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Thread: From out of state

  1. #1
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    I'm from out of state but vacation in the UP every summer as my family has property there. Does MI require a permit for open carry? Also, just so I know for sure, I will be getting a non resident CCW permit from PA. That will not be recognized by MI since I am not a PA resident?

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    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    What state are you from? I suspect Wisconsin... if that is the case then you cannot OC in MI because Wisconsin does not provide a pistol registration and in MI you must have a pistol registered to you or a Resident CPL or it's equivalent in order to even have the pistol in the state.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

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    Yes, I'm from Wisconsin. I guess I'll just have to stay on our properties with my sidearm.

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    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    ffemt1079 wrote:
    Yes, I'm from Wisconsin. I guess I'll just have to stay on our properties with my sidearm.
    Does the following apply to you?

    MCL 28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol . . .


    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following
    conditions apply:
    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a). . . .
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    You CANNOT even have a PISTOL in the state of MI much less carry it if you are from WI.

    I am not saying this to be a pain but to keep you from getting jammed up.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

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    Couldn't he carry a long gun?
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Regular Member lil_freak_66's Avatar
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    autosurgeon wrote:
    What state are you from? I suspect Wisconsin... if that is the case then you cannot OC in MI because Wisconsin does not provide a pistol registration and in MI you must have a pistol registered to you or a Resident CPL or it's equivalent in order to even have the pistol in the state.
    if he is getting a non resident PA permit,wouldnt that be considered equivalent to a resident permit for this purpose?
    not a lawyer, dont take anything i say as legal advice.


  8. #8
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    No BC MI does not recognize non resident permits.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  9. #9
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    Michigander wrote:
    Couldn't he carry a long gun?
    Yes
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

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    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; citation as “Janet Kukuk act”.
    Sec. 12.

    (1) Section 2 does not apply to any of the following:

    (a) A police or correctional agency of the United States or of this state or any subdivision of this state.

    (b) The United States army, air force, navy, or marine corps.

    (c) An organization authorized by law to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state.

    (d) The national guard, armed forces reserves, or other duly authorized military organization.

    (e) A member of an entity or organization described in subdivisions (a) through (d) for a pistol while engaged in the course of his or her duties with that entity or while going to or returning from those duties.

    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.

    (g) The regular and ordinary transportation of a pistol as merchandise by an authorized agent of a person licensed to manufacture firearms or a licensed dealer.

    (h) Purchasing, owning, carrying, possessing, using, or transporting an antique firearm. As used in this subdivision, "antique firearm" means that term as defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    (i) An individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting a pistol belonging to another individual, if the other individual's possession of the pistol is authorized by law and the individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting the pistol has obtained a license under section 5b to carry a concealed pistol or is exempt from licensure as provided in section 12a.

    (2) The amendatory act that added subsection (1)(h) shall be known and may be cited as the "Janet Kukuk act".




    History: 1927, Act 372, Eff. Sept. 5, 1927 ;-- CL 1929, 16761 ;-- CL 1948, 28.432 ;-- Am. 1964, Act 216, Eff. Aug. 28, 1964 ;-- Am. 2000, Act 381, Eff. July 1, 2001 ;-- Am. 2004, Act 99, Imd. Eff. May 13, 2004 ;-- Am. 2006, Act 75, Eff. July 1, 2006 ;-- Am. 2008, Act 195, Eff. Jan. 7, 2009


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    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    So springer you feel that a person can OC in MI with a permit to carry from any state even if they are not a resident of the issuing state?

    I am not being smart just wondering if that is your take on what you posted?
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  12. #12
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    autosurgeon wrote:
    So springer you feel that a person can OC in MI with a permit to carry from any state even if they are not a resident of the issuing state?

    I am not being smart just wondering if that is your take on what you posted?
    DanM posted the pertinent part of 28.422 (Section 2) that applies to non-residents of Michigan where a license is required to purchase handguns: e.g. FOID or LTP.

    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:

    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.

    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).

    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.

    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency in this state.

    Unfortunately, this Section (8) does not apply to Wisconsin residents. Therefore, the only way, if any, that a person from Wisconsin can OC in Michigan is to: From Section 12 (28.432)

    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.

    Subdivision (f) does not specify a license/permit from state of residence.



  13. #13
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    That is interesting.... what I get from it is a Wisconsin resident could OC with a PA CPL but could not conceal as the MI CPL law does not recognize non resident permits... hmmm very interesting.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  14. #14
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    autosurgeon wrote:
    That is interesting.... what I get from it is a Wisconsin resident could OC with a PA CPL but could not conceal as the MI CPL law does not recognize non resident permits... hmmm very interesting.
    That's the way I understand it. 750.231a still applies where the non-resident must have a license/permit from their home state to CC on foot or in a vehicle in Michigan.

  15. #15
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    autosurgeon wrote:
    So springer you feel that a person can OC in MI with a permit to carry from any state even if they are not a resident of the issuing state?

    I am not being smart just wondering if that is your take on what you posted?
    This seems to be the case. This was discussed ad nasueum some time back. If a non-resident has a CPL from a state other than their own they can possess a handgun in Michigan, they just can't conceal it.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Interesting, and section (b) seems to indicate that they would also be under different ID rules as well, meaning they would have to carry their permit with them in order to fulfill the requirements of the ordinance?

    So 28.432 allows for possession/transport but only with a FOID, or non-resident CPL in the case of a WI resident where there is no registration law - and by extension, that would allow for Open Carry, because it would be under MI law a legally possessed firearm used in a lawful way, while in the CPL statute, reciprocity guidelines would not allow Concealment with non-resident permit, interesting...

  17. #17
    Regular Member Yooper's Avatar
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    Anyone tried contacting their pro-gun rep/senator and have them ask the AG for an official opinion? Both of mine are "pro"-gun Democrats, and while they won't vote for any restrictions, they probably wouldn't help by doing such a thing either.
    Rand Paul 2016

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Contact Mike Cox, Michigan's AG miag@michigan.gov
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
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    God Bless

  19. #19
    Regular Member Yooper's Avatar
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    eastmeyers wrote:
    Contact Mike Cox, Michigan's AG miag@michigan.gov
    As far as I know, they won't give an official opinion to a regular person, it has to be requested by either someone in the legislature, or (maybe?) someone in the government.
    Rand Paul 2016

  20. #20
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    Thanks for the info so far! I definately appreciate it.

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  22. #22
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    ffemt, you need to edit and delete the three paragraphs in your above post and carefully review page 1 again.

  23. #23
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    Reviewed page one. Still no information on MCL 28.432a that does state the license is from the person's resident state.

  24. #24
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    ffemt1079 wrote:
    Reviewed page one. Still no information on MCL 28.432a that does state the license is from the person's resident state.
    MCL 28.432a is irrelevant. See 28.432

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