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  1. #1
    Regular Member WARCHILD's Avatar
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    I have contacted Brian and withdrew my resignation, if he will accept it. For as much as he has supported me with the talk show and his exhaustive work for MOC; I must remain and support him in any way I can.
    I do not have the right to take out my frustrations of a few, against the group as a whole and for that I apologize.

    Kimberguy’s actions had no effect on my actions at all. That was in no way a factor in my prior decision.

    What is a factor, has been the targeted attacks on most of my posts for over a month. It makes it apparent that I have nothing to contribute to posts on this site other than flame fodder and personal attacks; So, I won’t bother to make any more since I have nothing viable to contribute to the forum.
    I will however do the best I can to support Brian and MOC as a whole, from the back of the bus so to speak.
    As for OCDO/MI forum, the only posts I may make will be dates and times for the talk show.

    I would assume by the tolerance of the forum to allow the personal attacks and sarcasms I’ve seen increasing over the last year; This must be the new acceptance and toleration to belong to the group. This was part of the reasoning I ranted on again about respect, and even that was flamed back at me. Well so be it, I have enjoyed meeting those of you at events and appreciate you input I wish you all well but the direction this forum is going it will be a bumpy ride for as long as it lasts.

    Be Well

  2. #2
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    I hoped you would stay on with MOC!! And if you ever have the need to talk or want to discuss OC feel free to PM me. I am sure that many others feel the same as most of us appreciate your hard work and contributions here and elsewhere.

    Talk to you on Sat.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  3. #3
    Regular Member Taurus850CIA's Avatar
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    I'm sorry it's come to this. I'm still holding out hope that you will reconsider, sooner or later. I appreciate your input here. Don't be a stranger.
    "Fault always lies in the same place, my fine babies: with him weak enough to lay blame." - Cort

    Gun control is like trying to reduce Drunk Driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.

    Sentio aliquos togatos contra me conspirare.

    The answer to "1984" is "
    1776"

    With freedom comes much responsibility. It is for this reason so many are loathe to exercise it.

  4. #4
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    WARCHILD wrote:

    What is a factor, has been the targeted attacks on most of my posts for over a month. It makes it apparent that I have nothing to contribute to posts on this site other than flame fodder and personal attacks; So, I won’t bother to make any more since I have nothing viable to contribute to the forum.


    i have felt the same way

  5. #5
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    WARCHILD wrote:
    ...

    What is a factor, has been the targeted attacks on most of my posts for over a month. It makes it apparent that I have nothing to contribute to posts on this site other than flame fodder and personal attacks; So, I won’t bother to make any more since I have nothing viable to contribute to the forum.
    ...

    I would assume by the tolerance of the forum to allow the personal attacks and sarcasms I’ve seen increasing over the last year; This must be the new acceptance and toleration to belong to the group. This was part of the reasoning I ranted on again about respect, and even that was flamed back at me. ..

    Be Well
    I've noticed the same thing. It seems to have transferred over here from another site as it is much more characteristic of that site than this one. I suppose one could say that's a result of mixing fresh water with salt water. It all becomes salty.

    The level of childishness on this site has IMHO brought it down and put a stain on the movement as a whole. Personally, I usually stay away from threads like that for the most part.

    I probably shouldn't say it, but I'm going to anyway. "The actions of one or some on this site are starting to glaringly parallel those of someone else on another site." Different vein, same strain.

    Just remember people; "Trashy people (only trashy people), talk trash."


  6. #6
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    WARCHILD wrote:
    I have contacted Brian and withdrew my resignation, if he will accept it. For as much as he has supported me with the talk show and his exhaustive work for MOC; I must remain and support him in any way I can.
    I do not have the right to take out my frustrations of a few, against the group as a whole and for that I apologize. *
    *
    Kimberguy’s actions had no effect on my actions at all. That was in no way a factor in my prior decision.
    *
    What is a factor, has been the targeted attacks on most of my posts for over a month. It makes it apparent that I have nothing to contribute to posts on this site other than flame fodder and personal attacks; So, I won’t bother to make any more since I have nothing viable to contribute to the forum.
    I will however do the best I can to support Brian and MOC as a whole, from the back of the bus so to speak.
    As for OCDO/MI forum, the only posts I may make will be dates and times for the talk show. **
    *
    I would assume by the tolerance of the forum to allow the personal attacks and sarcasms I’ve seen increasing over the last year; This must be the new acceptance and toleration to belong to the group. This was part of the reasoning I ranted on again about respect, and even that was flamed back at me. Well so be it, I have enjoyed meeting those of you at events and appreciate you input I wish you all well but the direction this forum is going it will be a bumpy ride for as long as it lasts.
    *
    Be Well
    hey brah

    i haven't been here long and i haven't dished out the cash for my membership yet and don't know the inner workings but.....

