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Thread: Does this make sense to anyone

  1. #1
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    Thank you again for your correspondence to me, I wanted to update you on the status of Senate Bill 334 and my position on it.
    As you know, Senate Bill 334 allows a person with a concealed handgun permit to carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of a restaurant or club and prohibits such person from consuming alcoholic beverages while on the premises. A person who consumes alcohol in violation of the provisions of the bill is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor and a person who becomes intoxicated in violation of the provisions of the bill is guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.
    I've sent this letter to you to inform you that, as of the writing of this letter, Senate Bill 334 passed the Senate of Virginia by a vote of 22 to 18. I was one of those 18 no votes. I voted no on this legislation because of the passage of Senate Bill 408 which was introduced by Senator Jill Holtzman Vogel. Senator Vogel's bill, which passed 24 to 16, creates an exemption to the general prohibition against carrying concealed weapons by allowing a person who may lawfully possess a firearm to carry a handgun in a private motor vehicle or vessel if the handgun is locked in a container or compartment. As a result of this bill's passage it made no sense to continue to support Senate Bill 334. As I stated to you in my previous letter, I believe that guns are safer on law abiding citizens than rattling around in glove compartments. The passage of Senate Bill 408 negated the necessity of the passage of Senate Bill 334. I regret any confusion my vote may have caused.
    Thank you so much for your correspondence.
    Sincerely,
    David W. Marsden


  2. #2
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    I just got this e-mail too, one week after receiving a letter in the mail from him saying that he would vote for the bill. I think he was just looking for an excuse to vote against it.

  3. #3
    Regular Member ChinChin's Avatar
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    Who has two thumbs and will have me voting against him next election. . .
    The problem with the internet is nobody can really tell when you’re serious and when you’re being sarcastic. –Abraham Lincoln

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    Activist Member nuc65's Avatar
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    Maybe he left out the part of the back room deal... you know wink wink vote for this one and don't vote for that one and I'll support one and you can support my pet bill...
    It's the back room dealing that we don't see that might fill in the details on votes like this, because frankly that makes no sense to a normal non-politician type.
    When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force.

    excerpt By Marko Kloos (http://munchkinwrangler.wordpress.com/?s=major+caudill)

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    Regular Member 230therapy's Avatar
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    Lame. Keep your gun in your car while you get shot.

    Maybe he should call Suzanna Hupp and look up "Luby's Cafeteria Massacre" on google.
    Does anyone here actually believe that the Founders were sitting around in John Adams' tavern UNARMED because they believed a bar should be a gun free zone?

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    Only thing I can think of is that he thinks that the other bill requires that guns be kept locked in cars, and if the gun's secured that way, then there's no need to carry it into a restaurant. In other words, he thinks that the priority is keeping the gun safe from thieves. I don't think he understands the idea of "self defense" or that one might want to be prepared to do it.
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

  7. #7
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    I was actually invited to his home last year to discuss this issue, amongst other related issues.
    He and his wife were very gracious hosts and I appreciated the gesture.

    His reasoning is this (complete paraphrase and not a quote): I'm OK with citizens carrying guns, but I hate that they are put in positions that force them to disarm and leave it where it can be stolen or accessed by children, etc. I would prefer that citizens have an easy, legal means to keep their guns safe wherever they go. This may be on their person OR a locked compartment of the vehicle.

    He really should have explained this better in his letter.

    My feeling is definitely that he's an A-1 compromiser who may or may not actually care at all about our right to self-defense. Positions like this one are a huge red-flag to me.

    My impression of the man was that he's very pro-police and anti-gang/etc in the context of the gun issue. The armed citizen is a priority that comes well after these. He introduced a failed bill last year to make carrying concealed AIRSOFT pistols illegal under 18.2-308. The reason was that Fairfax Co. Police asked him to, because youth gangs were caught w/ them.

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    230therapy wrote:
    Lame.Â* Keep your gun in your car while you get shot.

    Maybe he should call Suzanna Hupp and look up "Luby's Cafeteria Massacre" on google.
    I'll bring this up to him the next time I see him.
    I'm kind of new and actually didn't know about Ms. Hupp's tragedy at the time.

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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    ufcfanvt wrote:
    I'm kind of new and actually didn't know about Ms. Hupp's tragedy at the time.
    With the exception of the Va Tech shooting, the Luby's Massacre (and its aftermath) is one of the strongest arguments for lawful carry in recent history.
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

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    Win lots of friends that way?
    Nice job pointing out how much older and smarter you are. Thanks.

  11. #11
    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    ufcfanvt wrote:
    I'm kind of new and actually didn't know about Ms. Hupp's tragedy at the time.
    With the exception of the Va Tech shooting, the Luby's Massacre (and its aftermath) is one of the strongest arguments for lawful carry in recent history.
    IMHO, especially because as a careful, law-abiding citizen, Ms. Hupp dutifully obeyed the law and left her firearm in her car. That law was directly responsible for the deaths of innocent people.

    TFred

  12. #12
    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    ufcfanvt wrote:
    Win lots of friends that way?
    Nice job pointing out how much older and smarter you are. Thanks.
    What are you talking about?


    TFred wrote:
    IMHO, especially because as a careful, law-abiding citizen, Ms. Hupp dutifully obeyed the law and left her firearm in her car. That law was directly responsible for the deaths of innocent people.
    100% agreed. And those deaths, in a public place and as a "GFZ" serves as a warning to law abiding citizens: beware.

