demonizing Christians?

    How many other military objects contain a religious/mythical name or symbol?

    Isn't this the same group that commonly writes about assault weapons bans being almost entirely based upon cosmetics and not function? and laugh about the silliness of it?

    Is okay for soldiers to wear crosses? Or does that cross the line of having crusaders? Is paying them with money that contains the word "god" okay?

    And finally, the verses I've seen associated with this are very heavy on light this and light that... I wouldn't see many people here being worked up so much if something equivalent from some Buddhist/Islamic text was referenced. The scope provides light, and, ohhh..."hey that's clever".
    I always thought the stealth fighter should've had a name somehow related to the one hand clapping thing.

    Making what in your opinion is a "false claim", and how you find that insulting... and finishing your condemnation of that opinion with "mystical sky wizard"?

    I thought guns were invented by man to control man, because I happen to believe that should I then condem all guns?

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    uncoolperson wrote:
    This is funny.

    Got a few people here that thinks this is ridiculous. I fall into that group.

    There are a few more freaking out about religious labels on stuff. which is kind of funny when you think about it.

    Screaming about religious freedom and at the same demonizing Christians?

    How many other military objects contain a religious/mythical name or symbol?

    Isn't this the same group that commonly writes about assault weapons bans being almost entirely based upon cosmetics and not function? and laugh about the silliness of it?

    Is okay for soldiers to wear crosses? Or does that cross the line of having crusaders? Is paying them with money that contains the word "god" okay?

    And finally, the verses I've seen associated with this are very heavy on light this and light that... I wouldn't see many people here being worked up so much if something equivalent from some Buddhist/Islamic text was referenced. The scope provides light, and, ohhh..."hey that's clever".
    I always thought the stealth fighter should've had a name somehow related to the one hand clapping thing.

    Making what in your opinion is a "false claim", and how you find that insulting... and finishing your condemnation of that opinion with "mystical sky wizard"?

    I thought guns were invented by man to control man, because I happen to believe that should I then condem all guns?
    Well said and a big +1!

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    All I can say is God gave us free will.Do with as you wish.Right now we have potential gun bans we need to fight and that will take all of us.

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    Regular Member killchain's Avatar
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    Whatever. Screw it.

    Don't believe in Jesus openly because we told you so.

    You sound like the romans.
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." -John Stuart Mill

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    Okay Deros - now we are talking turkey. I respect your choices around religion and business - it's a free country - do what works for you. We disagree on our religious choices - it's a free country.

    However we agree on fighting close minded, arrogant, constitution bashing politicians (whatever their religious orientation) who infringe on our 2A rights.

    What's that? My extra magazine? Oh - those are my silver bullets - for werewolves. You believe in those don't you?





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    There is a reason I don't go to church anymore.... all that control, I just hated it. All those people that went to church and then went home and sinned, double standards.

    I do have a close family friend that knew me from when I was a tiny little rodent, and watched me grow up, and even thought I wasn't going to make it once. He's a christian missionary, but he doesn't force religion into others. Sometimes when he writes christmas cards and stuff, talking about there is a god in me, and that I am a good person and all, I actually start to believe in it. The "divine plan". It's the way you present it, if you want people to respect your bible, then respect their choice to not read it. Show respect, get respect. We probably won't respect so much that we will read it, but we won't trash on it in front of you . And when I say "we" I don't mean everybody, I mean normal, sane, reasonable humans.

    What I am trying to say is, if you want to believe in the bible, ok, don't come at me with it, if I want to hate religion, I won't spit it at your face.

    Can't we all just load our guns and get along?




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    Regular Member killchain's Avatar
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    Don't buy an ACOG then.

    More for me. Maybe the price will go down.
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." -John Stuart Mill

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    We should all have the extra mags with silver bullets ......ya never know.One thing OI know we are all about is the Constitution of the United States .I mentioned in another thread I saw on this mornings new where the police and military in Haite are forcibly disarming the populace. Practice perhaps? But we all, and I mean all that call ourselves Americans best stop nit picking and get our sierra hotel india tango together before even our rights to argue about this stuff dissapears.I want to go to Olympia and get our 2 cents in on this ban.That could be one place to start.I have seen some very good letters and responses posted.Also excellent.I am hoping the defeat of the dems in Mass. is a wake up for even local politicians that want to get in our face and dictate to us what our rights should be per their agenda.The Constitution outlind rights that we already have, not rights they can bestow or take away.

    Soemthing else I mentioned before .A clip was shown yesterday on Glen Beck I believe,a reporter asked Rahm Emanuel what he thought of the first ammendment.He said...."I think it's over rated"

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