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Thread: Argue with the cop

  1. #1
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    Apparently my presence here has caused a few people to become angry. Instead of spoiling everybody's thread that I post in, maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread?

    Thanks.

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    Hombre1 wrote:
    Apparently my presence here has caused a few people to become angry. Instead of spoiling everybody's thread that I post in, maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread?

    Thanks.
    Post should have read "Dont Feed the Trolls"

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    Regular Member EM87's Avatar
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    You weren't spoiling my thread! I just prefer to keep off-topic discussion to a minimum. As long as you're not trolling, I appreciate your presence here and your input.

    Personally, I would not argue with a LEO. I would not allow them to search me or take my property. If they tried to do so illegally, I would let them know that I do not consent but that I will not resist. Hopefully I would have a recorder on me at the time.
    "You'll be walking along.. OC.. and you'll feel GREAT. You'll feel FREEEEE like 1776 kind of Free." -cscitney87

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    Hombre1 wrote:
    Apparently my presence here has caused a few people to become angry. Instead of spoiling everybody's thread that I post in, maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread?

    Thanks.
    Welcome back.

    In before you're banned for trolling again.



    I mean, come on, at least HankT is subtle about it...


    (this thread needed SOMETHING firearms related...)

    -Richard-

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    EM87 wrote:
    You weren't spoiling my thread! I just prefer to keep off-topic discussion to a minimum. As long as you're not trolling, I appreciate your presence here and your input.

    Personally, I would not argue with a LEO. I would not allow them to search me or take my property. If they tried to do so illegally, I would let them know that I do not consent but that I will not resist. Hopefully I would have a recorder on me at the time.
    And that would be the proper way to deal with a situation.

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    I likey.:celebrate

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    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    Hombre1 wrote:
    Apparently my presence here has caused a few people to become angry. Instead of spoiling everybody's thread that I post in, maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread?

    Thanks.
    The part I added red to in your post..............

    You know... some LEO's take umbrage with OC'ers when what an officer thinks is constructive criticism isn't received well by the OC'ers.

    And some OC'ers take umbrage with what they think is constructive criticism isn't received well by the LEOs.

    So... why on earth would you "load the issue" right from the get go by inciting exactly what you are complaining about by "fishing" for "anti-cop rhetoric"?

    You said in a different post that you are here on this forum to help folks. Well Sir.... taking a confrontational attitude right from the start is not the way to engender positive responses.

    Or are you attempting to control the general tone of responses to you... a self professed LEO... to keep those responses negative to satisfy an agenda of inciting negativity towards LE so open carriers will be portrayed in a negative fashion? Hoping to prove your own attitude that open carriers are less than respectable members of society?

    If you wish to have a civil discussion concerning how open carry impacts the public and LE I, and many others, are quite willing to do exactly that........

    But if you wish to just play a "cop vs open carriers" game hoping to bait folks into cop bashing I believe you will discover that open carrying folks are wise to that Saul Alinsky tactic.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

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    You are either misunderstand people on this forumwho discuss how to deal with"bad" copsencounters, or you just want us to loolk like cop bashers. The fact that a lot of police misconductis being discussed on this forumdoes not mean that we beleive all cops are bad. I personnally beleive that most cops are good. It is just enough bad cops out there for people to be concerned and be prepared.

    Unfortunately, OCs have much higher chance to encounter a police officer than any other citizen out on the streets. At least in Michigan and at least presently. Naturally, we have to discuss how to deal with it. When enough cops and public gets educated andperception will become more like in Arizona., then we will have less reason to discuss "bad" cops encounters.

    Hombre1 wrote:
    Apparently my presence here has caused a few people to become angry. Instead of spoiling everybody's thread that I post in, maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread?

    Thanks.

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    My biggest problem is that cops are condecending. They forget that they work for us, They forget We the people, and our rights.

    We have a country to have a country, not a government. The people would do well without a government, but a government would not exist without a people.

    When I am on cop forums they come out rude and controlling. When they speak about rights, its usually sarcastic, the worg rights is often used in parenthasees, or quotes----"Mah Raaaghts" --- or ===the"right" to keep and bear..---- you see. This is offensive to us, the first thing we think of is the oath that the police take.

    Many cops think we are a bunch of rednecks, and extremests.

