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I am helpng a friend in VA or WV

ed

ed

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A friend of mine has a 9mm pistol and needs to shoot 100 rounds througha stack of like 8 golf shirts and needs to recover bullets and fragments for a study. She asked me for help. What is the best way to capture the 100 rounds? Shoot into the ground (frozen around here), water barrel, jugs, phone books and newspaper (both wet and dry).. I have heard it all.. What have you heard and better yet, what have you DONE that works?

Thanks!



Ed
 
C

ClumsyCandy

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ed wrote:
A friend of mine has a 9mm pistol and needs to shoot 100 rounds througha stack of like 8 golf shirts and needs to recover bullets and fragments for a study. She asked me for help. What is the best way to capture the 100 rounds? Shoot into the ground (frozen around here), water barrel, jugs, phone books and newspaper (both wet and dry).. I have heard it all.. What have you heard and better yet, what have you DONE that works?

Thanks!



Ed
Click to expand...

We use the local Yellow Book *you can get them free at Kroger* for .22 rounds but they go almost all the way through, save for about 200 or so pages. She could try it, but it did catch and save the bullets. And since they are free and you can get several rounds into each one, especially if she spaces them right and pulls them out between shots.
 
Dreamer

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Mount the shirts in a REALLY big embroidery hoop, then mount that hoop on the top of a 55 gallon drum filled with water. Stand on a platform high enough so you can comfortably shoot straight down into the barrel. That should easily and safely capture the bullets, AND not deform them very much (well, a LOT less than phone books or the ground)

Plus, a 55gal drum is a LOT more "re-usable" than milk jugs...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjJWJiolRrg&feature=PlayList&p=9CB495632FF934B4&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=6

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=972OWQFimGw
 
kennys

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What about a block of ice? it may take a few though, it shouldn't melt that quick in these temps.
 
ed

ed

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Dreamer wrote:
Mount the shirts in a REALLY big embroidery hoop, then mount that hoop on the top of a 55 gallon drum filled with water. Stand on a platform high enough so you can comfortably shoot straight down into the barrel. That should easily and safely capture the bullets, AND not deform them very much (well, a LOT less than phone books or the ground)

Plus, a 55gal drum is a LOT more "re-usable" than milk jugs...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjJWJiolRrg&feature=PlayList&p=9CB495632FF934B4&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=6So
Click to expand...
So far, this looks like the best
 
Dreamer

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Just make sure she gives the YouTube poster (and me for pointing you toward it) a little credit line somewhere in her report... ;)

Good luck with this experiment. Sounds REALLY interesting. Let us know how it goes, and please, if she published it in PDF format anywhere, give us the link.

Inquiring minds want to know...
 
kennys

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ed wrote:
Dreamer wrote:
Mount the shirts in a REALLY big embroidery hoop, then mount that hoop on the top of a 55 gallon drum filled with water. Stand on a platform high enough so you can comfortably shoot straight down into the barrel. That should easily and safely capture the bullets, AND not deform them very much (well, a LOT less than phone books or the ground)

Plus, a 55gal drum is a LOT more "re-usable" than milk jugs...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjJWJiolRrg&feature=PlayList&p=9CB495632FF934B4&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=6So
Click to expand...
So far, this looks liek the best
Click to expand...
I may be able to hook you up with a 55 gal drum, you would just have to cut the top out.
 
nuc65

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Ballistic gel won't deform the bullet, the ice will shatter and cause fragmentation of the bullet, a 9mm bullet will loose most of its momentum in 16-18 inches of water ( a 55 gal drum isn't strictly necessary) and about 9 inches of phone book are required. What material you use depends on what you are studying the bullet for. If you are attempting to demonstrate the shirts on a human body then usually a pig carcass is sufficient to stop the slug and mimic the response.

If it is only to demonstrate what happens to the golf shirts or the bullet or a combination then you need to tailor your information and method to represent what your study is attempting.
 
ed

ed

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nuc65 wrote:
Ballistic gel won't deform the bullet, the ice will shatter and cause fragmentation of the bullet, a 9mm bullet will loose most of its momentum in 16-18 inches of water ( a 55 gal drum isn't strictly necessary)
Click to expand...

If I use a 35 gallon "plastic" trash can will the shock wave blow out the sides?
 