    screw them and the computer they sit at.
    its the Internet!
    everybody is a bad ass know it all behind a keyboard at home but action talks and ******** sets at home in their contaminated gene pool.

    brother everyone of you that has set aside the time and trouble for this cause are the BLEACH to combat all the know it all, bad ass, Internet retards.

    you don't know me from adam but you being a seasoned supporter of this cause i would hope that you give yourself some time to relax, give it a bit and see where you are after.

    anyway my .02

  7. #7
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    While I can't speak for Warchild I can speak for myself...

    I have been extremely disturbed by the direction OC in general has been going lately. The "in your face it's my RIGHT!" attitude of some just isn't conducive to effecting positive change.

    YES! IT IS YOUR (AND MY) RIGHT! And that covers sidearms and long guns.

    However... some thought must be given as to what purpose this group is hoping to achieve. As far as I understand it, the purpose of OC.org, and MOC, is to educate and desensitize the public concerning the rightful and lawful carry of firearms. If that is the purpose then the efforts of those who say they are in support of that should (my opinion) direct their efforts to discovering what the most effective means of educating the public are... and pursuing those means.

    And I can tell everyone right now... scaring the crap out of the public with carrying a long arm into a restaurant during a time in history when uninformed about guns and rights citizens are afraid of terrorism... just isn't going to further those goals of educating and desensitizing.

    Do we have the RIGHT! to carry a long gun to a restaurant? Of course! The question that folks need to ask themselves though is:

    Will carrying a sidearm or long arm in this situation help the cause of freedom? Or am I doing it just because I can and screw anyone who doesn't like it?

    Edited to add:

    And please remember... this forum is being watched by a whole bunch more folks than just interested citizens.... it would behoove us to keep that in mind when posting.

    Now... directly to Warchild....

    You have my respect Sir!
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  8. #8
    Regular Member EM87's Avatar
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    I never met you, WARCHILD, but I have read most of what you have posted over the past six months or so since I joined the forum. I am sad to see you go, but I see why you're doing it. I wish you the best and hope to see you back someday when people decide to be more mature.

    Carry on.

    Matt
    "You'll be walking along.. OC.. and you'll feel GREAT. You'll feel FREEEEE like 1776 kind of Free." -cscitney87

  9. #9
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    Bikenut wrote:
    While I can't speak for Warchild I can speak for myself...

    I have been extremely disturbed by the direction OC in general has been going lately. The "in your face it's my RIGHT!" attitude of some just isn't conducive to effecting positive change.

    YES! IT IS YOUR (AND MY) RIGHT! And that covers sidearms and long guns.

    However... some thought must be given as to what purpose this group is hoping to achieve. As far as I understand it, the purpose of OC.org, and MOC, is to educate and desensitize the public concerning the rightful and lawful carry of firearms. If that is the purpose then the efforts of those who say they are in support of that should (my opinion) direct their efforts to discovering what the most effective means of educating the public are... and pursuing those means.

    And I can tell everyone right now... scaring the crap out of the public with carrying a long arm into a restaurant during a time in history when uninformed about guns and rights citizens are afraid of terrorism... just isn't going to further those goals of educating and desensitizing.

    Do we have the RIGHT! to carry a long gun to a restaurant? Of course! The question that folks need to ask themselves though is:

    Will carrying a sidearm or long arm in this situation help the cause of freedom? Or am I doing it just because I can and screw anyone who doesn't like it?

    Edited to add:

    And please remember... this forum is being watched by a whole bunch more folks than just interested citizens.... it would behoove us to keep that in mind when posting.

    Now... directly to Warchild....

    You have my respect Sir!
    I felt this post was quite insulting!
    I feel you make these statements based on ignorance. Were you at BC & Lansing? Who are you to tell us how the public percived us. Looks like you're talking about your own personal misconseptions of what is taking place. I dont recall you being there so where us your perceptions coming from????

    As to us scaring anyone I say thats a lie based on me physically being present & seeing real reactions! Overall people supported what we were doing. I didnt see anyone even get upset.

    If I felt like what we was doing was negative I'd be the first person to tell everyone! After being present at these events this is just not the case. As for the LEOs I dont live my life beholdent to their opinions. I do everthing possible to be 100% lawful and thanks to sone great friends on here I've been able to do so. Its not easy with these confusing firearms laws.

