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Thread: Not Off Topic Question

  1. #1
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    With Mike saying the following...

    "Folks - as many have asked, John and I have formally updated our main page to clarify the focus of OpenCarry.org: "A pro-gun Internet community focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life."

    Long gun carry is a great topic for some folks to look into but distracts from our organizational focus here - generally in the law of carry rght now we have major restrictions on the right to open or conceal carry handguns in many states - and generally the law of long gun carry is much less restrictive - and for long guns the issue is mainly just "carry" generally, as concealed carry of long guns is not practical or in some cases possible anyway.

    Please note - NEW RULE - #11:

    11) This web site is focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life. Do not start OFF TOPIC threads or discussions such aspromoting the carry of long guns. Long guns are great! OCDO co-founders John & Mike and most of the folks on this forum own at least one long gun - but due to urban area issues of muzzle control, lack of trigger guard coverage, and the fact that the long gun carry issue distracts from our main mission to promote the open carry of handguns in daily life, we will leave long gun carry activism in the capable hands of the future founders of web sites about long gun carry."


    There are a few questions I'd like to get some clarification on. I'm acctually wondering what MOC's (members of that board) stance is on the last 2 questions. The 1st one really only pertains to OCDO.

    1) What about those of us that have long arms that technically, in the state of Michigan anyway, are considered and REGISTERED as a pistol; can we still discuss those?

    2) Are those types of "pistols" going to be prohibited at OC meets, even if it is not an official MOC event? What about long arms that are still technically long arms?

    3) If they are prohibited at events, what about if they are in a holster made for "said pistol"?

    These questions are not ment to start trouble, or point fingers. Just something that in my opinion needs some clarification going forward.

    Thank you.



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    T Vance wrote:
    With Mike saying the following...

    "Folks - as many have asked, John and I have formally updated our main page to clarify the focus of OpenCarry.org:¬* "A pro-gun Internet community focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life."

    Long gun carry is a great topic for some folks to look into but distracts from our organizational focus here - generally in the law of carry rght now we have major restrictions on the right to open or conceal carry handguns in many states - and generally the law of long gun carry is much less restrictive - and for long guns the issue is mainly just "carry" generally, as concealed carry of long guns is not practical or in some cases possible anyway.

    Please note - NEW RULE - #11:

    11) This web site is focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life. Do not start OFF TOPIC threads or discussions such as¬*promoting the carry of long guns.¬* Long guns are great! OCDO co-founders John & Mike and most of the folks on this forum own at least one long gun - but due to urban area issues of muzzle control, lack of trigger guard coverage, and the fact that the long gun carry issue distracts from our main mission to promote the open carry of handguns in daily life, we will leave long gun carry activism in the capable hands of the future founders of web sites about long gun carry."


    There are a few questions I'd like to get some clarification on.

    1) What about those of us that have long arms that technically, in the state of Michigan anyway, are considered and REGISTERED as a pistol; can we still discuss those?
    I say yes.

    2) Are those types of "pistols" going to be prohibited at OC meets, even if it is not an official MOC event?
    To hell with OCDO's rules on events. They only effect the forum itself.

    3) If they are prohibited at events, what about if they are in a holster made for "said pistol"?

    These questions are not ment to start trouble, or point fingers. Just something that in my opinion needs some clarification going forward.

    Thank you.

    ¬*
    hope this helps.

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    I'm acctually wondering what MOC's (members of that board) stance is on the last 2 questions. The 1st one really only pertains to OCDO.

