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Thread: The Telegragh - Growth in USA gun carry led by OpenCarry.org

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    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/ge...states-rights/

    SNIP

    Meanwhile, in reaction against the Obama administration’s perceived threat to the right to bear arms, the carrying of sidearms in public – legal in all but six states – is growing in popularity, led by the movement OpenCarry.org.

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    Interesting article, I see what he is saying, but we'll have to see. If anyone is shooting themselves in the foot, it's anti-gunners. Allowing an erosion of any freedom or right means ALL FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS are subject to legislative, judicial, andrestraint.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Mike wrote:
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/ge...states-rights/

    SNIP

    Meanwhile, in reaction against the Obama administration’s perceived threat to the right to bear arms, the carrying of sidearms in public – legal in all but six states – is growing in popularity, led by the movement OpenCarry.org.
    Should that not be "legal in all but seven states?"
    http://www.opencarry.org/opencarry.html

    June cannot come early enough.

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    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    7.5

    DC

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    eye95 wrote:
    7.5

    DC
    D.C. is not a state unless you consider it a State of Total Confusion. :?

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
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    Grapeshot wrote:
    eye95 wrote:
    7.5

    DC
    D.C. is not a state unless you consider it a State of Total Confusion. :?

    Yata hey
    OK, It's a state then. Without a doubt.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Wow, now we're a "movement". Just a few days ago we were "loosely organized".

    "...And friends, somewhere in Washington enshrined in some little folder, is a study in black and white of my fingerprints. And the only reason I'm singing you this song now is cause you may know somebody in a similar situation, or you may be in a similar situation, and if your in a situation like that there's only one thing you can do and that's walk into the shrink wherever you are ,just walk in say "Shrink, You can get anything you want, at Alice's restaurant.". And walk out. You know, if one person, just one person does it they may think he's really sick and they won't take him. And if two people, two people do it, in harmony, they may think they're both ******* and they won't take either of them. And three people do it, three, can you imagine, three people walking in singin a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out. They may think it's an organization. And can you, can you imagine fifty people a day,I said fifty people a day walking in singin a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out. And friends they may thinks it's a movement..."
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    tekshogun wrote:
    Interesting article, I see what he is saying, but we'll have to see. If anyone is shooting themselves in the foot, it's anti-gunners. Allowing an erosion of any freedom or right means ALL FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS are subject to legislative, judicial, andrestraint.
    I tend to agree with you tek. I believe that it's the anti's that are getting the self inflicted wounds in this battle for public opinion. Everyday that we go out in public OCIng our sidearms we expose the general public to the fact that non-leo citizens CAN go armed in public without any of the horrible events taking place that the anti-gun groups predict "with certainty" will ocur. We are quietly reaking irreparable damage to their credibility.

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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    tekshogun wrote:
    Interesting article, I see what he is saying, but we'll have to see. If anyone is shooting themselves in the foot, it's anti-gunners. Allowing an erosion of any freedom or right means ALL FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS are subject to legislative, judicial, andrestraint.
    I tend to agree with you tek. I believe that it's the anti's that are getting the self inflicted wounds in this battle for public opinion. Everyday that we go out in public OCIng our sidearms we expose the general public to the fact that non-leo citizens CAN go armed in public without any of the horrible events taking place that the anti-gun groups predict "with certainty" will ocur. We are quietly reaking irreparable damage to their credibility.
    IMO - only a true masochist would enjoy and endure the level of self-induced pain that they do.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Grapeshot wrote:
    Task Force 16 wrote:
    tekshogun wrote:
    Interesting article, I see what he is saying, but we'll have to see. If anyone is shooting themselves in the foot, it's anti-gunners. Allowing an erosion of any freedom or right means ALL FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS are subject to legislative, judicial, andrestraint.
    I tend to agree with you tek. I believe that it's the anti's that are getting the self inflicted wounds in this battle for public opinion. Everyday that we go out in public OCIng our sidearms we expose the general public to the fact that non-leo citizens CAN go armed in public without any of the horrible events taking place that the anti-gun groups predict "with certainty" will ocur. We are quietly reaking irreparable damage to their credibility.
    IMO - only a true masochist would enjoy and endure the level of self-induced pain that they do.

    Yata hey
    It begs one to ask, "Just who are the "nuts" and "whackos", anyway?"

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    Grapeshot wrote:
    Task Force 16 wrote:
    tekshogun wrote:
    Interesting article, I see what he is saying, but we'll have to see. If anyone is shooting themselves in the foot, it's anti-gunners. Allowing an erosion of any freedom or right means ALL FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS are subject to legislative, judicial, andrestraint.
    I tend to agree with you tek. I believe that it's the anti's that are getting the self inflicted wounds in this battle for public opinion. Everyday that we go out in public OCIng our sidearms we expose the general public to the fact that non-leo citizens CAN go armed in public without any of the horrible events taking place that the anti-gun groups predict "with certainty" will ocur. We are quietly reaking irreparable damage to their credibility.
    IMO - only a true masochist would enjoy and endure the level of self-induced pain that they do.

