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Good Cop Bad Cop

Big Gay Al

Big Gay Al

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Messages
1,944
Location
Mason, Michigan, USA
imported post

Leader wrote:
Big Gay Al wrote:
Leader wrote:
In more then 50 years driving around MI., I have been stopped quite a few times for one thing or another. I have gotten very few tickets. Most of that time I didn't have a CPL and I have seen no difference in whether I get a ticket or not before or after. If I am not carrying, I just don't mention my permit.

And as far as I can see, the officers haven't been in more danger because I didn't mention it. Nor have they been ANY safer when I did.
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That's certainly you're call, but I know of at least one person, who was not packing, has a CPL, and got berated by the cop when they didn't reveal they had a CPL initially to the officer, even though they weren't packing.

If I should happen to not be packing (not bloody likely) and get stopped, I think I'd still inform them of my CPL, just so they don't jump to the wrong conclusion when they run my DL.

But again, everyone makes their own choices in that situation. Personally, I never go anywhere without my pistol, so it's not an issue for me.
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So your answer to the police not knowing the law and berating a citizen for no reason is to bow down and kiss his a**? Why wouldn't you report him?

You are telling me that you condone his actions and believe you should be required to do things that accomplish nothing.

Most states don't have any silly requirement to notify officers that you are armed because it serves no purpose.
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Thanks to our state legislature, Michigan is not "most states." And, as I already pointed out, this is never going to happen to me, as I carry all the time, everywhere I go. So if I am stopped while driving, I am obligated to inform.

So, what's the point?
 
Grapeshot

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
imported post

Big Gay Al wrote:
Thanks to our state legislature, Michigan is not "most states." And, as I already pointed out, this is never going to happen to me, as I carry all the time, everywhere I go. So if I am stopped while driving, I am obligated to inform.

So, what's the point?
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Even on this forum, not knowing all of the rules is hardly an affirmative defense, is it? :)

Yata hey
 
Big Gay Al

Big Gay Al

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Messages
1,944
Location
Mason, Michigan, USA
imported post

Grapeshot wrote:
Big Gay Al wrote:
Thanks to our state legislature, Michigan is not "most states." And, as I already pointed out, this is never going to happen to me, as I carry all the time, everywhere I go. So if I am stopped while driving, I am obligated to inform.

So, what's the point?
Click to expand...
Even on this forum, not knowing all of the rules is hardly an affirmative defense, is it? :)

Yata hey
Click to expand...
On this forum, Rule no. 1, NEVER admit to kissing LEO ass. Regardless of your reason for doing so, (and in spite of the fact that it's your choice, and your call at the time.) certain people will take the opportunity to insult, bait, cajole, or otherwise draw you into a useless debate about what you did wrong, when essentially, you did nothing wrong.

But yeah, you're correct. Not knowing the rules is not an affirmative defense. :)
 
G

Guest

Guest
imported post

Grapeshot wrote:
Big Gay Al wrote:
Thanks to our state legislature, Michigan is not "most states." And, as I already pointed out, this is never going to happen to me, as I carry all the time, everywhere I go. So if I am stopped while driving, I am obligated to inform.

So, what's the point?
Click to expand...
Even on this forum, not knowing all of the rules is hardly an affirmative defense, is it? :)

Yata hey
Click to expand...
Huh?
 
Big Gay Al

Big Gay Al

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Messages
1,944
Location
Mason, Michigan, USA
imported post

CV67PAT wrote:
Grapeshot wrote:
Big Gay Al wrote:
Thanks to our state legislature, Michigan is not "most states." And, as I already pointed out, this is never going to happen to me, as I carry all the time, everywhere I go. So if I am stopped while driving, I am obligated to inform.

So, what's the point?
Click to expand...
Even on this forum, not knowing all of the rules is hardly an affirmative defense, is it? :)

Yata hey
Click to expand...
Huh?
Click to expand...
Yeah, I know. Took me a couple of minutes to figure out too. ;)
 
Grapeshot

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
imported post

Big Gay Al wrote:
CV67PAT wrote:
Grapeshot wrote:
Big Gay Al wrote:
Thanks to our state legislature, Michigan is not "most states." And, as I already pointed out, this is never going to happen to me, as I carry all the time, everywhere I go. So if I am stopped while driving, I am obligated to inform.

So, what's the point?
Click to expand...
Even on this forum, not knowing all of the rules is hardly an affirmative defense, is it? :)

Yata hey
Click to expand...
Huh?
Click to expand...
Yeah, I know. Took me a couple of minutes to figure out too. ;)
Click to expand...
Big Gay Al lives in Michigan which is a "must notify" state. He was criticized in impolite terms for giving in to the LEO.

Leader obviously did not know the application of the law here and did not cite his contention that notification was not required. He was harshly critical of Big Al's response.