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    What difference does it make? OCDO is not affiliated with MOC. Individuals acting as though OCDO or MCO has any governing over there personal right to OC whatever they wish cannot be controlled anywhere other then this forum. As has been stated. OCDO does not wish to have any active particpation with anyone OCing a long gun nor do they wish to discuss the matter on this handgun OC forum. The question is wether MOC.INC wishes to follow the same guidelines. Regardless of our individual right. From what I gather not many people agree that it is a practical idea to OC a long gun. However it is your right. OCing of long guns at official MOC events will probably be nixed in the very near future by MOC.INC. Wether or not you agree with this even though its your constitutional right is for you to decide. I and others am having a really hard to deciphering how you can say, well OC a handgun is OK but a AR is not? I am sure if it was a double barrel shotgun or lever action this would not even be a discussion. OCDO or MOC can take any stand it wishes in regards to OC LG or NOT. However the individual right remains. If people decide to show up at OC events OCing an LG what is MOC.INC to do? Its something that the MOC.INC members and council/officers/whatevers need to seriosly discuss. OC is Open Carry. OC a long gun is wrong because its not politicaly correct? I do not feel this the correct answer. Regardless of individuals including myself feel its right or wrong. The bottom line is that it is legal. Isnt OCDO and MCO all about are 2nd amendment?

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    wardog6d wrote:
    Its something that the MOC.INC members and council/officers/whatevers need to seriosly discuss.
    That's why I am bringing up these questions. To get some clarification.

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    wardog6d wrote:
    I am sure if it was a double barrel shotgun or lever action this would not even be a discussion.
    Are you saying that it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?



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    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    If you do it, ZZZ, please announce it here. I'd like to join.

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    Am I missing something?

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    T Vance wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    Am I missing something?
    Yeah, we're missing the ability to even talk about long arms.

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    HankT wrote:
    wardog6d wrote:
    I am sure if it was a double barrel shotgun or lever action this would not even be a discussion.
    Are you saying that it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?

    Personally I believe if the issue in question were in regards to a lever action, shotgun any thing other then an AR/assult type weapon. This would'nt even be a issue. My 1.1 cents.

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    T Vance wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    Am I missing something?
    Yeah, we're missing the ability to even talk about long arms.
    So you mean OCDO not MIOC right?

  13. #13
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    T Vance wrote:
    With Mike saying the following...

    "Folks - as many have asked, John and I have formally updated our main page to clarify the focus of OpenCarry.org: "A pro-gun Internet community focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life."

    Long gun carry is a great topic for some folks to look into but distracts from our organizational focus here - generally in the law of carry rght now we have major restrictions on the right to open or conceal carry handguns in many states - and generally the law of long gun carry is much less restrictive - and for long guns the issue is mainly just "carry" generally, as concealed carry of long guns is not practical or in some cases possible anyway.

    Please note - NEW RULE - #11:

    11) This web site is focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life. Do not start OFF TOPIC threads or discussions such aspromoting the carry of long guns. Long guns are great! OCDO co-founders John & Mike and most of the folks on this forum own at least one long gun - but due to urban area issues of muzzle control, lack of trigger guard coverage, and the fact that the long gun carry issue distracts from our main mission to promote the open carry of handguns in daily life, we will leave long gun carry activism in the capable hands of the future founders of web sites about long gun carry."


    There are a few questions I'd like to get some clarification on.

    1) What about those of us that have long arms that technically, in the state of Michigan anyway, are considered and REGISTERED as a pistol; can we still discuss those?

    2) Are those types of "pistols" going to be prohibited at OC meets, even if it is not an official MOC event?

    3) If they are prohibited at events, what about if they are in a holster made for "said pistol"?

    These questions are not ment to start trouble, or point fingers. Just something that in my opinion needs some clarification going forward.

    Thank you.

    Since reading Mike's post I have done a 180 as it relates to activities/events related to OCDO stated mission.

    Here are my replies to your questions as enumerated in the quoted post of TVance:

    1) "Michigan Pistols" are long guns that fall into a specific legal catagory as defined in Michigan Law Section 28.421. The "generic" term handgun as described in Rulr #11 does not include these the of firearms. Rule #11 specifically states:

    "...our main mission to promote the open carry of handguns in daily life..."

    I do not believe that "Michigan Pistols" or actual pistols (according to federall law) like AR, Sig, GSG, Thompson .45 pistols, even fall within this description.

    2) I would expect that since the mission statement of MOC already specified "handguns" that "Michigan Pistols" and the others similar to the ones I identified
    above would be prohibited at sponsored events/activities.

    3 The fact that they are not acceptable in accordance with the stated mission statement and therefore policy renders them prohibited, irrespective in the manner in which the are carried.

