can I carry at these two places?

CV67PAT wrote:

Outdoorsman wrote:

Yep, their rule is no firearms, period! Regardless of CC or OC. How you proceed is up to you.

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Could you please cite a law that would be violated if a person did OC/CC in either location?

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If you were to be forced to defend yourself in such a place:

By tresspassing you are in the act of committing a crime, therefore...

780.972 Use of deadly force by individual not engaged in commission of crime; conditions.

Sec. 2.

(1) An individual who has not or is not engaged in the commission of a crime at the time he or she uses deadly force may use deadly force against another individual anywhere he or she has the legal right to be with no duty to retreat if either of the following applies:

(a) The individual honestly and reasonably believes that the use of deadly force is necessary to prevent the imminent death of or imminent great bodily harm to himself or herself or to another individual.

(b) The individual honestly and reasonably believes that the use of deadly force is necessary to prevent the imminent sexual assault of himself or herself or of another individual.

(2) An individual who has not or is not engaged in the commission of a crime at the time he or she uses force other than deadly force may use force other than deadly force against another individual anywhere he or she has the legal right to be with no duty to retreat if he or she honestly and reasonably believes that the use of that force is necessary to defend himself or herself or another individual from the imminent unlawful use of force by another individual.

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From the trespass cite please quote the crime being committed that precludes the use of deadly force.

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CV67PAT wrote:

Where's the violation?

750.552 Trespass upon lands or premises of another; penalty.
Sec. 552.
Any person who shall wilfully enter, upon the lands or premises of another without lawful authority, after having been forbidden so to do by the owner or occupant, agent or servant of the owner or occupant, or any person being upon the land or premises of another, upon being notified to depart therefrom by the owner or occupant, the agent or servant of either, who without lawful authority neglects or refuses to depart therefrom, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction thereof shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for not more than 30 days or by a fine of not more than $50.00, or both, in the discretion of the court.

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The sign is the owner forbidding your entrance while armed.

This can be debated, and it is a given that charges merely for tresspassing are unlikely unless you refuse a verbal command due to no legislation specific to obediance of such signs.

I would caution to put this to the Kim Worthy test though. Especially if you were forced to defend yourself.

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JeffSayers wrote:

CV67PAT wrote:

Where's the violation?

750.552 Trespass upon lands or premises of another; penalty.
Sec. 552.
Any person who shall wilfully enter, upon the lands or premises of another without lawful authority, after having been forbidden so to do by the owner or occupant, agent or servant of the owner or occupant, or any person being upon the land or premises of another, upon being notified to depart therefrom by the owner or occupant, the agent or servant of either, who without lawful authority neglects or refuses to depart therefrom, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction thereof shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for not more than 30 days or by a fine of not more than $50.00, or both, in the discretion of the court.

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The sign is the owner forbidding your entrance while armed.

This can be debated, and it is a given that charges merely for tresspassing are unlikely unless you refuse a verbal command due to no legislation specific to obediance of such signs.

I would caution to put this to the Kim Worthy test though. Especially if you were forced to defend yourself.

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Is there specific signage requirements in the trespass laws? Could you cite that?

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CV67PAT wrote:

JeffSayers wrote:

CV67PAT wrote:

Where's the violation?

750.552 Trespass upon lands or premises of another; penalty.
Sec. 552.
Any person who shall wilfully enter, upon the lands or premises of another without lawful authority, after having been forbidden so to do by the owner or occupant, agent or servant of the owner or occupant, or any person being upon the land or premises of another, upon being notified to depart therefrom by the owner or occupant, the agent or servant of either, who without lawful authority neglects or refuses to depart therefrom, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction thereof shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for not more than 30 days or by a fine of not more than $50.00, or both, in the discretion of the court.

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The sign is the owner forbidding your entrance while armed.

This can be debated, and it is a given that charges merely for tresspassing are unlikely unless you refuse a verbal command due to no legislation specific to obediance of such signs.

I would caution to put this to the Kim Worthy test though. Especially if you were forced to defend yourself.

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Is there specific signage requirements in the trespass laws? Could you cite that?

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No, there's not. There's also no case law supporting or denying that a sign serves as lawful notice. However, this does not matter. A lawyer would simply need to prove that you should have reasonably known (or did know, as you do, this forum proves that) that you could not be in the location while armed.

It's a case-by-case thing. You willing to take the chance?

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[Yes, as I've been advised by competent counsel that to do so is not in and of itself a crime UNTIL you are ORDERED to leave. And he is not only prepared to defend me, he is absolutely confident of acquittal.

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zigziggityzoo wrote:

It's a case-by-case thing. You willing to take the chance?

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Yes, as I've been advised by competent counsel that to do so is not in and of itself a crime UNTIL you are ORDERED to leave. And he is not only prepared to defend me, he is absolutely confident of acquittal.

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