    I have a big problem when a cop cant leave his job at work. We had one on here who thought he was going to go around moderating our threads! We needed to talk about long guns because one of our members caused a stir, doing the right thing the wrong way, and we were discussing it. The owners decided to discourage long gun carry, but we needed to discuss it from a legal point of veiw as well so we could learn how to stay out of jail for one thing, and how to deal with the LEO and the puiblic. Well, this hotshot thought he was going to start policing our threads. Not received well. He thought that "following the rules" was more important than allowing us to learn that we could do this legally, and us learning what the laws were.

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    stainless1911 wrote:
    My biggest problem is that cops are condecending. They forget that they work for us, They forget We the people, and our rights.

    We have a country to have a country, not a government. The people would do well without a government, but a government would not exist without a people.

    When I am on* cop forums they come out rude and controlling. When they speak about rights, its usually sarcastic, the worg rights is often used in parenthasees, or quotes----"Mah Raaaghts" --- or ===the"right" to keep and bear..---- you see. This is offensive to us, the first thing we think of is the oath that the police take.*

    Many cops think we are a bunch of rednecks, and extremests.

    I have a big problem when a cop cant leave his job at work. We had one on here who thought he was going to go around moderating our threads! We needed to talk about long guns because one of our members caused a stir, doing the right thing the wrong way, and we were discussing it. The owners decided to discourage long gun carry, but we needed to discuss it from a legal point of veiw as well so we could learn how to stay out of jail for one thing, and how to deal with the LEO and the puiblic. Well, this hotshot thought he was going to start policing our threads. Not received well. He thought that "following the rules" was more important than allowing us to learn that we could do this legally, and us learning what the laws were.
    Stainless, I hate to break the news to you. But that officer.com forum is mostly posters whom are not officers.

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    So I have heard. No matter, I got banned anyhow.:?

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    Hombre1 wrote:
    EM87 wrote:
    You weren't spoiling my thread! I just prefer to keep off-topic discussion to a minimum. As long as you're not trolling, I appreciate your presence here and your input.

    Personally, I would not argue with a LEO. I would not allow them to search me or take my property. If they tried to do so illegally, I would let them know that I do not consent but that I will not resist. Hopefully I would have a recorder on me at the time.
    And that would be the proper way to deal with a situation.
    +1


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    sounds like another LEO taking internet threads personally. Same kind of person that cant leave his problems at work.
    Freedom isn't free, but this is America! We will find a way to outsource it and save some money - Jeremy

  14. #14
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    :what: say's it all:celebrate:celebrate

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    Bikenut wrote:
    Hombre1 wrote:
    Apparently my presence here has caused a few people to become angry.* Instead of spoiling everybody's thread that I post in, maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread?

    Thanks.
    The part I added red to in your post..............

    You know... some LEO's take umbrage with OC'ers when what an officer thinks is constructive criticism isn't received well by the OC'ers.

    And some OC'ers take umbrage with what they think is constructive criticism isn't received well by the LEOs.

    So... why on earth would you "load the issue" right from the get go by inciting exactly what you are complaining about by "fishing" for "anti-cop rhetoric"?

    You said in a different post that you are here on this forum to help folks. Well Sir.... taking a confrontational attitude right from the start is not the way to engender positive responses.

    Or are you attempting to control the general tone of responses to you... a self professed LEO... to keep those responses negative to satisfy an agenda of inciting negativity towards LE so open carriers will be portrayed in a negative fashion? Hoping to prove your own attitude that open carriers are less than respectable members of society?

    If you wish to have a civil discussion concerning how open carry impacts the public and LE I, and many others, are quite willing to do exactly that........

    But if you wish to just play a "cop vs open carriers" game hoping to bait folks into cop bashing I believe you will discover that open carrying folks are wise to that Saul Alinsky tactic.
    Point taken. I do want to help.

  16. #16
    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Hombre1 wrote:
    maybe we could just keep the anti-cop rhetoric in this thread
    Never seen anti-cop rhetoric around here, and never seen an anti-cop person here.

    Seen some anti-bad cop posts, but shouldn't we all be anti-bad cop?

    From what I've seen, regular members here all support and appreciate proper law enforcement and the professional officers who do a professional job of it.

    I challenge you to point to any "anti-cop rhetoric" around here that comes from a regular member and isn't associated with posting or commenting about an unprofessional law-enforcement incident.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    Anti Whacker is about it. Hmmm I wonder who fits into that catagory.

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    stainless1911 wrote:
    My biggest problem is that cops are condecending. They forget that they work for us, They forget We the people, and our rights.

    We have a country to have a country, not a government. The people would do well without a government, but a government would not exist without a people.