As I see it the only defense any of us might for these transgressions is that we meant no harm, hadn't done any real damage and would volunteer for community service as an alternative. The primary reason being trying to keep recommended response methods straight. As an affirmative defense that covers most of the bases IMHO. :p :)

So yes guilty - either innocent due to accepted affirmative defense or penalty limited to time served. Your option. :lol:

Yata hey
 
L

Leader

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2006
Messages
274
Location
Livingston Co., Michigan, , USA
imported post

Grapeshot wrote:

Big Gay Al lives in Michigan which is a "must notify" state. He was criticized in impolite terms for giving in to the LEO.

Leader obviously did not know the application of the law here and did not cite his contention that notification was not required. He was harshly critical of Big Al's response.

As I see it the only defense any of us might for these transgressions is that we meant no harm, hadn't done any real damage and would volunteer for community service as an alternative. The primary reason being trying to keep recommended response methods straight. As an affirmative defense that covers most of the bases IMHO. :p :)

So yes guilty - either innocent due to accepted affirmative defense or penalty limited to time served. Your option. :lol:

Yata hey

Actually I do know the aplication of the law. It says we only have to inform an officer *IF* we are carrying. For an officer to chew someone out for not telling him about haveing a CPL when NOT carrying is WRONG. The officer should be reported. BGA thinks we should run around telling everyone in uniform we have a permit even when we are not carrying because some officers don't k now the law. (or say they don't)
 
Big Gay Al

Big Gay Al

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Messages
1,944
Location
Mason, Michigan, USA
imported post

Leader wrote:
Grapeshot wrote:

Big Gay Al lives in Michigan which is a "must notify" state. He was criticized in impolite terms for giving in to the LEO.

Leader obviously did not know the application of the law here and did not cite his contention that notification was not required. He was harshly critical of Big Al's response.

As I see it the only defense any of us might for these transgressions is that we meant no harm, hadn't done any real damage and would volunteer for community service as an alternative. The primary reason being trying to keep recommended response methods straight. As an affirmative defense that covers most of the bases IMHO. :p :)

So yes guilty - either innocent due to accepted affirmative defense or penalty limited to time served. Your option. :lol:

Yata hey

Actually I do know the aplication of the law. It says we only have to inform an officer *IF* we are carrying. For an officer to chew someone out for not telling him about haveing a CPL when NOT carrying is WRONG. The officer should be reported. BGA thinks we should run around telling everyone in uniform we have a permit even when we are not carrying because some officers don't k now the law. (or say they don't)
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What I do and what you do are obviously two different things. And FYI, the "suggestion" to inform anyway, is not mine. It comes from the MSP. You can obviously do as you please. For myself, since I am always armed, it's a non-issue for me.
 
SlowDog

SlowDog

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2009
Messages
424
Location
Redford, Michigan, USA
imported post

I too am always armed so with me this is a nonissue but, I also try to keep from having interactions with LEO's....just sayin....:quirky:quirky
 
Big Gay Al

Big Gay Al

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Messages
1,944
Location
Mason, Michigan, USA
imported post

SlowDog wrote:
I too am always armed so with me this is a nonissue but, I also try to keep from having interactions with LEO's....just sayin....:quirky:quirky
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I don't mind friendly interactions. It's the business type interactions I object to. ;)
 
S

Savage.Detroit

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Messages
151
Location
Southwest Detroit, Michigan, USA
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Seems like this has been said already but here is the reference:
(3) An individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol and who is carrying a concealed pistol[/u] and who is stopped by a peace officer shall immediately disclose to the peace officer that he or she is carrying a pistol concealed upon his or her person or in his or her vehicle.
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http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(0d...eg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-28-425f


Per MCL, you are not required to disclose you have a CPL while not carrying. Although, the LEO who taught my CPL class gave a good reason. According to him, once the LEO runs your DL he will know you have a CPL and will come back asking you about it most likely annoyed.

Another tid-bit he shared was that when he pulls someone over CCing he usually lets them go with a warning because (in his words) "I rather be the only one armed while writing a ticket".
 
Big Gay Al

Big Gay Al

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Messages
1,944
Location
Mason, Michigan, USA
imported post

Savage.Detroit wrote:
Seems like this has been said already but here is the reference:
(3) An individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol and who is carrying a concealed pistol and who is stopped by a peace officer shall immediately disclose to the peace officer that he or she is carrying a pistol concealed upon his or her person or in his or her vehicle.
Click to expand...

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(0dsgyy55e2h51q55mkako5vu))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-28-425f


Per MCL, you are not required to disclose you have a CPL while carrying. Although, the LEO who taught my CPL class gave a good reason. According to him, once the LEO runs your DL he will know you have a CPL and will come back asking you about it most likely annoyed.

Another tid-bit he shared was that when he pulls someone over CCing he usually lets them go with a warning because (in his words) "I rather be the only one armed while writing a ticket".
Click to expand...
I think you forgot a word there, like "not." :
 
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