Grand Canyon Railroad pro-OC

AZkopper · Feb 23, 2010

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I had the pleasure of riding on the Grand Canyon Railroad last week from Williams to the GCNP. Each rail car has a 'tour guide' / 'hostess'. I was very pleased to hear the tour guide /hostess explaining to all the tourists in our car that Arizona respects peoples rightsto carry guns openly, and to not be surprised if you see it.

I've emailed the company, and I'm awaiting an answer to their firearms policy now with the new NP rule. I'll let you know when I get it.

Edited to keep peoples panties from wadding up.

Decoligny · Feb 23, 2010

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Since the law allowing firearms in the NPs didn't go into effect until Monday, admitting that you took the train to the GCNP while carrying a firearm, even a concealed firearm, aren't you admitting in a public forum to committing a Federal Offense?

AZkopper · Feb 23, 2010

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Decoligny wrote:

Since the law allowing firearms in the NPs didn't go into effect until Monday, admitting that you took the train to the GCNP while carrying a firearm, even a concealed firearm, aren't you admitting in a public forum to committing a Federal Offense?

shhhhh

Sonora Rebel · Feb 23, 2010

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We're not as snarky about it here as in Kommiefornia. I did catch the local FOX talking dweeb announce that 'licensed gun owners can now enter the parks with their guns.' Uh... no 'license required. Wheredo they get these people and the moonbats who write this stuff?

Folks here havebeen transiting the Saguero National Park 'armed' since Christ was a cowboy. It's the only way in/out. I suppose we can all breath a great sign of relief that Roger Ranger can't bust us if he wanted to now.

heliopolissolutions · Feb 23, 2010

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Like....no...really...that isn't very smart.

Loose lips sink ships.

protector84 · Feb 23, 2010

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Who cares about publically admitting breaking some law in the past? They can't do anything about it anyway. That would be like me saying I smoked dope in college. Who cares? A lot of folks on this forum seem quite paranoid of the law and law enforcement. Unless you are doing something that could get you into very serious trouble (i.e. owning NFA weapons illegally for instance), mentioning mere misdemeanors publically is meaningless. I'm sure someone's train adventure here is going to result in a full federal investigation. Who knows, maybe even the President will get involved... :uhoh:

AZkopper · Feb 23, 2010

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Lets not forget that nearly everyone here in AZ breaks the federal GFSZ laws when and commits a fed felony when they OC here without a CC permit and are within 1000' of a school.

Flat out, no one cares.

Pace · Feb 24, 2010

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mFonz77 · Feb 24, 2010

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Yeah, when I read that the first thing that came to my mind are the public transportation laws. I will Google it and come back and edit this post - I was under the impression that trains and busses were big no-no's, open or concealed.

AZkopper · Feb 24, 2010

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Pace wrote:

The GFSZ laws are almost unenforceable.

I'm glad your The Authority on what federal felonies are "enforceable" and which are not.

Have you every OC'd a loaded weapon down the street in AZ within 1000' of a school without a CWP?

Have you every driven your vehicle down the streets of AZ with a loaded weapon in your vehicle withouta CWP?

If so, you--along with 1000's of Arizonians every day--have committed a federal felony.

I'm really not concerned with CCing in a NP 57 hours before it became legal.

Pace · Feb 24, 2010

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mFonz77 · Feb 24, 2010

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I looked through ARS and did not find anything prohibiting weapons on trains or busses. However, I did see one clause defining a "public" place as including any type of transportation owned by the state. Is the Grand Canyon Railroad operated by the NPS or using any state funds (I've never heard of them before, sorry)?

I also just looked in the firearms portions (Title 13-31 etc.) so it might be in there somewhere else. Handgunlaw.us also did not list public transportation as prohibited in AZ.

Edited to add: I looked at Handgunlaw.us for Missouri, where it IS a felony to take a firearm onto a bus, leading me to beleive that this type of offense is defined at the state level, and therefore is not an offense in AZ.

JesseL · Feb 24, 2010

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Pace wrote:

No, I have never OC'ed into a GFSZ and will never do so.

Sure about that? I'm sure I do dang near every day. There are a lot of public schools around and 1000 feet is a fair distance.

I know for a fact that my city has hosted events that heavily emphasized open carry within 1000' of a school. Closer to 200' really.

Pace · Feb 24, 2010

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I live way in north phoenix and to be honest spend most of my time working at home, going to the grocery store, dealing with the kids and then when I have time I go out to the National Forrest which is a few minute drive.

When I'm driving, I'm "protected" by my conceal carry.

There is a School in the area, its 5000 feet according to a map from my house, and I never OC near it.

You could be right however, never know?

JesseL wrote:

Pace wrote:

No, I have never OC'ed into a GFSZ and will never do so.

Click to expand...

Sure about that? I'm sure I do dang near every day. There are a lot of public schools around and 1000 feet is a fair distance.

I know for a fact that my city has hosted events that heavily emphasized open carry within 1000' of a school. Closer to 200' really.

TylerEMT · Feb 26, 2010

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Pace wrote:

There is a School in the area, its 5000 feet according to a map from my

You're 5000 feet from the school but where does the school zone start? If you are within 1000 feet of the zone you are violating federal law... CCw or not...

Pace · Feb 27, 2010

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4000 feet, simple subtraction

JesseL · Feb 27, 2010

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Pace wrote:

4000 feet, simple subtraction

There's one thing that makes it a bit more complicated than that: The school isn't a single point on the map.

The campus may cover an area of several acres and it could be a pretty irregular shape to boot. To be in compliance with the law you need to be at least 1000' from the nearest edge.

Pace · Feb 27, 2010

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JesseL · Feb 27, 2010

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You'd have a hard time proving that any gun has no effect on interstate commerce, ever since the Supreme Court ruling on Wickard v. Filburn in 1942, reaffirmed by Gonzales v. Raich in 2005, and applied specifically to firearms by US v. Stewart in 2005.

Now I don't agree with all that, but it's what the USSC says.

If anyone ever gets prosecuted under the Gun Free school Zone Act again, they'd have much better chances in their case by arguing that the effect of carrying a firearm within 1000' feet of a school has no effect on interstate commerce than they would by arguing that the law doesn't apply because that particular firearm never moved in interstate commerce. That's the way it was won in 1995s US v. Lopez that resulted in the original 1990 GFSZ Act being struck down. Odds are that the language citing the commerce clause in the reenacted 1996 version of the law would be seen by the court as the flimsy reasoning that it is.

I'm not a lawyer, but I've dug through this aspect of the law enough to get a pretty good handle on it for a layman.

Grand Canyon Railroad pro-OC

AZkopper

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Decoligny

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AZkopper

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Sonora Rebel

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heliopolissolutions

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protector84

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AZkopper

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Pace

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mFonz77

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AZkopper

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Pace

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mFonz77

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JesseL

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Pace

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TylerEMT

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Pace

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JesseL

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Pace

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JesseL

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