Dreamer

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Actually, in the first video I posted--the one with the Winchester 9mm PDX-1 rounds, it looks like he is using that EXACT plastic trash can. The second video--the one with the .45acp Hydra-Shoks, a different guy used a metal 55gal barrel...

So a plastic garbage can should work, if its a BIG one. And shooting through 8 layers of denim is going to slow down a 9mm round a bit before it ever hits the water, so you should be golden with a 50gal trash can, but a 35 gallon plastic can might not be deep enough.

The only way to know is to try. At the very worst, you're going to shoot a few holes in the bottom of a 35gal trash can.

I'd go with the bigger can though. The cost difference should be negligible, and we've seen it work on video...

As always, I'll say IANAL, but I'll also add the following caveat:
IANAP (I Am Not A Physicist...) ;)​
 
Dreamer

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One more idea...

If your friend is doing this experiment as some sort of officially sanctioned academic research, she might have her school contact the FBI lab in Quantico VA. They have a state-of-the -art ballistics lab, and they have some of the most current models of "bullet traps."

FBI-Quantico has research partnerships with many of the NoVA area universities (like GMU), so if she's doing this experiment for research in, say, GMU's Criminal Justice Program, she can probably get authorisation to go to Quantico and watch them do it for her. (they probably WON'T let her actually fire the rounds though...)

Just a thought...
 
ed

ed

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Dreamer wrote:
One more idea...

If your friend is doing this experiment as some sort of officially sanctioned academic research, she might have her school contact the FBI lab in Quantico VA. They have a state-of-the -art ballistics lab, and they have some of the most current models of "bullet traps."

FBI-Quantico has research partnerships with many of the NoVA area universities (like GMU), so if she's doing this experiment for research in, say, GMU's Criminal Justice Program, she can probably get authorisation to go to Quantico and watch them do it for her. (they probably WON'T let her actually fire the rounds though...)

Just a thought...
Click to expand...
Thanks.. time was of the essence.. she needs the rounds this weekend and I took too long.. but I think she is going to use the trash can idea with her dad in WV this weekend. Thanks all for your help, I will let ya know how it worked out.
 
user

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Yeah, ok, too late - but I was thinking, it sort of depends on what condition she wants the bullets to be in after going through the shirts. Water jugs, phone books, and trash cans will cause deformation. I was thinking, if she's in W.Va., bales of hay would be best. When she's done, just burn the hay and sift the ashes. Though now that I think of it, depending on what kind of bullets she's using, that fire might be hot enough to melt the lead.
 
nuc65

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ed wrote:
nuc65 wrote:
Ballistic gel won't deform the bullet, the ice will shatter and cause fragmentation of the bullet, a 9mm bullet will loose most of its momentum in 16-18 inches of water ( a 55 gal drum isn't strictly necessary)
Click to expand...

If I use a 35 gallon "plastic" trash can will the shock wave blow out the sides?
Click to expand...
If you maintain aim at the center and the trash can you picture is 3/4 full then I doubt it will create much of a pressure wave. It might splash some and I would add a few inches of sand at the bottom.
 
Hokie

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ed wrote:
nuc65 wrote:
Ballistic gel won't deform the bullet, the ice will shatter and cause fragmentation of the bullet, a 9mm bullet will loose most of its momentum in 16-18 inches of water ( a 55 gal drum isn't strictly necessary)
Click to expand...

If I use a 35 gallon "plastic" trash can will the shock wave blow out the sides?
Click to expand...
There is a youtube video of a guy using a plastic trash can with mud at the bottem and then water to show that the Glock can be fired underwater. The trash can did not suffer any visible damage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pS057lKUtCs
 
Hawkflyer

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It goes without saying that you should not try this at home, and you take this advice at your own risk, YMMV, IANAL ... and any other disclaimer that may be appropriate.

Go to Walmart or a similar discount store. Find some "Bath sheets" which are basically large bath towels for 100 9mm bullet recoveries you will need about 5.

Open the towel, lay it flat and roll it into a round "tube" shape. Take the weapon and the towel to a large flat unobstructed surface. Lay the towel tube on the ground in a straight line and fold the far end over to close the end. Be sure there is at least 25 or 30 feet of unobstructed space for the towel to move when you shoot. Put the muzzle of the weapon into the end of the towel tube and go "Bang".

The towel will move (usually about 20 feet).

Unroll the towel and you will find a pristine bullet in the center about half way down the length of the roll. You can reuse the towel for a number of shots but it will eventually require replacement.
 
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