    When I am on cop forums they come out rude and controlling. When they speak about rights, its usually sarcastic, the worg rights is often used in parenthasees, or quotes----"Mah Raaaghts" --- or ===the"right" to keep and bear..---- you see. This is offensive to us, the first thing we think of is the oath that the police take.

    Many cops think we are a bunch of rednecks, and extremests.

    I have a big problem when a cop cant leave his job at work. We had one on here who thought he was going to go around moderating our threads! We needed to talk about long guns because one of our members caused a stir, doing the right thing the wrong way, and we were discussing it. The owners decided to discourage long gun carry, but we needed to discuss it from a legal point of veiw as well so we could learn how to stay out of jail for one thing, and how to deal with the LEO and the puiblic. Well, this hotshot thought he was going to start policing our threads. Not received well. He thought that "following the rules" was more important than allowing us to learn that we could do this legally, and us learning what the laws were.
    This folks, is cop-bashing. Had he worded it in a manner to be inclusive instead of exclusive then it would have been a comment about how some officers can be. As worded, it is a general reference, and is unfair.

    Personally, I think Hombre1 has the potential to be a good addition to our forum, and appreciate his efforts. I will say that he seems to do a little of what I criticize above (that isn't cop-bashing, it's constructive criticism of hombre1).

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    I wasnt trying to bash cops as a whole, possibly the reputation they as a group that they have failed to defeat, but not cops as a whole. One in particular who wanted to police the threads, yes, but not all.

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    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    Hombre1 wrote:
    Point taken. I do want to help.
    In that case Sir... I look forward to interesting, informative (hopefully in both directions), and civil discussions with you.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

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    ghostrider wrote:
    This folks, is cop-bashing. Had he worded it in a manner to be inclusive instead of exclusive then it would have been a comment about how some officers can be. As worded, it is a general reference, and is unfair.
    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

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    marshaul wrote:
    ghostrider wrote:
    This folks, is cop-bashing. Had he worded it in a manner to be inclusive instead of exclusive then it would have been a comment about how some officers can be. As worded, it is a general reference, and is unfair.
    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.
    NO, I qualified it enough. When you attack the person instead of the argument, then you are no better.

  23. #23
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    ghostrider wrote:
    marshaul wrote:
    ghostrider wrote:
    This folks, is cop-bashing. Had he worded it in a manner to be inclusive instead of exclusive then it would have been a comment about how some officers can be. As worded, it is a general reference, and is unfair.
    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.
    NO, I qualified it enough. When you attack the person instead of the argument, then you are no better.
    Well, I don't know that I would have called the post you quoted and called "cop bashing" that. I would say it was not qualified enough in it's statement. It should have read "some cops," as a way to qualify that not all cops are that way.

    Still, I guess it's a matter of perspective, and opinion.
    Big Gay Al
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  24. #24
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Big Gay Al wrote:
    ghostrider wrote:
    marshaul wrote:
    ghostrider wrote:
    This folks, is cop-bashing. Had he worded it in a manner to be inclusive instead of exclusive then it would have been a comment about how some officers can be. As worded, it is a general reference, and is unfair.
    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.
    NO, I qualified it enough. When you attack the person instead of the argument, then you are no better.
    Well, I don't know that I would have called the post you quoted and called "cop bashing" that.* I would say it was not qualified enough in it's statement.* It should have read "some cops," as a way to qualify that not all cops are that way.

    Still, I guess it's a matter of perspective, and opinion.
    This was my point.

    Something which merely lacked precise qualification is all of a sudden inferred to be a personal attack.

    What might this suggest?

    That's what I was getting at with my misquoted Shakespeare.

  25. #25
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    marshaul wrote:
    Big Gay Al wrote:
    ghostrider wrote:
    marshaul wrote:
    ghostrider wrote:
    This folks, is cop-bashing. Had he worded it in a manner to be inclusive instead of exclusive then it would have been a comment about how some officers can be. As worded, it is a general reference, and is unfair.
    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.
    NO, I qualified it enough. When you attack the person instead of the argument, then you are no better.
    Well, I don't know that I would have called the post you quoted and called "cop bashing" that. I would say it was not qualified enough in it's statement. It should have read "some cops," as a way to qualify that not all cops are that way.

    Still, I guess it's a matter of perspective, and opinion.
    This was my point.

    Something which merely lacked precise qualification is all of a sudden inferred to be a personal attack.

    What might this suggest?

    That's what I was getting at with my misquoted Shakespeare.
    Ok, you got me there.
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