Do you contact the owner/manager while setting up a OC meet & eat or get together

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Lets create a discussion thread on this and not clog my OC dinner with the debate.

I feel that it is not necessary to tell people when they setup a simple meet & eat or get together that you have to question the management/owner of a restaurant on their opinion of 2A and will they let you OC there. In my opinion no but if people want to do it feel free.

Must you do this when your party becomes a certain size? In my opinion no but if people want to do it feel free.

I'm am curious about other peoples opinions on this issue and I'm also curious on how hard it will be for people to find places that will coordinate it with you. I feel this will severely limit the places in which you can eat and or go when it most cases wouldnt be noticed or cared about if you just showed up.

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I do. Every time I've hosted one.

It's customary when hosting a large party to notify the restaurant in advance.

EDIT: I should also add that I do it IN WRITING so that, just in case something similar to the ponderosa incident happens, I have proof that I had permission to be there.

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You ask a loaded question.

As such, I won't join in this topic of discussion.

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Its cheese whiz without the whiz. Common sense apply over all laws, rules and regulations.

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dougwg wrote:

You ask a loaded question.

As such, I won't join in this topic of discussion.

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Loaded how? The name of the thread is the question.

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It depends.

I organized an informal weekday lunch and didn't ask permission. There were about six people total who showed up. If it was 20-30 people, then I'd probably give the management a heads up. If I didn't give the management a heads up, then I'd have alternate plans.

No reason to tell the management that a bunch of people are showing up to have lunch at a restaurant. Nor do I see the need to make a big deal out of the fact that they are carrying guns, and I also don't ask permission to carry into other establishments. Some people take things too seriously sometimes.

If it was an event where I knew people would be passing out fliers, and pamphlets, then I'd probably contact the management ahead of time.

There's just too many variables to have one set answer. Most of the time it's, "Better to ask forgiveness than permission.", but then there are times when it's advantageous.

Permission was sought and given at Ponderous, but it didn't seem to matter much.

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ghostrider wrote:

It depends.

I organized an informal weekday lunch and didn't ask permission. There were about six people total who showed up. If it was 20-30 people, then I'd probably give the management a heads up. If I didn't give the management a heads up, then I'd have alternate plans.

No reason to tell the management that a bunch of people are showing up to have lunch at a restaurant. Nor do I see the need to make a big deal out of the fact that they are carrying guns, and I also don't ask permission to carry into other establishments. Some people take things too seriously sometimes.

If it was an event where I knew people would be passing out fliers, and pamphlets, then I'd probably contact the management ahead of time.

There's just too many variables to have one set answer. Most of the time it's, "Better to ask forgiveness than permission.", but then there are times when it's advantageous.

Permission was sought and given at Ponderous, but it didn't seem to matter much.

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+1

Official MOC events... yes.

Get togethers of individuals... no.

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nuff said...

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Many places dont do call ahead seating or reservations but I dont feel that this is what the real concern by the people posting all over an OC dinner I planned. Their take was that people planning events need to disclose to management/owners their are people coming to OC. It's not about reservations. I feel discussing OC with the owners for simple party for dinner is onerous an many people would just not plan events anymore including me. Also it's not easy to get a head count. I've had events with 5-8 turn into 15-20 and vis versa. As for courtesy to a restaurant after working the business for quite a long time I can tell you this they could care less really. The only difference is you will be sat quicker if the place takes call ahead seating or reservations.

Found it interesting Doug felt the need to post all over my meet but when I open up a thread he doesnt want to discuss it. Seems kind of strange to me.

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CV67PAT wrote:

ghostrider wrote:

It depends.

I organized an informal weekday lunch and didn't ask permission. There were about six people total who showed up. If it was 20-30 people, then I'd probably give the management a heads up. If I didn't give the management a heads up, then I'd have alternate plans.

No reason to tell the management that a bunch of people are showing up to have lunch at a restaurant. Nor do I see the need to make a big deal out of the fact that they are carrying guns, and I also don't ask permission to carry into other establishments. Some people take things too seriously sometimes.

If it was an event where I knew people would be passing out fliers, and pamphlets, then I'd probably contact the management ahead of time.

There's just too many variables to have one set answer. Most of the time it's, "Better to ask forgiveness than permission.", but then there are times when it's advantageous.

Permission was sought and given at Ponderous, but it didn't seem to matter much.

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+1

Official MOC events... yes.

Get togethers of individuals... no.

Click to expand...

I agree with the above posters... and this has been my position on the topic under discussion.

