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Carrying in a vehicle

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peachman

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[align=left]Hi al,[/align]
[align=left]Newbie to the site, great info.. Thanks to all[/align]
[align=left]Based on the following section (ii), does this mean that I can have my loaded hand gun sitting on the seat, dash or in the glove box as long as I'm in the vehicle?[/align]
[align=left]Thank you,[/align]
[align=left]JT[/align]
[align=left](a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any[/align]
[align=left]vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a[/align]
[align=left]concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's[/align]
[align=left]person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times[/align]
[align=left]that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from[/align]
[align=left]the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and[/align]
[align=left]concealed from view from outside the vehicle.[/align]

 
Aryk45XD

Aryk45XD

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only if you have a license to carry concealed. There is an "and" in there.

edited to add: It's right before the conditions i ii OR iii.
 
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peachman

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Right, if I have a CPL, I can have the loaded hand gun sitting on the seatas long as I'm in the vehicle?

Thanks,

JT
 
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tyguy808

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peachman wrote:
Right, if I have a CPL, I can have the loaded hand gun sitting on the seat as long as I'm in the vehicle?

Thanks,

JT
Click to expand...

If you have a CPL, you can have it duct taped to your forehead and loaded. If you don't have a CPL, you can still have it duct taped to your forehead, it just has to be unloaded.
 
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peachman

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He he he!

Does the gun have to be on me or can it be sitting free on the seat next to me?

Sorry to continue this, I'm just trying to get clarification.

JT
 
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tyguy808

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No, it doesn't have to be on you. You could have it on the dash, in the glovebox, in the console or the trunk. It can only be loaded in any of those situations if you have a CPL. IF YOU don't it has to be unloaded.

BTW, loaded means cartridges in a magazine in the gun or chamber if it is a pistol. Cartridges in the cylindr if it is. Revolver.

Washington has no requirement on how far ammunition js to be from the weapon, just not in the weapon.
 
Lammo

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peachman wrote:
He he he!

Does the gun have to be on me or can it be sitting free on the seat next to me?

Sorry to continue this, I'm just trying to get clarification.

JT
Click to expand...
Here is the statute copied directly from the state's website:

RCW 9.41.050 (2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.

IAAL and I have always read the "or" between sub ii and sub iii as only modifying those two subsections. That is, it allows a loaded pistol to be left in a vehicle so long as it is concealed but that it must be "on the licensee's person" if the licensee is within the vehicle.

So, I did some checking and could not find a case that directly addressed the issue. I did, however, finda Washington Practice section and a case that addressed a prior version of the law. That section notes: "Laws of 1961, ch. 124, § 4. The licensing statute was also amended at this time to eliminate the issuance of licenses for the carrying of a pistol in a vehicle. Laws of 1961, ch. 124, § 6. These amendments were subsequently interpreted to permit the carrying of a pistol in a vehicle only if the pistol was unloaded or the pistol was carried on the person of an individual who had a license therefor." (emphasis added)

The case is: State v. Ray, 23 Wn. App. 238, 595 P. 2d 56 (1979), It says: "On January 25, 1977, defendant's automobile was stopped by a Kitsap County Deputy Sheriff for a speeding violation. As the deputy approached the vehicle, he noticed a pistol located on a shelf below the glove compartment of the car. An examination of this weapon revealed it to be loaded.SNIP Defendant was in possession of a license which permitted the carrying of a concealed weapon. SNIP The clear legislative intent is to permit the carrying of a pistol in a vehicle only if the pistol is unloaded or the pistol is carried on the person of an individual who has a license therefor." (emphasis added)

I would not advise having a loadedpistol sitting loose on the seat or on the dashboard and not only because that action might violate 9.41.050. The main reason is that I would not want your pistol to become a missile in the event of a collision. Secondarily, I would not want it obvious and available to someone who might hop into your car and drive it away (say while you are at a gas pump cleaning your windows having left the keys in it - - don't tell me it couldn't happen). REAL WORLD APPLICATION: Are you going to get hassled if your loaded pistol is secured in the glove box or console instead of on your person? I guess it depends on a) the LEO you encounter and b) the attitude you present to said LEO but I believe the letter of the law requires your loaded pistol to be on your person.