    Beware you enter into an establishment that not only disarms you, but publicly announces it either by signage or through legislation - you are a potential target.
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

  13. #13
    Activist Member nuc65's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    ufcfanvt wrote:
    I'm kind of new and actually didn't know about Ms. Hupp's tragedy at the time.
    With the exception of the Va Tech shooting, the Luby's Massacre (and its aftermath) is one of the strongest arguments for lawful carry in recent history.
    This was on a Front Site email today, it seems relevant:

    February 14, 2010 - Richmond, California - Three hooded men walk into Gethsemane Church of God in Christ and opened fire and then fled the scene, as the singing of the choir was replaced by frightened screams. The two victims, a 14-year-old boy and a 19-year-old man, were hospitalized.

    March 8, 2009 - Maryville, Illinois - Suspect Terry Joe Sedlacek, 27, of Troy, walks into the First Baptist Church, and shoots pastor Fred Winters dead, point blank. Several
    church members are injured by a knife in the struggle tocapture after the attack, The suspect also had stabbed himself, but survived, when his gun jams.

    July 27, 2008 - Knoxville, Tennessee - A gunman opens firein a church during a youth performance, killing two people and injuring seven.

    Dec. 9, 2007 - Colorado - Three people are killed and fivewounded in two shooting rampages, one at a missionary school in suburban Denver and one at a church in Colorado Springs. The gunman in the second incident is killed by a guard.

    May 20, 2007 - Moscow, Idaho - A standoff between police and a suspect in the shootings of three people in a Presbyterian Church ended with three dead, including one police officer.

    Aug. 12, 2007 - Neosho, Missouri - First Congregational Church - 3 killed - Eiken Elam Saimon shot and killed the pastor and two deacons and wounded five others.

    May 21, 2006 - Baton Rouge, Louisiana - The Ministry of Jesus Christ Church - 4 killed - The four at the church who were shot were members of Erica Bell's family; she was
    abducted and murdered elsewhere; Bell's mother, church pastor Claudia Brown, was seriously wounded - Anthony Bell, 25, was the shooter.

    Feb. 26, 2006 - Detroit, Michigan - Zion Hope Missionary Baptist Church - 2 killed + shooter - Kevin L. Collins, who reportedly went to the church looking for his girlfriend,
    later killed himself.

    April 9, 2005 - College Park, Georgia - A 27-year-old airman died after being shot at a church, where he had once worked as a security guard.

    March 12, 2005 - Brookfield, Wisconsin - Living Church of God - 7 killed + shooter - Terry Ratzmann opened fire on the congregation, killing seven and wounding four before taking his own life.

    July 30, 2005 - College Park, Georgia - World Changers Church International - shooter killed - Air Force Staff Sgt. John Givens was shot five times by a police officer after charging the officer, following violent behavior.

    Dec. 17, 2004, Garden Grove, Calif.: A veteran musician at the Crystal Cathedral shoots himself to death after a nine-hour standoff.

    Oct. 5, 2003 - Atlanta, Georgia - Turner Monumental AME Church - 2 killed + shooter - Shelia Wilson walked into the church while preparations are being made for service and shot the pastor, her mother and then herself.

    June 10, 2002 - Conception, Missouri - Benedictine monastery - 2 killed + shooter - Lloyd Robert Jeffress shot four monks in the monastery killing two and wounding two,
    before killing himself.

    March 12, 2002 - Lynbrook, New York - Our Lady of Peace Catholic Church - 2 killed - Peter Troy, a former mental patient, opens fire during Mass, killing the priest and a
    parishioner. He later receives a life sentence.

    May 18, 2001 - Hopkinsville, Kentucky - Greater Oak Missionary Baptist Church - 2 killed - Frederick Radford stood up in the middle of a revival service and began shooting at his estranged wife, Nicole Radford, killing her and a woman trying to help her.

    Sept. 15, 1999 - Fort Worth, Texas - Wedgewood Baptist Church - 7 killed + shooter - Larry Gene Ashbrook shot dead seven people and injured a further seven at a concert by Christian rock group Forty Days in Fort Worth, Texas before killing himself.

    April 15, 1999 - Salt Lake City, Utah - LDS Church Family History Library - 2 killed + shooter - Sergei Babarin, 70, with a history of mental illness, entered the library, killed two people and wounded four others before he was gunned down by police.
    When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force.

    excerpt By Marko Kloos (http://munchkinwrangler.wordpress.com/?s=major+caudill)

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    wylde007 wrote:
    ufcfanvt wrote:
    Win lots of friends that way?
    Nice job pointing out how much older and smarter you are. Thanks.
    What are you talking about?
    I'm thinkin' that maybe he misread your comment and took offense when, obviously, none was intended. As a matter of fact, I haven't the faintest idea how someone could have taken offense to your comment, but then again, lotsa folks click the 'Send' button mighty quickly, when they'd be a lot better off to think long and hard about responding when they're feelin' a bit out of sorts.

    If it were me, wylde, I think I'd be apologizin' to you right about now, but I guess you'll have to wait and see if ufcfanvt has the gumption to do what he ought to.

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    Regular Member IanB's Avatar
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    Regular Member simmonsjoe's Avatar
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    I read this **** it a VCDL alert and about died laughing. It makes absolutely no sense because the person already has a CHP so the new bill about securing in your car is moot. He is just a ******* liar. He knows we know, and doesn't care. He put something that would make the uneducated about CHP think he was being reasonable. **** that guy.
    illegal ≠ immoral legal ≠ moral
    [SIZE=1]"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. "Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent." - Thomas Jefferson
    G19 Gen 4; Bersa Thunder 380; Sig Sauer P238; Kel-Tec su-16c

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