    The impression I get is the the mission statement of MOC and Rule #11 are designed to limit common handguns to the discussion and participation at events. Again, irrespective of the place in which those events may occur as they relate to the promotion of Open Carry.

    Naturally if it is a shooting event at a range, long arms would be allowed, as shooting at a range isn't necessarily "an open carrying" type of public activity.

    I am not questioning the lawfulness of open carrying firearms other than handguns.

    There should be no question about that.

    I am stating my opinion as I interpret the mission statement of MOC and Rule #11 of OCDO.

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    wardog6d wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    wardog6d wrote:
    I am sure if it was a double barrel shotgun or lever action this would not even be a discussion.
    Are you saying that it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?

    Personally I believe if the issue in question were in regards to a lever action, shotgun any thing other then an AR/assult type weapon. This would'nt even be a issue. My 1.1 cents.
    So are you saying that it would not be an issue because it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?


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    FYI, Website & forum issues are being addressed shortly

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    HankT wrote:
    wardog6d wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    wardog6d wrote:
    I am sure if it was a double barrel shotgun or lever action this would not even be a discussion.
    Are you saying that it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?

    Personally I believe if the issue in question were in regards to a lever action, shotgun any thing other then an AR/assult type weapon. This would'nt even be a issue. My 1.1 cents.
    So are you saying that it would not be an issue because it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?
    I am saying if someone had carried anything other then a assualt weapon into ponderosa this would not be an issue. AGAIN my 1.1 cents

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    mikestilly wrote:
    FYI, Website & forum issues are being addressed shortly
    Thanks Mike!

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    wardog6d wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    wardog6d wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    wardog6d wrote:
    I am sure if it was a double barrel shotgun or lever action this would not even be a discussion.
    Are you saying that it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?

    Personally I believe if the issue in question were in regards to a lever action, shotgun any thing other then an AR/assult type weapon. This would'nt even be a issue. My 1.1 cents.
    So are you saying that it would not be an issue because it would be considered OK to carry a shotgun or lever action? Or that it wouldn't be OK?
    I am saying if a someone had carried anything other then a assualt weapon into ponderosa this would not be an issue. AGAIN my 1.1 cents
    Ahhh.....you don't want to actually type out the words. Probably because you know they would easily be seen as inaccurate.

    If our good olefellow member Kimberguy had been carrying a shotgun instead of his AR into the Lansing Ponderosa last week, it would have been the same thing. The same consequences would have occurred.

    Do you disagree, W6d?




  19. #19
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    T Vance wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    T Vance wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    Am I missing something?
    Yeah, we're missing the ability to even talk about long arms.
    So you mean OCDO not MIOC right?
    I meant that I want to talk to the MI OC website admin and see about getting a Michigan forum online

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    hell i'll say it first....OC a AR or AK47 or any long arm gun is just plan dumb!!!your not rambo!!!:what:if you dont like what i just said..wah!!! get over it

  21. #21
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    Zig read my post please.

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    mikestilly wrote:
    Zig read my post please.
    I saw it.

    If you need assistance, let me know. AOL IM zigziggityzoo222

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    Glock 19 wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    Hell I'll say it first....Wearing sunglasses indoors is just plain dumb!!!You're not Rambo!!!:what:If you don't like what I just said..wah!!! Get over it.

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    Glock 19 wrote:
    hell i'll say it first....OC a AR or AK47 or any long arm gun is just plan dumb!!!your not rambo!!!:what:if you dont like what i just said..wah!!! get over it
    Thing is, you're not the first to say it. It's been beaten to death.

    And this thread was made to clarify those questions I asked by MOC board members and the co-founders of OCDO.

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    Glock 19 wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Who's running the MIOC website?

    I can have a free speech forum online in a matter of minutes.
    hell i'll say it first....OC a AR or AK47 or any long arm gun is just plan dumb!!!your not rambo!!!:what:if you dont like what i just said..wah!!! get over it
    What about a shotgun or a lever-action rifle?

    Would either one be OK, do you think, G19?

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