P.S. - - I would also not advise duct taping a loaded pistol toyour forehead. If you do your encounter with LEO may lead to ESH or WSH.
 
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Ruger9mm

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So is unloaded in the glove box without a permit ok? I have an Oregon CHL and travel to Washington frequently. I'm planning on getting a Washington license next month. I'm asking because in Oregon it can't be concealed in the car without a permit.
 
gogodawgs

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Ruger9mm wrote:
So is unloaded in the glove box without a permit ok? I have an Oregon CHL and travel to Washington frequently. I'm planning on getting a Washington license next month. I'm asking because in Oregon it can't be concealed in the car without a permit.
Click to expand...
Yes, unloaded anywhere in the vehicle is fine. Magazine can be right next to the firearm.
 
Lammo

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Ruger9mm wrote:
So is unloaded in the glove box without a permit ok? I have an Oregon CHL and travel to Washington frequently. I'm planning on getting a Washington license next month. I'm asking because in Oregon it can't be concealed in the car without a permit.
Click to expand...
gogodawgs is correct but also remember unloaded in Washington also requires the chamber to be empty - - it's not enough to just remove the magazine.
 
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Ruger9mm

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Thank you both. I knew I had to clear the chamber too. Pain it the backside but I'll live with it until I get a Washington license.
 
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Dave Workman

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However, In a letter dated March 3, 1987 to then-Sen. Kent Pullen, Senior Assistant Attorney General Richard A. Heath wrote, in response to an inquiry about carry in a vehicle under RCW 9.41.050, "...the plain language of the statute, internal consistency and legislative intent all require an affirmative answer to your question. RCW 9.41.050 permits a person who possesses a valid concealed weapon permit, and who is within a vehicle, to legally possess a loaded pistol within the vehicle which is not on his or her person."
 
Lammo

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tyguy808 wrote:
Thanks Dave..... I knew someone else seen it my way! So, does that mean I can go buy a new roll of duct tape?
Click to expand...
See my previous comment about ESH/WSH. I may not be right about much else but I think I've got that one taped, er, nailed down. :)
 
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tyguy808

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Lammo wrote:
tyguy808 wrote:
Lammo wrote:
ESH/WSH.
Click to expand...
?? I'm abbreviation stupid!
Click to expand...
Sorry. ESH = Eastern State Hospital. WSH = Western State Hospital. :)
Click to expand...
Ahh, okay, I get it! I grew up in Hawaii, so I didn't know about these places. I don't think its a good idea to tape it to your forehead, I'm just saying that it would be legal(ish). Plus, I've got better uses for duct tape, I think my muffler is falling off! Its a Hawaii thing!
 
Lammo

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tyguy808 wrote:
Lammo wrote:
tyguy808 wrote:
Lammo wrote:
ESH/WSH.
Click to expand...
?? I'm abbreviation stupid!
Click to expand...
Sorry. ESH = Eastern State Hospital. WSH = Western State Hospital. :)
Click to expand...
Ahh, okay, I get it! I grew up in Hawaii, so I didn't know about these places. I don't think its a good idea to tape it to your forehead, I'm just saying that it would be legal(ish). Plus, I've got better uses for duct tape, I think my muffler is falling off! Its a Hawaii thing!
Click to expand...
Rules for life, even here on the mainland: If it moves and it shouldn't, duct tape. If it doesn't move and it should, WD-40.
 
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tyguy808

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kparker wrote:
If it moves and it shouldn't, duct tape. If it doesn't move and it should, WD-40.
Click to expand...
... AND, if neither duct tape nor WD-40 fixes it, then you shouldn't have bought it in the first place.
Click to expand...
Don't forget....
If it won't go into that hole, get a bigger f'in hammer.
 
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