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mikestilly wrote:

Many places dont do call ahead seating or reservations but I dont feel that this is what the real concern by the people posting all over an OC dinner I planned. Their take was that people planning events need to disclose to management/owners their are people coming to OC. It's not about reservations. I feel discussing OC with the owners for simple party for dinner is onerous an many people would just not plan events anymore including me. Also it's not easy to get a head count. I've had events with 5-8 turn into 15-20 and vis versa. As for courtesy to a restaurant after working the business for quite a long time I can tell you this they could care less really. The only difference is you will be sat quicker if the place takes call ahead seating or reservations.

Found it interesting Doug felt the need to post all over my meet but when I open up a thread he doesnt want to discuss it. Seems kind of strange to me.

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Speaking of loaded...
"People posting all over an OC dinner I planned..." ok calm down, I didn't tell you you had to do a damn thing, I made three posts, I think. I made a suggestion, that you can take or leave, and resent how your statements here seem to be worded unnecessarily pointedly.

I feel that it is not necessary to tell people when they setup a simple meet & eat or get together that you have to question the management/owner of a restaurant on their opinion of 2A and will they let you OC there. In my opinion no but if people want to do it feel free.

Must you do this when your party becomes a certain size? In my opinion no but if people want to do it feel free.

I'm am curious about other peoples opinions on this issue and I'm also curious on how hard it will be for people to find places that will coordinate it with you. I feel this will severely limit the places in which you can eat and or go when it most cases wouldnt be noticed or cared about if you just showed up.

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No you don't have to call ahead for a simple meet and greet. I insinuated that if you were trying to educate and desensitize that calling ahead might help you in your goal [not will, but might], and that the purpose of the call would not be to ask permission, but to inform them that you will be there, with intent to educate and desensitize. At this point you're no longer just having a meal, you're using their establishment as a political forum, and while there is no law against it and you don't need permission, they may be more appreciative and receptive.

If your goal is to have a meal and meet in person a few like-minded people you met on this website, as opposed to a political statement, then there is no purpose in letting them know. Its a restaurant, they expect people to be eating there.

This is how the question was loaded... it made assumptions before answers were even given about what the 'intent of people posting all over your other thread' were thinking. An incorrect assumption, to be frank.

So please, read posts for intent before you get upset and start 'debate threads'.
I think the last thing we need is even more unnecessary rifts and dissension after all the crap that has gone on this week.

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Evil Creamsicle wrote:

mikestilly wrote:

Many places dont do call ahead seating or reservations but I dont feel that this is what the real concern by the people posting all over an OC dinner I planned. Their take was that people planning events need to disclose to management/owners their are people coming to OC. It's not about reservations. I feel discussing OC with the owners for simple party for dinner is onerous an many people would just not plan events anymore including me. Also it's not easy to get a head count. I've had events with 5-8 turn into 15-20 and vis versa. As for courtesy to a restaurant after working the business for quite a long time I can tell you this they could care less really. The only difference is you will be sat quicker if the place takes call ahead seating or reservations.

Found it interesting Doug felt the need to post all over my meet but when I open up a thread he doesnt want to discuss it. Seems kind of strange to me.

Click to expand...

Speaking of loaded...
"People posting all over an OC dinner I planned..." ok calm down, I didn't tell you you had to do a damn thing, I made three posts, I think. I made a suggestion, that you can take or leave, and resent how your statements here seem to be worded unnecessarily pointedly.

I feel that it is not necessary to tell people when they setup a simple meet & eat or get together that you have to question the management/owner of a restaurant on their opinion of 2A and will they let you OC there. In my opinion no but if people want to do it feel free.

Must you do this when your party becomes a certain size? In my opinion no but if people want to do it feel free.

I'm am curious about other peoples opinions on this issue and I'm also curious on how hard it will be for people to find places that will coordinate it with you. I feel this will severely limit the places in which you can eat and or go when it most cases wouldnt be noticed or cared about if you just showed up.

Click to expand...

No you don't have to call ahead for a simple meet and greet. I insinuated that if you were trying to educate and desensitize that calling ahead might help you in your goal [not will, but might], and that the purpose of the call would not be to ask permission, but to inform them that you will be there, with intent to educate and desensitize. At this point you're no longer just having a meal, you're using their establishment as a political forum, and while there is no law against it and you don't need permission, they may be more appreciative and receptive.

If your goal is to have a meal and meet in person a few like-minded people you met on this website, as opposed to a political statement, then there is no purpose in letting them know. Its a restaurant, they expect people to be eating there.

This is how the question was loaded... it made assumptions before answers were even given about what the 'intent of people posting all over your other thread' were thinking. An incorrect assumption, to be frank.

So please, read posts for intent before you get upset and start 'debate threads'.
I think the last thing we need is even more unnecessary rifts and dissension after all the crap that has gone on this week.

