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Thread: Welcome to OCDO Uncommon

  1. #1
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    First off I'd like to welcome Uncommon to the forum.

    Since the How do you deal with an anti wife? thread is getting hi-jacked I figured Uncommon's questions and comments would be better answered and discussed in their own thread instead of derailing that other thread.

    To everyone: let's keep it civil. I'm giving everyone, including Uncommon, the benefit of a doubt that we are all intelligent and civil people capable of engaging in a discussion with out resorting to name calling, insults, or other rude and impolite behavior. Instead of attacking each other I would like for us to have a civil discussion. If we can not keep it civil I will request that the thread be locked by one of the mods.

    Thanks.

    P.S. As my lunch break is just about over I'm going to try and make another post to discuss some of Uncommon's points real quick. If I don't get it finished I'll try to respond later tonight or tomorrow. - I didn't get a chance to post a reply. I'll try and post one either later tonight or tomorrow.

    [Edited to fix spelling issues]

  2. #2
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    Uncommon you are welcome to join us at one of our OC meets and discuss your point of view. Personally I always love a good debate. As long as everyone stays civil.

  3. #3
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    Uncommon wrote:
    "So why go calling people "trolls" and suggesting banning them for disagreeing with you? And here you thought you lived in a democracy.... COMMIE!"

    If you don't already know (I'm sure you do), it was because of your method of disagreement. Calling people names, or making fun of the majority of the forum is usually frowned upon.

    Also, not to disagree with Wylde about your 1st amend rights, but this is a private forum and as such they do not generally apply here. As long as you post in a manner respectful of yourself and others I'm sure you can say whatever you wish, and we would love to discuss it.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Uncommon wrote:
    Guns = false security blanket.

    I could post countless links to show where someone was killed in their own home with their own gun, or killed by intruders & never got to their guns in time, etc. In some cases even under the pillow. A whole lot of good it brought them. The best example: one guy was killed during a home invasion by thieves stealing his GUN COLLECTION! Their entire reason for being there!
    Then I challenge you--I DARE YOU--to do so. Please, do, post all those countless documentable news reports of incidents where armed homeowners had their own guns used against them. I'll wait...

    Meanwhile, I'll post a few stories about people who's lives were saved because they successfully defended themselves with their legally-owned firearms against thugs and criminals:

    http://www.starbeacon.com/local/loca...047193255.html

    http://www.wjla.com/news/stories/0109/585528.html

    http://www.wapt.com/news/22403309/detail.html

    http://www.kmox.com/pages/6199704.php?

    http://www.wwltv.com/news/local/St-R...-79415882.html

    http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2...uth-shore.html

    http://www.ocregister.com/news/gun-2...wner-year.html


    And "Range day is a family activity"? Oh how does that go?
    My grandfather gave me his antique Ithaca .22 rifle when I was 10 years old. He and my father took me out to the back part of his farm that Saturday afternoon and we went through a couple boxes of ammo, and they taught me proper and safe firearms handling. My first "family range day" is one of my most cherished memories of my paternal grandfather...

    I have taught one of my daughters to shoot. She was 23 at the time, and had never handled a firearm. At first she was a little nervous, and although my .45 was just TOO much gun for her to be comfortable with, she REALLY enjoyed shooting my .22 (that same .22 my grandfather gave to me over 30 years ago!). Her whole attitude about firearms changed that day. Now that she is more familiar with firearms, and knows she can handle one safely and proficiently, she has no issues with me carrying, or having them around. Before she went to the range, she was always a borderline "anti". Not any more. Now, I know she could defend herself if she needed to, AND she enjoys sport shooting too! Any tie she comes to NC to visit (she lives in the Peoples Republic of Maryland, in the Gulag of Baltimore), she always asks me to take her to the range and shoot...

    I was an Eagle Scout. Many of my best memories from summer camps are related to afternoons on the rifle range at Camp Leatherwood. Our CRSO was a gruff, hardened retired Marine Master Sergeant. He ran a TIGHT ship on his range, but he taught me a LOT about safety, and he helped me get one of my first merit badges--Rifle & Shotgun Shooting.

    I understand you are an "anti". I respect your 1A right to voice your opinion, regardless of how illogical, irrational, or full of nosense it is. HOWEVER, the 1A does NOT include lies, slander, or fraudulent information.

    I'd suggest that if you are going to make all these wild, generalized claims, you need to provide reliable citations.

    The CDC report that you quote is one of those dubious exercises in statistical manipulation that the Brady Bunch likes to throw around, and has been thoroughly discredited by REAL scholars in the field. What they DON'T tell you in that report is how they arrived at that number. First, they include suicide. So when they say you are 4.9 times more likely to be killed by your own firearm, they are INCLUDING the people who kill THEMSELVES with a firearm, which make up about 99% of deaths where someone is killed by their own firearm. Of the TOTAL firearms-related deaths in the US each year, about 60% are suicides, according to the CDC and BJS.

    It is, in fact, incredibly rare for gun-owners to be killed by their own firearms.

