Off Topic Loud radio laws?

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stainless1911 wrote:

Whats so wrong with a letter anyhow? Its non confrontational, there is zero chance of an argument, nothing you say can be turned in to something you diddnt say, You wont intimidate. And what could be safer than approaching a house full of hi-ons and drunken rowdy strangers in the middle of the night to complain about what they are doing?

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thats what the world wants us to be. sheeple! non confrontational! just do as we're told, not argue, not speak up.

If i have a problem with my neighbor, friend(s), etc... i'll go to them and talk to them about it. i wont go yell at them or anything, but introduce myself, etc.. and then state the facts. If they dont like it... and if they want to get nasty about it... then fine.

But I believe in the good old fashioned hand shake, talk, work things out.

Lets not be like the sheep.

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I haven't logged onto here for quite some time due to personal technical issues, and can't say that I'm happy to find this level of discussion here. Let me preface by saying that I am "that guy". The one that has dual 12" subwoofers in my trunk that are connected to an amplifier. I can, and have, shaken neighborhoods.

However, I do not do it at 2 am, that's just rude. Think on that for a minute, its "just rude." Its not very considerate of the feelings of others.

In my eyes, that made your letter, and your appeal to the manager (since they are doing this on private property he is a steward to), justified. When they continued to play the music at elevated levels during all hours (something I am unlikely to do, since I am more considerate than that) they showed you disrespect.

Being rude and disrespectful is not illegal though, so, in my eyes, contacting the police to enforce your personal views was uncalled for, and the results of those calls are exactly as they should be. There was no real crime here. No malicious intent todamage or deprive you of health, life, or property. The police were drawn away from more worthy pursuits, such ashammering down on that damnable OC crowd... who do they think they are anyway? Why goodness gracious, there ought to be a law against openly displaying firearms in public ! Its "just rude" they force us to see those scary things. "That guy" from last weekmade me uncomfortable... at least he listened to the manager I complained to at Private Mart and left when he was asked to.

But I digress.

In getting back on topic... Wait, I'm sorry... I just realized... Could it be they're both the same thing? Each case shows an example of the "nanny state" conditioning and high brow Gestapo tacticsresponsible for so much that is wrong in our society today. "Since Ididn't get the resultsI wanted, and I am offended, I am going to make that which offends me illegal... ...and I am going to make the offender pay!

Please understand sir, that while my message is harsh, I have noill will toward you, butI say all of this to make an appeal.Please Please PLEASE consider the full implications of your actions.

Now, in the spirit of teamwork, may I suggest an alternative course of action?

As I said I am "that guy". I enjoy having a heavy bass beat massaging my scalp asI drive. Were I to be accosted by the police for this, I too would be resentful. Here is what I know would appease me, and may provide you with some relief:

1. Go, in person, to your neighbors and apologize for mishandling what should have been a minor dispute.

2. Appeal to their sense of decency on why the music disturbs you at late hours i.e. "I have to get up at _a.m. forwork, and when the music wakes me I have trouble falling back to sleep, which is making it hard for me to get moving when I need to."

3. Suggest a compromise: "I'll quit complaining about the daytime noise since you obviously enjoy it, but would it be possible to..."

4. Thank them if they agree. If they tell you to <graphically stimulate> yourself, keep cool, thank them anyway for simply listening, and give it two weeks. They may think on what you said and tone it down on their own anyway.

5. If, at the end of two weeks there is still a problem (and one you feel worth fighting over), contact the community owner, not the manager, and complain that the manager is ignoring his stweardship, and with itthe reasonable expectation you have of a peaceful community. Give it another two weeks to see if any changes are effected. If not, do what I did to my loud neighbors...

... Visibly clean, load, and OC your pistol as you stare back at them.

*Edited for spelling, grammar, and inflammatory content.

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stainless1911 wrote:

Whats so wrong with a letter anyhow? Its non confrontational, there is zero chance of an argument, nothing you say can be turned in to something you diddnt say, You wont intimidate. And what could be safer than approaching a house full of hi-ons and drunken rowdy strangers in the middle of the night to complain about what they are doing?

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Stainless, if you have the coordinates his location, maybe you can get Hutaree to send a SCUD or something over that way.

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Oh yeah! Busting out the Hutaree reset!

It's not too soon, is it?

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I know this wont help much in MI and is still OT, but I wanted to share my story. It may give insight to the "car stereo punk" state of mind.

I built my stereo/show contest car from a 1996 king cab Nissan. The speaker box had to be cut and built into the king cab portion of the vehicle, it was giant. It used 1400 watts to power 6 rear speakers and 200 watts to 4 front door speakers. Custom paint job, custom seats, custom dashboard (for the 6 disk CD player and head unit), custom tailgate, custom carpet, everything was pristine by the end... It took over 2 years to "finalize" it. I was very proud of my work and the crisp sound, not just the bang-bang of the woofers. I often drove around central Florida and south Louisiana with windows down, stereo up, going to the beach or to a contest. Looking back now, I don't know how I'm not completely deaf.