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Dougwg not you. And yes me posting a meet and eat and a pile of replies on how to notify restaurants was unnecessary hence why I created a thread. I'm not upset just posting my thought but it looks like you're upset. Not much more for me to say here I've already posted my opinion. You are free to post yours and no I'm not upset I created this thread to keep it on topic.

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True...

I still felt I should clarify though, as I did post some similar as well.

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For something very large, yes. But I've only done that once.

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I hosted a get together in Flint quite a while back. I called ahead and asked about seating arrangements, and whether or not I needed a reservation for a large group. I told them 15 to 20 people would likely be there. I never once mentioned anything about us carrying firearms. 18 showed up. We had a great time, and were told we were welcome back anytime.
I joined a get together at a park last year ( the name of the park eludes me at the moment ). Someone had been told that the on-site law enforcement would like to be made aware of our location, so that they could field any calls they might receive with intelligent answers. I took it upon myself to go talk to the lieutenant, out of courtesy for their request. It turns out that it was a good thing I did. The officer in charge was not the same person who had been advised of the picnic, and his last orders were something to the effect of "extreme prejudice" in the arrest/detainment of anyone openly carrying.
He told me in no uncertain terms that anyone seen openly carrying a handgun would be arrested at gunpoint. After several minutes of trying to reason with this man, he contacted his boss, and was told our actions were legal. We were then "free" to go about our business. This was another situation where "permission" had already been obtained. I did not talk to him while openly armed, though I had my empty holster on.
I think it's a crap shoot. Stupid things are going to happen sooner or later, and in my opinion, calling ahead and bringing up the subject of our guaranteed right can be more detrimental than just showing up armed.

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Three under my belt ! Never a boo . Know the difference between permission and Invite ? And Tell Em ALL in that Jurisdiction . Monroe ,Flatrock and Canton .

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Just because we/someone has a right does not mean we have to exercise it with arrogance, or with a condescending attitude, or push it on others. Remember other people have rights too!. Our bottom line is to Meet, Eat, & hope some one approaches us for info. That said I would call to ask seating arrangments, or seating capacities otherwise No, but if it was a very large event, or MOC sponsored event yes.

I'm sure everyone's opinions will surely vary, but we should remember that we are all in this together with the same goal. Nothing says we cannot all exercise our own ways of setting up these events & still reach the end result! Inform, educate, & desensitize!

:celebrate

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CrossPistols wrote:

Just because we/someone has a right does not mean we have to exercise it with arrogance, or with a condescending attitude, or push it on others. Remember other people have rights too!. Our bottom line is to Meet, Eat, & hope some one approaches us for info. That said I would call to ask seating arrangments, or seating capacities otherwise No, but if it was a very large event, or MOC sponsored event yes.

I'm sure everyone's opinions will surely vary, but we should remember that we are all in this together with the same goal. Nothing says we cannot all exercise our own ways of setting up these events & still reach the end result! Inform, educate, & desensitize!

:celebrate

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+1

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Ok, I just can't hold my mouth shut any longer!

My take:

When other customers see armed people there is always a chance one of those other customers will end up scared out of their wits and run to the management because "those people might rob me" or whatever goes on in their thought process. The management is then on the spot, looking to calm a panicked customer without disturbing the whole joint. Knee-jerk reactions aretypically notthe best way to handle things.

It is for this reason that I PERSONALLY feel it is courteous to be pre-emptive and give the management of the place some information. Apossible line ofconversation could be as follows:

[line]

A group of associates and I are planning to stop by your place sometime tommorrow. I wanted to speak with you because we are the type of people that don't leave our security to chance and we will be legally armed. The catch is that not everyone knows that this is indeed legal, perhaps even yourself and I wanted to give you some information in the off-chanceone of your patronscomes to you with a complaint.
[line]


Now, you have not asked for permission, but rather gave the owner a chance to be prepared for whatever may come up. They may say they would rather not risk upsetting their customers, if so then you would have been asked to leave anyway. But I suspect that you will find more often a business owner that now sees you as a responsible person with the utmost respect for thier property. And who knows, maybe a follow-up letter to them afterwords would result in a "lawful carry welcome" sticker on the door the next time!

AGAIN, I clarify, this is my personal opinion at the current moment. I reserve the right to change my opinion given additional information on the subject matter in the future.

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I am planning to stop by your place sometime tommorrow. I wanted to speak with you because we are the type of people that don't leave our security to chance and we will be legally armed. The catch is that not everyone knows that this is indeed legal, perhaps even yourself and I wanted to give you some information in the off-chanceone of your patronscomes to you with a complaint.

I'll just send this to every business that I ever plan to patronize, that way it'll quell any future problems. And monkeys will fly out of my butt:uhoh:.springerdave.