    Mike

  10. #10
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    Im relitively new here, but from what Ive seen, Warchild, you are an asset to MOC as a whole. I too have been personally attacked here, and it has affected my opinions and motivations. After getting screwed in court, and then getting called all but a liar by those supposed to be on my side, it makes it difficult to move forward. Im not one to quit however, live and learn, and move on. I sincerely hope that you feel the same way.

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    stainless1911 wrote:
    Im relitively new here, but from what Ive seen, Warchild, you are an asset to MOC as a whole. I too have been personally attacked here, and it has affected my opinions and motivations. After getting screwed in court, and then getting called all but a liar by those supposed to be on my side, it makes it difficult to move forward. Im not one to quit however, live and learn, and move on. I sincerely hope that you feel the same way.
    If my proposal is adopted by MOC Inc I feel we can resolve this problem. The personal attacks can be stopped easily and we could bring some order from chaos posting. I truely hope to bring some positive news from this weekend.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    mikestilly wrote:
    Bikenut wrote:
    While I can't speak for Warchild I can speak for myself...

    I have been extremely disturbed by the direction OC in general has been going lately. The "in your face it's my RIGHT!" attitude of some just isn't conducive to effecting positive change.

    YES! IT IS YOUR (AND MY) RIGHT! And that covers sidearms and long guns.

    However... some thought must be given as to what purpose this group is hoping to achieve. As far as I understand it, the purpose of OC.org, and MOC, is to educate and desensitize the public concerning the rightful and lawful carry of firearms. If that is the purpose then the efforts of those who say they are in support of that should (my opinion) direct their efforts to discovering what the most effective means of educating the public are... and pursuing those means.

    And I can tell everyone right now... scaring the crap out of the public with carrying a long arm into a restaurant during a time in history when uninformed about guns and rights citizens are afraid of terrorism... just isn't going to further those goals of educating and desensitizing.

    Do we have the RIGHT! to carry a long gun to a restaurant? Of course! The question that folks need to ask themselves though is:

    Will carrying a sidearm or long arm in this situation help the cause of freedom? Or am I doing it just because I can and screw anyone who doesn't like it?

    Edited to add:

    And please remember... this forum is being watched by a whole bunch more folks than just interested citizens.... it would behoove us to keep that in mind when posting.

    Now... directly to Warchild....

    You have my respect Sir!
    I felt this post was quite insulting!
    I feel you make these statements based on ignorance. Were you at BC & Lansing? Who are you to tell us how the public percived us. Looks like you're talking about your own personal misconseptions of what is taking place. I dont recall you being there so where us your perceptions coming from????

    As to us scaring anyone I say thats a lie based on me physically being present & seeing real reactions! Overall people supported what we were doing. I didnt see anyone even get upset.

    If I felt like what we was doing was negative I'd be the first person to tell everyone! After being present at these events this is just not the case. As for the LEOs I dont live my life beholdent to their opinions. I do everthing possible to be 100% lawful and thanks to sone great friends on here I've been able to do so. Its not easy with these confusing firearms laws.

    Mike
    Mike.. I was speaking in general terms and not specifically the Lansing incident using the general reference of a "restaurant" because it is so fresh in everyone's minds. If that isn't clear in my post I apologize for being unclear.

    However, I don't have to be at the scene of an incident to extrapolate the possible impact of that scene.

    Tell me please... exactly what impression do you think the patrons of the Lansing Ponderosa took home with them? A positive one? Do you think any of them even knew what happened? Or what rights were involved?

    Who is the OC movement about? You? Me? The police? The public? Sidearms? Long guns? Rights?

    Or is the movement really about educating all of the above about all those things?

    I know who I'm trying to reach when I OC. And I know what message I am trying to get across. And it isn't about me and my rights. It is about informing the public that everyone has the same rights.

    By the way... there are plenty of postings that I find insulting... but rather than get my pride all up in a bunch I prefer to address the topic of discussion.

    Of course this is a free country...
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  13. #13
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    I agree in BC we were getting horn honks thumbs up and people hanging out of their cars to tell us they supported us! And it wasn't just a few either!

    I was not in Lansing but I don't imagine it was much different.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

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    i'm currently at work. when i arrive at home Id be happy to continue to discuss it further.

    Mike

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    Hey Warchild, we haven't met i quite a while, i am concerned that there are issues of disharmony on this site as well, and i am sorry that individuals unknown to me are causing you problems, As you area Senior member, maybe we myself included get the broom out and sweep the trolls and the nons out of hear ?

    Feel free to pm me as i am having personal issues also ! we can talk more then.