When I was living in Orlando in 1998, I got 6 tickets in about 6 months related to my stereo system. The first two times where for "stereo audible greater that 30ft from vehicle". It was a FL state statute as I recall and it cost me 50 bucks each time. The last time I got it bad with the law because it was the same officer as the first time, and he "threw the book" at me. He wrote me 4 tickets total, one distracted driving (because I wouldn't be able hear approaching EMS or police vehicles sirens over the music) , one for "can't see in or out windows" (because of the tint), and my 3rd ticket for ">30ft from vehicle", and the bad one was disturbing the peace (in Winter Gardens, FL). That set of tickets cost me about $600. The one for disturbing the peace could have had me in deep trouble, the office told me he could have arrested me and impounded the vehicle for it, but he didn't. I had to appear for the "disturbing the peace" charge but I caught a break because it was before 10pm when the citation occurred and there was no complaining witnesses, so the court dropped it. I was kinda proud of my custom car, and the tickets I got. I actually laminated the last ticket and kept it in my glove box a couple years, showing it to friends, at car shows, and at "crank-it" contests. The money I won at a stereo contest in Daytona that summer covered all the tickets, plus some upgrades.


I sold the entire vehicle, sound and all, before a crank-it contest in Metairie, La in 2000. The guys that bought it, put it in the contest that same day, it took first place in show and the $1000 prize (i took the $6500 sale instead), but he blew out both of the 15" JBL sub woofers at a cost of over $1500!!! Then he wanted to sell it back to me. I caught a ride back to Slidell that night, I never looked back, and never built a car like that again.

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Wouldn't he just be exercising his first amendment rights to play his stereo on a public street?

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The harm that was cited above, is stress. Perhaps I could also persue a civil suit?

I ask no more from these punks or anyone else, than I am willing to give. Respect. I turn my radios down when I get into a neighborhood, I expect the same. There are people of all types here, they work days, afternoons, midnights, everything. Someone here is always asleep.

Is it so hard to reach down and touch a button, or to turn down a dial? Whats wrong here, is not that we have to live in a nanny state, it is that you may indeed have to resort to the police and the courts to get someone to turn down a radio, or dim their lights.

I have no problem pressing charges, up to and including having them locked up, and their vehicle impounded over this. If I have to ask the legislature to create new laws to do it. They can tell us not to have tinted windows, and ground effect lights, neither of which affect, or cause distress to others, then they can also regulate the volume of some belligerent young punk.

I too have a nice radio in my car, 3, 12" woofers, 12 speakers, 3 amps, around 3000 watts+, but when I go into a neighborhood, I turn it down, its not hard, I reach down, and turn the dial. Simple. Im not asking too much.

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stainless1911 wrote:

-snip-

If I have to ask the legislature to create new laws to do it.

-snip-

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Really? You would pass more laws just because you are pissed off?

If everyone did that ............. wait, entirely too many have already done that which is how we got laws passed by folks who are pissed off about guns!

Not knocking you personally.... just pointing out the "slippery slope".

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You could just go and see how he likes the taste of your Stainless1911's barrel and slide.

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stainless1911 wrote:

I live in a trailer park, and I have this guy who will come and go several times a day even at 2 or 3 in the morning, and he shakes the whole neighborhood with his car stereo. I have given him several written requests to keep it down, I have asked the trailer park management a couple times to intervene, and I have had the police to their house twice this month.

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Maybe you should try writing it on a brick and leaving iton his backseat (via his back glass),After replacing that backglass a few times he might just stop blasting the radio. Jerry! Jerry!

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The radios actually don't bother me that much but I would like to know if it is illegal to have a muffler on a Harley. If there is one of them in front of me and I were to need to do some defensive driving to keep form hitting it I don't know if I can. Sitting at a stop light with a Harley right in front of me is worse than any car radio I have ever heard.

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there was a pretty epic south park episode about Harley owners.

also, to answer your question yes harley riders can be cited for the loudness of their bike under the same ordinences that allow people to be written up for radios.

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http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(ni0hjryxxthkvs55b0odiare))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-257-707c

257.707c Noise limitations; prohibitions.



Sec. 707c.

(1) After April 1, 1978, a motor vehicle shall not be operated or driven on a highway or street if the motor vehicle produces total noise exceeding 1 of the following limits at a distance of 50 feet except as provided in subdivisions (b)(iii) and (c)(iii):

(a) A motor vehicle with a gross weight or gross vehicle weight rating of 8,500 pounds or more, combination vehicle with gross weight or gross vehicle weight ratings of 8,500 pounds or more.

(i) Ninety DBA if the maximum lawful speed on the highway or street is greater than 35 miles per hour.

(ii) Eighty-six DBA if the maximum lawful speed on the highway or street is not more than 35 miles per hour.

(iii) Eighty-eight DBA under stationary run-up test.

(b) A motorcycle or a moped:

(i) Eighty-six DBA if the maximum lawful speed on the highway or street is greater than 35 miles per hour.

(ii) Eighty-two DBA if the maximum lawful speed on the highway or street is not more than 35 miles per hour.

(iii) Ninety-five DBA under stationary run-up test at 75 inches.