    Yata hey
    It begs one to ask, "Just who are the "nuts" and "whackos", anyway?"

    A Psychiatrist Examines The Anti-Gun Mentality


    http://www.vcdl.org/new/raging.htm

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Krusty's Avatar
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    OC and Womens Suffrage

    I guess I equate OC'ing to women voting in America. It's something new and just had not been done before. When women first started voting there was lots of people watching and wondering too. Now that we OC there are lots of people watching and wondering. I guess the difference is that OC is much further up the ladder (Constitution) than Women's Suffrage, but it's still a right, not a privilege that the government was so kind to give us.

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    Howdy, ALL!

    hey, just got registered, felt compelled, I am Peat, from SE Oklahoma, and want to say "Hello" and Thanks fer havin' me, yup!

    In regards to the above song lyrics from "Alice's Restaraunt" . . . Arlo Guthrie, I believe, and like to say that his dad Woody, were both, in their own way, great Americans, Patriots, and Lovers of Freedom, too.

    I am scheduled for my Permit, but the local Instructor is down with the Cancer, out of the blue, and hasn't penciled in a return to business date, as of yet. It's hittin' close to home, as Retired Police Sgt. Joe Kirk is my Mom's first cousin, he is family, dammit, his mom, and my granny were sisters, and known 'em all my life. (Kirk's Gun Repair, Bennington, OK)
    (wish him a speedy recovery, but a recovery, so help us, Lord.)

    But, when carrying, according to Law, the LEO's that I've encountered, twice, 1st time went badly for me, but not too bad, did not go to jail, just got temporarily "cuffed and stuffed" lol. But the second time went by the book, and flawlessly, "here's your firearm sir, have a good evening . . .sorry to bother you, drive careful now"

    But, it must be carried in a "locked compartment" and "not within reach of driver", also, MUST NOT HAVE A Chambered round. Only thing that saved me, it is carried in the pickup toolbox, behind the cab, inside a dust proof container, then in a pistol bag, wrapped in a gun rag, reciever locked open, and magazines in a "separate" pocket than the pistol. 2 of the 5 magazines, in that pocket were full (15 rnds ea.) and a full box (9mm 125gr FMJ) was in the same pocket, with the magazines. (total, 80 rnds, on hand, at the time) But, out of my reach when driving, and no round CHAMBERED! Also, I found funny, all the LEO's spent time "sniffing" the pistol, lol, I suppose to verify that I had NOT Shot it, recently, heh, heh. Nope, she was clean, lol.

    OK, nuff said, wanted to interduce m'self, and pipe in, and hope the "politshuns" can get their heads on straight, 'fore we hafta take their heads off, lol . . . figuratively speaking, o'course, yup.

    Soon as I can, will achieve the Permit I've so longed for, if God wills it, and Joe gets better, and opens up shop again.

    Thnks again, fer havin' me, and be seeinya all!

    PeatMoss
    Last edited by PeatMoss; 08-02-2010 at 01:47 PM. Reason: spellin, and fleshin' out some content, why do you ask?

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Hey Peat -
    welcome aboard.

    I'm curious, why did the LEOs have your pistol out of its happy little legally-locked-away home?
    You're under no obligation to let them search your property.
    If they have a reason to search, they don't have to ask, and if they have to ask, they don't have a reason.

    (Of course, there are some police that say something to the effect of "stuff the 4th Amendment", & I've met some recently, but most follow the law.)

    Watch the videos available here: http://flexyourrights.org/

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    Regular Member okiephlyer's Avatar
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    Welcom aboard Peat,
    I live well outside Bryan county but work in Bryan county and travel a lot.
    You can find other instructors that run classes if you don't want to wait for your friend. If you want, PM me and I will check with the people I know and see what I can come up with.

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    MKE gal, they asked, and I complied, as I was taught. With nothing to hide, I'll let 'em look in my pickup, and in the toolbox, too, no problem, there, lol.

    Actually, one is to "declare the firearm" when approached by LEO's, in my understanding.

    oklaccer, thnx, fire away, if they are withina certain distance, I'll surely check them out. The reason I wanted to wait on Joe, is, he and know each other, and he is the Police Officer, once upon a time, that ran my "Brady Bill" background checks, when I bought several firearms, also, he told me once, that he would forego the 16 hours of classes, and just do the required paperwork, to get me my Permit.

    Thanks again for the welcome, and I'll check back in later today.

    SALUTE!

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    Regular Member simmonsjoe's Avatar
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    Nothing To Hide is a bogus idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeatMoss View Post
    MKE gal, they asked, and I complied, as I was taught. With nothing to hide, I'll let 'em look in my pickup, and in the toolbox, too, no problem, there, lol.

    Actually, one is to "declare the firearm" when approached by LEO's, in my understanding.

    oklaccer, thnx, fire away, if they are withina certain distance, I'll surely check them out. The reason I wanted to wait on Joe, is, he and know each other, and he is the Police Officer, once upon a time, that ran my "Brady Bill" background checks, when I bought several firearms, also, he told me once, that he would forego the 16 hours of classes, and just do the required paperwork, to get me my Permit.

