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Why do you guys leave an empty magazine in during UOC

Michigander

Michigander

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Aug 24, 2007
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Mulligan's Valley
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The only time I have had to carry a gun like this was before I got my CPL in Michigan, and I was walking around state parks, where loaded OC outside from hunting was not something I could do.

I carried my Sig racked back, with no magazine. This is the fastest way to load it from a draw. If Michigan was also stupid enough to disregard the constitution as far as California has, it would also facilitate a 12031 check with no drawing required.

I am a firm believer in carrying this way when it has to be unloaded. Someones impressions of whether or not it's loaded don't mean much to me next to the ability to draw and have an aimed shot off in under a second.
 
Ranchero

Ranchero

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Hey crash5150, Are you an undercover cop? Or a real open carrier? All open carriers follow the law. We don't like it but unloaded magazine for now.
 
C

CA_Libertarian

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Stanislaus County, California, USA
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Mike In Reno wrote:
by the time it would take most to load, you would be dead....
Click to expand...
If you assume it's a fair fight, yes. But as my dad always said, "if you find yourself in a fair fight, your strategy sucks."

The fact is that in many situations we will have some advance warning, and will load up from the safety of cover before engaging a target.

Obviously our legislature is putting us at a strategic disadvantage here... so UOC is the best we have... for now.
 
M

Mike In Reno

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sorry for the bashing, its not my intention, but it just pisses me off on how they can do that to law abiding citizens, and the other crazy laws they passed like the ammo fingerprint deal, just absolute BS, thats why i left CA, got sick of the libs with their garbage, and had enough of the bay area (east oakland). some one needs to take the trash out!
 
T

Theseus

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Lamma Island, HK
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MudCamper wrote:
Mike In Reno wrote:
some one needs to take the trash out!
Click to expand...
That would be us, the ones that stayed here to fight for our rights.

I REALLY hate California bashing.
Click to expand...
Mud. . . before I leave California I want to share a bottle of Jack Daniels with you. You up for it?
 
MudCamper

MudCamper

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Theseus wrote:
Mud. . . before I leave California I want to share a bottle of Jack Daniels with you. You up for it?
Click to expand...
A whole bottle? I hope you don't mean all at once.

OK, Theseus, in your case I can understand if you are leaving. You will be regaining your 2A rights that you don't have here. And nobody can argue that you haven't fought the good fight more than almost anyone else.
 
C

CA_Libertarian

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MudCamper wrote:
OK, Theseus, in your case I can understand if you are leaving. You will be regaining your 2A rights that you don't have here. And nobody can argue that you haven't fought the good fight more than almost anyone else.
Click to expand...
But see, this is how I view my leaving CA. Of course Theseus has a more complete deprivation of his rights, but my goal in leaving CA is the same!

I just want to have the ability to defend myself 24/7. In CA, it's pretty much only when I'm at home.

Most of us are de facto "prohibited persons"the majority of each day!

www.freestateproject.org

Live Free or Die.
 
MudCamper

MudCamper

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CA_Libertarian wrote:
MudCamper wrote:
OK, Theseus, in your case I can understand if you are leaving. You will be regaining your 2A rights that you don't have here. And nobody can argue that you haven't fought the good fight more than almost anyone else.
Click to expand...
But see, this is how I view my leaving CA. Of course Theseus has a more complete deprivation of his rights, but my goal in leaving CA is the same!

I just want to have the ability to defend myself 24/7. In CA, it's pretty much only when I'm at home.

Most of us are de facto "prohibited persons"the majority of each day!

http://www.freestateproject.org

Live Free or Die.
Click to expand...
OK, again, my apologies to you, and anybody else who is moving out of California. But just do me one favor please. Once you've left, don't go around insulting California and Californians because, as you know full well, there are many pro-gun, pro-liberty people still here. In fact, there are more here than there are in most other states. We just don't have the majority in a state of 40 million.
 
demnogis

demnogis

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Orange County, California, USA
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MudCamper, I have just recently accepted the fact thhat if I want to start a business and actually get by (or god forbid, make money) I cannot do it in this state.

End result? I'll be moving to AZ. Will I bash CA? No more than I am now while living here. Its almost to the point where the only form of recourse is to shed off the restraints of the tyrannical gov here and rebuild a system of governance that abides by the constitution and serves the people, not itself.

MudCamper wrote:
CA_Libertarian wrote:
MudCamper wrote:
OK, Theseus, in your case I can understand if you are leaving. You will be regaining your 2A rights that you don't have here. And nobody can argue that you haven't fought the good fight more than almost anyone else.
Click to expand...
But see, this is how I view my leaving CA. Of course Theseus has a more complete deprivation of his rights, but my goal in leaving CA is the same!

I just want to have the ability to defend myself 24/7. In CA, it's pretty much only when I'm at home.