(c) A motor vehicle or a combination of vehicles towed by a motor vehicle not covered in subdivision (a) or (b):

(i) Eighty-two DBA if the maximum lawful speed on the highway or street is greater than 35 miles per hour.

(ii) Seventy-six DBA if the maximum lawful speed on the highway or street is not more than 35 miles per hour.

(iii) Ninety-five DBA under stationary run-up test 20 inches from the end of the tailpipe.

(2) A dealer shall not sell or offer for sale for use upon a street or highway in this state a new motor vehicle manufactured after April 1, 1978, which produces a maximum noise exceeding the following limits:

(a) A motor vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of 8,500 pounds or more—83 DBA.

(b) A motorcycle or a moped—83 DBA.

(c) A motor vehicle not covered in subdivision (a) or (b)—80 DBA.

(3) A person shall not operate a vehicle on a highway or street if the vehicle has a defect in the exhaust system which affects sound reduction, is not equipped with a muffler or other noise dissipative device, or is equipped with a cutout, bypass, amplifier, or a similar device.

(4) A person, either acting for himself or herself or as the agent or employee of another, shall not sell, install, or replace a muffler or exhaust part that causes the motor vehicle to which the muffler or exhaust part is attached to exceed the noise limits established by this act or a rule promulgated under this act.

(5) A person shall not modify, repair, replace, or remove a part of an exhaust system causing the motor vehicle to which the system is attached to produce noise in excess of the levels established by this act, or operate a motor vehicle so altered on a street or highway.

(6) A dealer shall not sell a used or secondhand motor vehicle for use upon a street or highway which is not in compliance with this act.

History: Add. 1978, Act 73, Imd. Eff. Mar. 21, 1978 ;-- Am. 1978, Act 492, Imd. Eff. Dec. 1, 1978

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PT111 wrote:

Wouldn't he just be exercising his first amendment rights to play his stereo on a public street?

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Only if HE is the one doing the singing, otherwise, no.

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good point Al, I would prefer the radio to the singing:?

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Big Gay Al wrote:

PT111 wrote:

Wouldn't he just be exercising his first amendment rights to play his stereo on a public street?

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Only if HE is the one doing the singing, otherwise, no.

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How about if he was singing along karaoke style and using the radio and his accompiment.

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PT111 wrote:

Big Gay Al wrote:

PT111 wrote:

Wouldn't he just be exercising his first amendment rights to play his stereo on a public street?

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Only if HE is the one doing the singing, otherwise, no.

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How about if he was singing along karaoke style and using the radio and his accompiment.

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You might have a point, however, I think most people would agree that his right of free speech with super volume is at risk at 2:00 in the morning, in a residential area. And if it's not, then my right to self defense should include defense from hearing damage as well.

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I got a "loud stereo" ticket in Sterling Heights. Cost me $80 and I visited the SHPD so I could chat with the superior. I requested evidence of my loud stereo and I was told, flat out, that proof is not needed in the form if a decimeter. As the law is/was written; the officer merely needs to hear your stereo from a distance away.

"Mr. Bahorski explained the ordinance would apply if there were a car show or motorcycle event, however it would not apply to the amphitheater.

Moved by Romano, seconded by Ziarko, RESOLVED, to introduce an ordinance amending Chapter 31 of the City Code to update the City of Sterling Heights Noise Ordinance and specifically regulate the amplification or broadcasting of sound by vehicles and persons within the City."

http://www.ci.sterling-heights.mi.u...CityCouncil_2005&norelay_reset=false&NC=4185X

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http://www.sengpielaudio.com/TableOfSoundPressureLevels.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_pressure#Examples_of_sound_pressure_and_sound_pressure_levels

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I moved almost 400 miles north of Detroit literally in the middle of no where and we have these morons up here with their Ghetto 5000 watt stereo's driving around at 3 AM deliberately trying to pi$$ people off. Why do I say deliberately? When the moron who has absolutely NO reason to be on our road drives by 6 times in ten minutes, you know he's being a jackass. Calling the Sheriff does NO good because it takes them 45 minutes to show up. These imbeciles think it's really funny waking people up and I actually heard one of these morons brag about it, as if being a complete carrot was something to be proud of.

Now before my solution I will preface it with a little history. My first occupation is a sound, voice and data engineer. I have worked at many concert venues and have seen no less than a hundred concerts from Ozzy to you name it, due to my work. My bail work started as a holder of a Michigan State licensed private Investigator and owner of a security and investigations company. But my first love and profession is sound. So I get the enjoyment of loud music. What I don't get is the utter rudeness and stupidity of people who think everyone else needs to suffer their pathetic taste in music, or noise. There's is nothing more annoying than to wake up at 2 or 3AM to BOOM BOOM BOOM! in front of my home. Maybe he's lucky I am not one to have Vietnam flashbacks.. :lol:


There obviously needs to be some kind of common sense law, or a whole neighborhood confrontation with these morons. Sadly here I am the neighborhood here so it would only be myself confronting the jackasses. What makes it worse is I have a serious sleep disorder and I rarely get over 3 hours of sleep on average, and to have that robbed from me makes me see red.


I hate stupid..