    Sincerely Steven J. Koch


    A nobody from Battle Creek Mi.

    ************************************************** ****************

    Well it is time for me to part ways,

    I have done what i can do, and others want to push this further to the next level, i do not believe that the public is going to be receptive to this next push,andi guess my involvement is over, and i shall continue to stand my ground, and fight the good fight in battle creek .

    To all of you out there, be safe,smart, and always righteous.....................

  16. #16
    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Glad you'll remain contributing, Jerry. Still hope to see some posts from you. Be well.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

  17. #17
    Regular Member JeffSayers's Avatar
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    WHAT THE HELL IS THIS ****?

    A house divided cannot stand. I either missed the attacks made against Warchild here or they went over my simple head. What I do know though is this is BS. We are a damn team here people. Each and every one of us needs to recognize the valuewe allbring to table here or we are doomed right now. Sell your guns and fall down on your knees and worship Obama type doomed.

    The writting is on the wall, will you erase it or add to it?
    United we STAND!

  18. #18
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    JeffSayers wrote:
    WHAT THE HELL IS THIS @#$%?

    A house divided cannot stand. I either missed the attacks made against Warchild here or they went over my simple head. What I do know though is this is BS. We are a damn team here people. Each and every one of us needs to recognize the valuewe allbring to table here or we are doomed right now. Sell your guns and fall down on your knees and worship Obama type doomed.

    The writting is on the wall, will you erase it or add to it?
    Well said Sir!

    Will we work together to achieve the common goal? Or not?
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  19. #19
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    Bikenut wrote:
    Mike.. I was speaking in general terms and not specifically the Lansing incident using the general reference of a "restaurant" because it is so fresh in everyone's minds. If that isn't clear in my post I apologize for being unclear.

    However, I don't have to be at the scene of an incident to extrapolate the possible impact of that scene.

    Tell me please... exactly what impression do you think the patrons of the Lansing Ponderosa took home with them? A positive one? Do you think any of them even knew what happened? Or what rights were involved?

    Who is the OC movement about? You? Me? The police? The public? Sidearms? Long guns? Rights?

    Or is the movement really about educating all of the above about all those things?

    I know who I'm trying to reach when I OC. And I know what message I am trying to get across. And it isn't about me and my rights. It is about informing the public that everyone has the same rights.

    By the way... there are plenty of postings that I find insulting... but rather than get my pride all up in a bunch I prefer to address the topic of discussion.

    Of course this is a free country...
    Mike's post was in response to your comment about the AR. You've been saying that the issue is the AR, but the reality is that that just isn't so. It wasn't about the AR. What happened in Lansing was the result of a Manager who most likely was using his position to try to cause trouble for the group. The police hardly acknowledged the AR, and the public in general had quite the positive response to it. Chris was standing on the corner with only one other person when people drove by honking and waving in support. If anything, it was just the opposite of what you seem to imagine happened. I find it quite fascinating that you continue to insist that the rifle was a problem when it's obvious (especially to everyone who was there) that the rifle was not the problem. If any guns were a problem at those events, then it was "any" guns, and the rifle is now being used as an excuse.

    Why is it you are so persistent in not accepting that the AR was not a problem?



  20. #20
    Regular Member lil_freak_66's Avatar
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    warchild,i was glad to have met you at the owosso lunch back in december.

    i agree with you,the personal attacks and such have become out of control.



    now onto my views on long arms at OC events


    i see no problems with long arm OC,however i feel that there are appropriate and not appropriate times to do it at events,on a case by case basis,depending on the situation.


    not a lawyer, dont take anything i say as legal advice.


  21. #21
    Regular Member tygereye's Avatar
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    JeffSayers wrote:
    WHAT THE HELL IS THIS @#$%?

    A house divided cannot stand. I either missed the attacks made against Warchild here or they went over my simple head. What I do know though is this is BS. We are a damn team here people. Each and every one of us needs to recognize the valuewe allbring to table here or we are doomed right now. Sell your guns and fall down on your knees and worship Obama type doomed.

    The writting is on the wall, will you erase it or add to it?
    + 1000!

    I to have noticed a change in the posting of this site, and do not post very often anymore either. I hope this changes in the near future, as we will not succeed if we are not together.

    I hope Warchild, that you will eventually post some more, as you have some very wise advice, and great knowledge of the cause.

  22. #22
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    tygereye wrote:
    I hope Warchild, that you will eventually post some more, as you have some very wise advice, and great knowledge of the cause.
    I hope so as well. i have only had the honor of meeting with you once in person but have been following your post ever since i joined this forum. you are one of the minds that keep me on this forum. i hope to see you in the future.