Most of us are de facto "prohibited persons" the majority of each day!

http://www.freestateproject.org

Live Free or Die.
Click to expand...
OK, again, my apologies to you, and anybody else who is moving out of California. But just do me one favor please. Once you've left, don't go around insulting California and Californians because, as you know full well, there are many pro-gun, pro-liberty people still here. In fact, there are more here than there are in most other states. We just don't have the majority in a state of 40 million.
Click to expand...
 
bigtoe416

bigtoe416

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Wow, you too demnogis? I've always figured CA_Libertarian would eventually fulfill his goal of getting to NH. I can understand Theseus leaving after how the state has treated him. I'm just surprised to see another member taking steps to leave.

It's sad when our state punishes the law abiding citizens who want to stick around and make an honest living.
 
demnogis

demnogis

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It is mostly due to the amount of control, regulation and exploitive taxes that small businesses face. Look into CARB, AB 32 and new taxtaxtax proposals and its ridiculous. I cant get any funding due to the high costs to own/operate here, so my choices were AZ, NM, NV, or CO.

I haven't left yet and don't expect me to forsake my fellow freedom lovers in this state.

bigtoe416 wrote:
Wow, you too demnogis? I've always figured CA_Libertarian would eventually fulfill his goal of getting to NH. I can understand Theseus leaving after how the state has treated him. I'm just surprised to see another member taking steps to leave.

It's sad when our state punishes the law abiding citizens who want to stick around and make an honest living.
Click to expand...
 
MudCamper

MudCamper

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demnogis wrote:
It is mostly due to the amount of control, regulation and exploitive taxes that small businesses face. Look into CARB, AB 32 and new taxtaxtax proposals and its ridiculous. I cant get any funding due to the high costs to own/operate here, so my choices were AZ, NM, NV, or CO.

I haven't left yet and don't expect me to forsake my fellow freedom lovers in this state.
Click to expand...
Yeah. I've got friends in the truck parts business and construction business. The CARB crap is going to result in only 2 types of construction business left in CA. 1 - The one man shop run underground as cash only, and 2 - The HUGE corporate entities that can afford to spend tens of millions upgrading equipment. And the end result will be EVERYTHING in CA will become more expensive.
 
Superlite27

Superlite27

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God's Country, Missouri
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Hayashi Killian wrote:
Or as a safer practice maneuver, load all but the last 1 or 2 rounds with live ammo and fill the last 1 or 2 with snap caps.
Click to expand...

How, exactly, is mixing live bullets that will put a hole in your head with dummy rounds that go "click" into a device (a magazine) that you insert into a firearm (BANG...you're dead) a "safer paractice maneuver"?

Is the live ammo inside the magazine part of the safety? If so, I'd hate to see the ammo you think is unsafe. Those "safety live rounds" mixed in with thesafety practice rounds don't appear to fit my definition of safety.

I do use snap caps for trigger pull conditioning (very effective with a laser) and dry firing, but I usually keep them seperate from the stuff that will kill my neighbors through their kitchen window while I'm "practicing".

Unless I'm missing something obvious that makes mixing rounds that will kill you with ones that go "click" something considered "safe".

Please enlighten me. I'm always willing to learn.
 
H

Hayashi Killian

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Jun 25, 2009
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San Diego, California, USA
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Because if you practice reloading drills with live rounds, you are setting yourself up for a negligent discharge. Replacing the last round or two in a magazine with a dummy round means you can practice with the full weight of an almost-live magazine without the chance of a ND (provided you make sure everything's square before you run the drill).

The whole goal of practicing with loaded magazines is to build muscle memory. If you get used to popping in empty mags, when the time comes in to load a loaded magazine, the weight will throw you off in regards to whether or not the magazine is seated & secured.
 
MudCamper

MudCamper

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Hayashi Killian wrote:
Because if you practice reloading drills with live rounds, you are setting yourself up for a negligent discharge. Replacing the last round or two in a magazine with a dummy round means you can practice with the full weight of an almost-live magazine without the chance of a ND (provided you make sure everything's square before you run the drill).

The whole goal of practicing with loaded magazines is to build muscle memory. If you get used to popping in empty mags, when the time comes in to load a loaded magazine, the weight will throw you off in regards to whether or not the magazine is seated & secured.
Click to expand...
This sounds like a real recipe for disaster to me. You may at some point get a real round confused with a snap cap. Obviously that's very bad.

I hope at least that you are only doing this risky practice at a range so that when you do get them mixed up you can AD downrange.
 
C

CA_Libertarian

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If you're worried you can't keep your drill safe using 1-2 snap caps in the top of your mag, then find another way to simulate the weight of a magazine. Maybe gut a mag, and then take some weights inside. But I'd even go as far as trying to make it balanced like a full mag (if your sim mag is bottom/top-heavy, it may create bad muscle memory).

Going to the range is not an option for many of us who wish to drill every day.
 
marshaul

marshaul

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Aug 13, 2007
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Fairfax County, Virginia
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bigtoe416 wrote:
It's sad when our state punishes the law abiding citizens who want to stick around and make an honest living.
Click to expand...
Accuracy requires stronger language, I'm afraid.

So, I'm going to have to cancel out the +1 with a -1, leaving you with a net of 0. :?
 
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