    Thanks again for the welcome, and I'll check back in later today.

    SALUTE!
    This ******** idea of "nothing to hide" is degrading our rights. It is called Privacy. Why in Gods name would only those who AREN'T criminals not want it? "A right un-exercised is a right lost." People seem to forget that the 4th and 5th amendments were meant to protect INNOCENT people.
    illegal ≠ immoral legal ≠ moral
    [SIZE=1]"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. "Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent." - Thomas Jefferson
    G19 Gen 4; Bersa Thunder 380; Sig Sauer P238; Kel-Tec su-16c

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    Ok . . .

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    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simmonsjoe View Post
    This ******** idea of "nothing to hide" is degrading our rights. It is called Privacy. Why in Gods name would only those who AREN'T criminals not want it? "A right un-exercised is a right lost." People seem to forget that the 4th and 5th amendments were meant to protect INNOCENT people.
    +1

    Peat, I think you'll find that most people here agree with simmonsjoe. Why would you consent to have your belongings searched? The best possible outcome is that they find nothing. Just say no in the first place.

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    Yes, thank you, for the welcome, and the point you made is valid, good point.

    I believe, too, in "Right to Privacy" but, in certain scenarios, refusing to allow a cursory inspection of a vehicle can/will bring unto you more attention, and usually unfavorably.

    In my case, there was no search, I told them where, and how my gun was carried, and they confirmed, then returned the pistol, and said, "Have a good evenin . . ."

    I feel, in my own best interest, I will allow them to look, and then next time they run across me, in almost every case, they say, "Oh, Peat, Hi, go ahead, go ahead . . ."

    In the near future we may face a crisis situation, and it is better to have the Local LEO's, especially the Sheriffs Deputies I know, on my side, so to speak, eh? And I know several of them, either personally, or professionally. A couple, I've known since we were young uns.

    I once operated a Rollback Wrecker for a year, and worked closely with alot of LEO's. Made a ton of impounds for them, and cleaned up many, many wrecks. Made some good friends, and contacts, and keep in touch with a few of them, still.

    But, generally the Right to Privacy is concrete, but individually flexible, IMO. (I know, that's a contradiction in terms, oxymoronic?)

    OK, sorry if I get a bit windy, and thanks again, for the welcome.
    Last edited by PeatMoss; 08-07-2010 at 09:06 AM.

  21. #21
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    Never Give Consent to Search

    Quote Originally Posted by PeatMoss View Post
    MKE gal, they asked, and I complied, as I was taught. With nothing to hide, I'll let 'em look in my pickup, and in the toolbox, too, no problem, there, lol.

    Actually, one is to "declare the firearm" when approached by LEO's, in my understanding.

    oklaccer, thnx, fire away, if they are withina certain distance, I'll surely check them out. The reason I wanted to wait on Joe, is, he and know each other, and he is the Police Officer, once upon a time, that ran my "Brady Bill" background checks, when I bought several firearms, also, he told me once, that he would forego the 16 hours of classes, and just do the required paperwork, to get me my Permit.


    Thanks again for the welcome, and I'll check back in later today.

    SALUTE!
    As MKE gal says, if they don't need your consent, they won't ask, and if they do, do not give it to them. The problem is that you may believe that you have nothing to hide, but that does not make it so. What if a crime had been committed in the area by someone of approximately your description with a firearm that look a bit like yours? What if there is some obscure law that you don't know anything about? For example, in California, I believe that you cannot transport a gun in a "utility compartment" of a motor vehicle, and "utility compartment" is not defined. My point is that you cannot know all the laws or the information that the police have, so the best policy is never to give them permission to search your vehicle.

    My brother is a member of a State patrol, and he says that 80% of the people that they convict of crimes would never have been arrested if they just kept their mouth shut and did not give consent to search their vehicles.

  22. #22
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    Time to break out this golden oldie:


  23. #23
    Regular Member simmonsjoe's Avatar
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    I thought about posting that vid...

    But I try not to re-post the same thing links every single week. I have an aversion to it. Thanks for putting it up, as it is the quintessential response.
    illegal ≠ immoral legal ≠ moral
    [SIZE=1]"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. "Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent." - Thomas Jefferson
    G19 Gen 4; Bersa Thunder 380; Sig Sauer P238; Kel-Tec su-16c

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    Just got Smarter!

    Awesome session. The Professor, well, he's good! I could listen to him for HOURS!

    And the Officer, well, at first, I thought ill of his presentation, but, he got me at the end, he did . . . I didn't agree, at first, with his methods, and his loopholes to convict because he could lie, and make unknown phone recordings . . . but doing his job; convict the GUILTY!

    It was worth the watch, both those guys have my respect, and I now yearn to learn more of what they know, yup!

    Thanks, for enlightening me, I needed it, fer sure! Very interesting, and informing.

    Peat

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