    Devery

  23. #23
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    ghostrider wrote:
    Bikenut wrote:
    Mike.. I was speaking in general terms and not specifically the Lansing incident using the general reference of a "restaurant" because it is so fresh in everyone's minds. If that isn't clear in my post I apologize for being unclear.

    However, I don't have to be at the scene of an incident to extrapolate the possible impact of that scene.

    Tell me please... exactly what impression do you think the patrons of the Lansing Ponderosa took home with them? A positive one? Do you think any of them even knew what happened? Or what rights were involved?

    Who is the OC movement about? You? Me? The police? The public? Sidearms? Long guns? Rights?

    Or is the movement really about educating all of the above about all those things?

    I know who I'm trying to reach when I OC. And I know what message I am trying to get across. And it isn't about me and my rights. It is about informing the public that everyone has the same rights.

    By the way... there are plenty of postings that I find insulting... but rather than get my pride all up in a bunch I prefer to address the topic of discussion.

    Of course this is a free country...
    Mike's post was in response to your comment about the AR. You've been saying that the issue is the AR, but the reality is that that just isn't so. It wasn't about the AR. What happened in Lansing was the result of a Manager who most likely was using his position to try to cause trouble for the group. The police hardly acknowledged the AR, and the public in general had quite the positive response to it. Chris was standing on the corner with only one other person when people drove by honking and waving in support. If anything, it was just the opposite of what you seem to imagine happened. I find it quite fascinating that you continue to insist that the rifle was a problem when it's obvious (especially to everyone who was there) that the rifle was not the problem. If any guns were a problem at those events, then it was "any" guns, and the rifle is now being used as an excuse.

    Why is it you are so persistent in not accepting that the AR was not a problem?

    Funny... I never mentioned an AR...until just now... I spoke about long guns.. and, until Mike's post, I didn't even specify the Lansing incident.

    Interesting how it is so easy to read into a post what one wants to see.

    I did point out that if the purpose of MOC and OC in general is to educate and desensitize the public then some thought is needed before deciding to carry a long gun, or even a side arm, into where ever one wishes. Thought geared more to whether or not the goal of making OC (of anything legal eventually) will be advanced... or harmed.

    Just because I am advocating spending some time thinking before engaging in what is perfectly legal and perfectly within our (did anyone notice I said our?) rights as to how that action may affect the overall goal some folks seem to think I'm some kind of anti rights fool.... and I fully understand Warchild's frustration with posting in the forum.

    The point I'm trying so hard to make isn't one about whether or not Kimberguy has the right to carry an AR where ever he wishes... or any of us have that right. The point isn't even about Kimberguy... or any of us for that matter.

    The point is whether or not the things we do in the places we do them at the time they are done will further the goal of making OC accepted by the public.

    And that includes the things we do here on the forum too.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  24. #24
    Activist Member hamaneggs's Avatar
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    Everyone on this forum has their own opinions,so lets not give up on expressing our own.We must exercize our freedoms in whatever form we are able and accept that everyone does not have total wisdom and understanding.We get enough of those who do not understand their God Given rights as expressed in our founding documents,which are written for the common man to understand, as I believe it was stated by Jefferson.Never give up!A house divided cannot stand! We need everyones voice HERE!We're adults,we can handle anything! God Bless the U.S!
    Today JESUS would tell me to sell my coat and buy two Springfield XD Compact 45acp's!

    NRA LIFER,GOA,MOC Inc.,CLSD,MCRGO,UAW! MOLON LABE!!

  25. #25
    Guest

    Post imported post

    Warchild, I am sorry that you perceived my responses to you posts to be "personal" attacks. I'm sorry that they hurt you. I'm sorry that anything I could have posted on an internet forum would bother you so much that you would want to abandon your principles and convictions to the point of resigning from a position in an organization outside of this forum.

    I thought for a while that it was just me that was hard on you in response to some of the things you've posted in various threads here. It became obvious though to me that I'm not the only one though as evidenced by the direction this thread wandered off into.

    While it started praising you for your laudable undertakings, it diverted to the same type of antagonistic argument that I was supposed to be the perpetrator of.

    I would hope and pray that you can find it in your heart to return to the spirited debate that is so necessary for the evolution and growth of this fledgling group.

    Without dissenting opinion there can be no challenge to trim the excess of our wayward paths.

    I have received a few PMs from members expressing a need for me to be less "abrasive". I will make every attempt to do so, as it appears that this is the cause for your "retreat" to the sidelines of OCDO.

    Please come back to OCDO.



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