    It is also VERY rare for children (and I mean REAL children, not 15-20 year old crack-dealing gang bangers, which are included in the Brady Bunch's "Child Death" numbers) to be killed with accidental or negligent discharges. In fact, according to the CDC, a child under the age of 12 is MUCH more likely to die from a traffic accident, accidental drowning, falling, or poisoning than from an AD or ND.

    http://www.anesi.com/accdeath.htm

    http://volokh.com/posts/1205343824.shtml


    And according to BJS, ALL homicides have been SIGNIFICANTLY dropping since 1993, and are, in fact, down to nearly 40% the rates of 1993...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Us...esbyweapon.svg

    As are death rates for ALL age groups, but the REALLY dramatic reduction in deaths is the 14-24 age range. Interestingly enough, according to BJS, death rates in the "under 14" age range has remained essentially flat, below 2 per 100,000 since the'yve been keeping records on the national level since 1976...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Homoffendersbyage.svg

    Go do your homework, child. We don't mind a contrary opinion here--heck, I LOVE a good debate. But generally will only engage in discussion with a properly equipped opponent, and you, sir appear to be intellectually defenseless...

    When you come to an intellectual debate armed with only lies, twisted data, meaningless propaganda, and emotive talking points, you're not going to get a lot of love ANYWHERE...

    In other words, don't bring an (exacto) knife (that you use to manipulate the statistics) to a gun (rights) fight...

    Especially on this forum, because, son, I'll tell you what, some of us are pretty darn crafty with Goggle and the library. Heck, some of us have Masters degrees and PhD.s, and IQ's edging into the 160's.

    Take your propaganda somewhere else. We're only interested in FACTS here, sonny boy...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  5. #5
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    Well said Dreamer. I learned a few things reading that too
    "In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." - Mark Twain

    I don't bother with pragmatic statistics while discussing my constitutional rights. The issue is far less complex, to me. Free men should be able to act like free men.

  6. #6
    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    diesel556 wrote:
    Also, not to disagree with Wylde about your 1st amend rights, but this is a private forum and as such they do not generally apply here.
    Heck, I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt... not that he deserved it.

    And, well said, Dreamer.
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

  7. #7
    Campaign Veteran ComradeV's Avatar
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    Luke 22:36 (King James Version)


    Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.


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    Dreamer wrote:
    Uncommon wrote:
    9-1-1= false security blanket.
    My 1911 isn't a false security blanket. When I pull the trigger it goes bang and sends a chunk of metal into someone intending to do me harm. That isn't FALSE to me.

    "I could post countless links to show where someone was killed in their own home with their own gun,..."
    and that many more where homeowners killed and intruder/rapist/burglar/violent ex-boyfriend/etc.

    ...never got to their guns in time, etc. In some cases even under the pillow. A whole lot of good it brought them.
    Should be apply the same logic to fire extinguishers and spare tires? There's countless news stories of people who never made it to the fire extinguisher before dying of smoke inhalation. Some who did couldn't get the fire put out.

    one guy was killed during a home invasion by thieves stealing his GUN COLLECTION! Their entire reason for being there!
    My friend had a home invasion and they stole his COIN COLLECTION. He lost several thousand dollars in gold coins. They knew he had them and that was their reason for the home invasion.

    I agree with you. We should ban fire extinguishers and gold coins. Personally, I think an individual should be allowed to decide if they want the opportunity to defend themselves or not. If you don't want a gun in your home then that is your right and your option

    .





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    I do not want to hi-jacked this thread away from Uncommon,

    But Dreamer, do you still have the Ithaca .22 rifle, because I bet thats a sweet lil rifle.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Redwolf,

    Yes I still have it. Yes, it is sweet. I will most likely NEVER get rid of it, except to pass it on to a future grandchild. This rifle has been in my family longer than I've been alive, and I intend to keep it in my family even after I'm gone...

    It's a single-shot, Single-action-only, Ithaca M-49. It's a little on the heavy side for it's size, the sights are stock and very simple, and the finish is a little worn in places. But the action is tight and smooth, it has about the same recoil as an airgun, and it is surprisingly accurate, out to about 50 yards.

    And once you figure out the "Kentucky windage", it can even score accurate hits at 100 yards--I know firsthand--I shot my first groundhog with it resting against the fender of my dad's Chevy pickup truck when I was about 13, at about 100 yards, using Winchester "white box" copper-washed hollowpoints back in the day. Little did I know that that amazing shot would COMPLETELY destroy any hopes I had of ever getting my dad to buy me a scope for it...

    In fact, I just shot it a few weeks ago, and it is every bit as accurate, reliable and fun to shoot as it was when I was a kid (and that was a LONG time ago!)
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  11. #11
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    I don't think uncommon wants to play any more.

  12. #12
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    It doesn't appear as though he does. I would have thought that he would relish having a whole thread dedicated to him but I guess he didn't want to step up to the plate, or he is incapable of being civil.

  13. #13
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    Dreamer, Thats a very nice looking rifle. Glad you still have it. I perfer lever action rifles. I had a 32-20 when I was young, someone broke into the house and took it along with an old ithaca double barrel shotgun. I miss both of them.

  14. #14
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    wish we could liquidate felonies they are so very annoying, tragic, and frustrating

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