imported post
Pace wrote:
Most of you guys seem to agree, ALL the government programs are a waste of money. The problem is that most of the people protesting health care, if you asked them to give away those benefits (social security, free education, etc) they would say "No, please don't touch those" and run away.
The majority of the plans in this country you are referring to, were certainly opposed during the time, and the Constitutionality of Social Security was tested back during Roosevelts administration at the supreme court level (
Helvering vs. Davis).
The outcome, was that the court simply denied to make a decision.
Interesting.
I think your generalization of "Protestors and tea-partiers" is not accurate whatsoever, and is an attempt to vilify the same unfairly, or somehow make your point "more logical" by painting them all as hypocrites.
So let me make one think clear on this front for you:
You can have my SS taxes, and my SS benefits. I do not want them, and would gladly give them up.
I am not on welfare. I do not like welfare. You can have it, and I would gladly give it up.
Public Education in this country, is terrible. One of the worst in the world. To even try to use this as a shining example of acceptability, is a fallacy.
Public transportation? LOL! This is not a federally funded system, and can be voted in or out at the local level! How does
opting to ride a bus, even remotely compare to being
forced to buy healthcare insurance?
Pace wrote:
We all have some form of socialism in this country, from public transportation to public schools. What are you willing to give up to give back?
Public transportation is NOT "Socialism", inasmuch that you pay a fee when you
choose to hop on! Ratification and all other forms of institution of Public Transit occurs at the STATE level or lower. This leaves it on local economy (City/State/Town) to oversee the inception and operation of these programs. Not Federal Government.
When these programs are created by the local economy, they are by definition
not socialist!
You cannot pin long ears on every farm animal , and call it a donkey for purposes of convenience!
Workers in this country have complained long and hard about the imposition of taxes from these various "government programs" since long before you or I were born! The rapid and increasing taxation is unreasonable. Back in 2007 with an income of 70k/yr, I found 21%+ of my paycheck DISAPPEARING into federal pockets, for programs I have never, and am likely to never use!
The way you are asking your questions, you are essentially saying:
"Things like Obamacare have existed in the past, whats one more thing?"
"You lost 21% of your paycheck before, what's 30-35% now?"
Those are some really crappy questions! ESPECIALLY in this economy.
I would like to add that the statements about other countries "having something we don't", that is thrown around by so many supporters of this bill, is another whiny statement derived from an entitlement mindset. It is like seeing another kid with a lollypop, and demanding you have one as well. Horrible mindset.
What's also apparent, especially in these other countries (I lived in Germany for 2 years, and had German friends), is they are taxed OUT THE POSTERIOR!
Also, there are specifics about their healthcare model, that is just flat out wrong.
Still, everyone wants the lollypop.