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Problem with wanting to OC in seattle/West Seattle

1245A Defender

1245A Defender

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BrownC6 wrote:
thanks everyone for all the replies i got an email mentioning a lawyer to ask from the SAF who specializes in this so i will see if i cant rack his brain a bit with this dilemma, i just want to be sure before carrying and one day suddenly be arrested for walking off the property and being too close to the school.
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why is this lawyer a secret???

couldnt we all benifit from knowing who a good lawyer is?
 
B

Brandnew

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So what constitutes "school premises"? Does that mean just the facility or any and all land surrounding it too? What about the sidewalk next to the grass of the school? I assume a school's baseball field is considered school premises?

I haven't been able to figure out just what that term means. Any definition of it in the RCW somebody can point to?
 
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BrownC6

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I have no idea if this guy even is a lawyer yet i just have an email for him ill find out what i can about him before getting into more with him just yet though there's not much to do till he emails back.
 
J

joeroket

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Django wrote:
amzbrady wrote:
NavyLT wrote:
Django wrote:
Don't get CPL and just O/C. As long as you don't go flashing your gat around should be fine. CPL just puts you on another list. It's your right to O/C
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Whether the law is right or wrong, it sure is a convenience not to have to unload the gun when getting in a vehicle, though.  And it is also a convenience to be able to cash and carry a handgun out of a gun store in the same day.
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+++1
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I already have a hand gun plus that's what gun shows are for.
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You apparently did not read the entire thread. You are suggesting that he violate federal law.
 
ak56

ak56

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Brandnew wrote:
So what constitutes "school premises"? Does that mean just the facility or any and all land surrounding it too? What about the sidewalk next to the grass of the school? I assume a school's baseball field is considered school premises?

I haven't been able to figure out just what that term means. Any definition of it in the RCW somebody can point to?
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RCW 9.41.280

(1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:


(7) "GUN-FREE ZONE" signs shall be posted around school facilities giving warning of the prohibition of the possession of firearms on school grounds.
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The RCW does not have a formal definition, but uses both the terms "school premises" and "school grounds". The common interpretation is that this refers to all of the property of the school, including any land surrounding it that is theproperty of the school.

I do know of at least one case where the ballfields at a school are actually a park, and not school property, so would not appear to be restricted, but I suspect that in most places they are school property. As far as the sidewalk - I wouldn't push it. I would just assume that it would be considered school property, but that's just me.
 
H

heresolong

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Federal law currently states:


(2) (A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone. (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm— (i) on private property not part of school grounds; (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license; (iii) that is— (I) not loaded; and (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
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School zone is defined as:

(25) The term "school zone" means— (A) in, or on the grounds of, a public, parochial or private school; or (B) within a distance of 1,000 feet from the grounds of a public, parochial or private school. (26) The term "school" means a school which provides elementary or secondary education, as determined under State law.
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http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

You are illegal if you do not have a CPL and carry through a school zone. There is a fair amount of legal literature suggesting that this law is no more Constitutional than the law that was overturned in 1995 but it has not, to date, been challenged. After the Chicago case is settled may be an appropriate time to challenge this.
 
K

kparker

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amzbrady,

Yes--RCW 9.41.280(3)(f):

(3) Subsection (1) of this section [the ban on school-grounds possession] does not apply to:... Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age legally in possession of a firearm or dangerous weapon that is secured within an attended vehicle or concealed from view within a locked unattended vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school;
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Note that this paragraph does not distinguish between loaded and unloaded, but you have to have a CPL to have a loaded handgun in your car in the first place.
 
amzbrady

amzbrady

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thank you, just wanted to show everyone how easy lamens terms with a link to the law makes it. this thread would be half the size and had an easy answer if we didnt overcomplicate and already overly complicated law. Amazing how much simple yes and no's go so much further than relentless puking of the law that can be read off the site.
 
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BrownC6

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Seattle, Washington, USA
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Ok so this guy is just out of law school and is actually kind of clueless with this.... back to square 1...... i just want to make sure walking down the side of the street i live on (across from the school) i will not be in violation of any laws.
 
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